$170,000 Debt Impractical?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Georgetown University
1

<p>So I was thrilled to find out that I was accepted into the School of Foreign Service (and obviously just into Georgetown), however, the financial aid situation is rather disparaging. Between what my parents can pay, and the financial aid I have received, I will have to pay $170,000 - the difference. I assume I will receive a few local scholarships in the coming month, but nothing over $10,000, and I will also be working over the summers nearly full time, but even after that, I am still looking at at least 150,000 dollars I would have to borrow to attend. </p>

<p>My other options I am considering at this point are American U (where I was accepted into the Global Scholars Program and the Honors College) where I would have to pay $88,000 myself. And then there is always the full ride and fellowship at the state university.</p>

<p>I am in love with Gtown, SFS, DC, politics, etc. and would probably major in International Politics within the SFS, but I just do no know if 170,000 dollars in debt is a dangerous amount.</p>

<p>I am considering working for the State Department/Human Rights Advocacy Group (or something in that field) after college and still plan to attend grad school. </p>

<p>So: how does one pay off $170,000 in debt from undergrad alone while working in the International Relations/ Political field? </p>

<p>THANK YOU so much for any advice you might have.</p>

2

<p>And if anyone has any idea of the salaries of Foreign Service Officers/ Non profit workers/ policy analysts, please post a link, or just share your wisdom on this thread.</p>

<p>Thank you again</p>

3

<p>Generally, the rule of thumb of what is too much debt is, basically more than the amount you will be making straight out of undergrad is too much. (So since you’re IR, more than 50k should be a deal breaker.)</p>

<p>But generally, 170k in debt for undergrad is life ruining debt.</p>

4

<p>Go to your state school. $170,000 isn’t worth it, especially in this economy and the job market isn’t looking too bleak. Just do well in your state school and see where that takes you. </p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

5

<p>I’m a fan of AU, but $88K is too much–as is $170K. Particularly for the field you’re interested in, no school is $88K or $170K “better” than another. If you go the state school route, you’ll have to put little time into earning money during college, so you will have more time to pursue things that will further your education and eventual career.</p>

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<p>It’s only money. Not to sound naive or impractical, but what if you die tomorrow? You only live once. Do what YOU want to do. If Georgetown is your dream then you deserve it. </p>

<p>Good luck :)</p>

7

<p>^ awful advice.</p>

<p>I suggest you ask around in the fin aid forum. No school, not even harvard, is worth the 170k debt.
Do you have any other options? besides Amerian U?</p>

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<p>Why would you listen to someone whose username is ‘square’</p>

<p>Okay 170k debt isn’t unheard of… Say you graduate and make around $50k a year. Live at home for a couple years or pay it off. 10 years = $500k. You’ll have $330k to live off for ten years or 33k per year. It’s do-able. Plus 10 years= age of 32ish if you’re healthy another 70 years of life. </p>

<p>It’s not impossible. AT ALL.</p>

9

<p>Smguevara, for someone talking about only living life once, you seem to have an unusual affinity for owing large amounts of interest-bearing debt to large corporations, thus forcing you to always be working and for as high a salary as possible (rather than for personal fulfillment).</p>

<p>A state school will have the resources you need to learn. You will receive as good an education as you are willing to work for. Graduate free of crippling debt.</p>

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<p>The only info I know is for a masters degree in IR: entry-level, roughly 35-65k. You probably won’t be able to live at home unless home is near DC or one of the major cities that support offices. Note that many say it’s having the masters that gets you anywhere. Consider going to G for that. </p>

<p>Most entry level jobs are surprisingly unexciting, while you pay your dues and establish your goods. If you do make 50k with only an undergrad degree, after taxes, that’s roughly $3000/month. According to the collegeboard loan calculator, with max Staffords and the rest from somewhere else, at 6.8% (you may pay higher,) they project your repayment would be about $1950/month. Even if I am wrong and you can land a higher paying position without a masters, that repayment is tough. [Student</a> Loan Repayment - student loan debt - college education repayment](<a href=“College Board - SAT, AP, College Search and Admission Tools”>College Loans: Your Strategy – BigFuture | College Board)</p>

<p>Also, a good IR future will require interships while in college, probably often in summer- if your interest is human rights advocacy, you can’t assume these will be high paying. If you were my kid, I’d tell you to call the school tomorrow and ask career planning (or whatever dept supports finding internships) for some info. Good luck.</p>

11

<p>@kinzer93 - congratulations on your acceptances</p>

<p>$88k is too much debt
$170k is too much debt</p>

<p>Pat yourself on the back for your acceptances, and then commit to the state school, knowing that you will graduate without crazy debt hanging over you. This will give you financial freedom for grad school. You will have good options again, in 4 years.</p>

12

<p>smguevara, lol. Yes, someone with the user name square must have nothing useful to contribute.</p>

<p>You’re being too optimistic here. 50k right after college with IR/polisci degree is a little too high no? What if you can’t find a job? Then settle for a ~25k/yr unrelated job at McDs?</p>

<p>OP, i understand it’s tough to turn down your dream school, but it has to be done.</p>

13

<p>Another option to consider.</p>

<p>Go to Georgetown SFS for the first year. Be creative. Talk to classmates in similar situations, and trust me there are plenty. Continue talking to the financial aid folks. Military officer programs may also be an option especially for someone with an interest in international affairs. Figure out for yourself if the following three years and the opportunities are worth the money and if you can really afford it. Reassess after the first year. If after the first year you don’t think it’s worth it then transfer your credits to a more affordable school (at least Georgetown will be on your CV), you will have experienced the school, and you will have made some new friends.</p>

<p>If you decide to stay four years consider getting a part time job during the school year, military options, or spending your first two or three years out of undergraduate working in banking in NYC or some other financial center. Use your bonuses to put a significant dent in your debt. The Foreign Service will always be there for you anyway. It is often a third or fourth career for a lot of people after banking, consulting, military, or law. So if you start off in banking or consulting you can always move into the foreign service, say, in your 30s.</p>

<p>If this is your dream do not give up so easily. If there is a will there is a way, albeit not always traditional. Give yourself a chance knowing you can always transfer.</p>

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<p>Similar question, but does anyone have an opinion on how reasonable 40K in debt is (also for Georgetown)? I know the standard is usually around 22, so I’m not sure if the extra 5 per year is worth it.</p>

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<p>SMGuevara also has an excellent point.</p>

<p>Debt is not a dirty word if you are making a wise investment with it.</p>

<p>Interest rates are at an all time low. Over the course of your life you will easily pay off 170k. Also, the value of the US dollar continues to decline. A Georgetown degree is a lifetime investment you will be proud of. </p>

<p>Even if it only translates to a salary 5k above someone from AU or your state school, over the long run you will do better. It is a mathematical certainty that an employee that enters the workforce making 55k stands to earn $600,000 more than a colleague who starts at 50k, assuming 5% annual raises during a 40-year career.</p>

<p>Also, when you are in your 60’s 170k will seem like pocket change. There are a lot worse things you can do with a 170k loan than invest in a Georgetown education.</p>

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<p>While I hesitate to weigh in on the financial aspect of this decision, I will speak from the position of one who chose to go to my state school for free instead of take on debt, and there are quite a few more negatives than previous posters have acknowledged.</p>

<p>One important thing to consider is your intended major. Ideally I would like to study International Political Economy, however the closest my current school comes to this is a dual degree in Global & International Studies and Economics. These two majors have tough requirements in their own right that don’t match up particularly well, and I feel that my education is going to suffer for it.</p>

<p>Another thing to consider is the prevalence of like-minded students at the school. While there are some internationally focused groups they are not very active and I have found myself instead very involved in the student group for a senator’s personal archive here on campus. I’m interested in domestic politics and enjoy my involvement, but it seems tangential to my main interests and development.</p>

<p>Lastly, consider the school’s level of familiarity with your major and career interests. I want to go into international development as well, and some days I could swear that no one here has ever heard of microfinance or ngos. It very well may be worth it to pay the money to have access to counselors and professors who can actually guide you in your future career, rather than floundering about, in the dark about what opportunities exist for you.</p>

<p>I don’t caution against state schools, but the financial aspect is only one part of this decision, and I would think about what you are getting yourself into should you decide against American or Georgetown. Just because you have the time to pursue opportunities doesn’t necessarily mean that there will be opportunities to pursue, and creating those opportunities for yourself is a lot more complicated than it sounds.</p>

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<p>Dear me, do NOT take out $170k in debt for undergrad, especially if you’re interested in government or NGO work. That is crippling and will really limit your options once you graduate. The average starting salary in government for someone with a bachelors degree and no or limited work experience is somewhere around $40-50k/yr, depending on the city and a few other factors. The majority of IR related jobs are in DC and NYC, which are cities with very high costs of living. So, $170k or even $88k of debt would make it really hard to live in DC or NYC (or anywhere, really) on $40-50k/year. </p>

<p>Many government and NGO jobs will require or strongly prefer a masters degree. The Foreign Service does not require a masters degree, but many FSOs have some sort of graduate degree and the skills and information you learn in graduate school can help you in the FS hiring process. </p>

<p>If you’ve got so much debt from undergrad, that will further limit your options for graduate school if you decide that you want to go to grad school. Furthermore, it is not necessary to go to school in DC to get in to international relations or politics. You can get many of the benefits of going to school in DC if you do internships in DC over the summer or a semester. Many schools have semester or summer programs in DC and even if your state school does not, you can always go to DC or NYC for internships over the summer on your own. DOS has a great internship program, as do many other international affairs agencies and NGOs.</p>

<p>Finally, getting in to the Foreign Service is ultimately about doing well on the FSOT and FSOA. I’m a Foreign Service Officer who chose to attend a state school for college and for graduate school and have no regrets in my decisions. Yes, Georgetown and American have good IR programs, but it’s not necessary to go to any of those schools to become an FSO. In my initial training class, there were people who had gone to UVA, UT-Austin, Texas A&M, NMSU, Ohio State, UCLA, Florida State, Texas Tech, South Dakota, UConn, Indiana, and tons of other schools. The point is, it truly does not matter where you go to school, just how well you do on the FSOT and FSOA and you can get good preparation for that at any school. </p>

<p>It’s also worth noting that only about 2-4% of the people who start the Foreign Service Officer hiring process by taking the FSOT actually get hired. It is a long and difficult process and many very smart and talented people do not make it all the way through for one reason or another. You may well be one of the people who does make it through, but it’s important to have other career ideas, too.</p>

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<p>Great post, Texan.</p>

<p>It is a mathematical certainty that an employee that enters the workforce making 55k stands to earn $600,000 more than a colleague who starts at 50k, assuming 5% annual raises during a 40-year career.</p>

<p>So, while OP is earning 50k, taking home $3000/month, he can pay $1900 for the loans and live on $1100? And, in the ninth year, when he’s earning maybe 75000, maybe netting $4500/month, he can afford $1900 in loan payments? All that work and now living off $2600/month? Assuming he gets a good job and keeps it. Assuming he gets 5% raises (no guarantee there)…and no corresponding increase in his own cost of living as he marries, has kids and buys a home? I think this would sorely test the emotional strength of most folks.</p>

<p>Anyone considering a high loan should read the fine print in the loan documentation. Especially re how interest accrues, the options and the lifetime of your loan. And understand how recent economic trends have flubbed everyone’s plans. On another thread, a poster suggested plumbing is a great career choice.</p>

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<p>so, how much do you think it will take to pay off 150k in loans . . .</p>

<p>because the debt load is NOT 150k . . . it’s that plus the interest</p>

<p>so . . .</p>

<p>150k
for 10 years
at 6% interest
= 1887 per month
for total payments of . . . $226,481</p>

<p>but the interest rate is probably closer to 7 percent
= $1974 per month
for total payments of . . . $236,861</p>

<p>maybe you’d like to payoff your student loans over 20 years?
= that’s “only” $1318 per month
for total payments of . . . $316,321</p>

<p>That’s an awfully big financial sea anchor to tie around yourself . . . could keep you from being able to buy a house . . . and imagine how much fun it will be to say “no” to an interesting job that will further your life tremendously, but may not quite bring in the money needed to service the loan . . . not to mention that one of the two main things that bring troubles to relationships is . . . money issues.</p>

<p>Part of what I’m getting at here is that it’s short-sighted to analyze this throught purely rational lenses . . . the psychic and emotional load of having large debt hanging over one’s head that limits your hard earned psot-collegeiate freedom affects most people negatively, and it’s an awfully risky thing to do to oneself.</p>

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<p>Why not go to the State school for two years, then go to Georgetown for your last two years. You’ll get the Georgetown experience and network after graduation at half the cost. If your state school is close to DC, you can still get internships downtown and gain good experience while at the state school.</p>