<p>Northwestern has roughly 8,000 undergrads and Michigan has 25,000. You're arguing that there is absolutely NO DIFFERENCE here?</p>
<p>Let's say that number goes from 25,000 to 250,000 or 2,500,000 students, are you going to argue that the per capita number makes NO DIFFERENCE? That the only thing that matters is the absolute number? Of course there is a difference.</p>
<p>Princeton's massive $16bn endowment covering a relatively tiny student body (under 5,000 undergrads) is absolutely NOT the same as the $16bn (same absolute number mind you) for University of Texas System's endowment which needs to cover the entire system wide undergrad student body of over 140,000 UT students. But according to the logic that the absolute number is the only one that matters, UT = Princeton, when clearly $16bn spread over 5,000 students is absolutely not the same as $16bn spread over 140,000 students.</p>
<p>the_prestige. State schools are partially funded by the state and obviously private schools are not. Michigan received around 320 million dollars from the state last year. How much did Northwestern get from Illinois? Endowments need to be far greater for privates than publics for this reason alone. With the huge drop in endowments in the past few months, I think you chose a poor example of comparing these two schools. Try a larger state school with a relatively small endowment.</p>
<p>Neither Michigan nor Northwestern have endowments of that size. </p>
<p>In your example, Northwestern's endowment is more impressive.</p>
<p>However, there are other factors in the wealth of a school. What are the restrictions of the endowment? How liquid is the endowment? What are the other assets of the school? Other income of the school? Economies of scale? What percentage of the endowment gets to students? How much is that in dollar terms? What are the liabilities of the school? The costs of running the school? What is the cost-benefit of going to a particular school?
What areas is the school strong in? Can you get a great education at the school? Does the school offer what I want?</p>
<p>So the_prestige...what are the answers to my questions?</p>
<p>The_prestige, endowmen per student should include undergraduate and graduate students. Not that it matters, since Michigan is almost three times larger than NU. However, I would say that Michigan's (40,000 students) endowment of $7.6 billion is roughly equal to Penn (20,000 students) or Cornell's (20,000 students) endowments of $6 billion or of Columbia's (25,000 students) endowment of $7 billion, especially when you factor in economies of scale and Michigan's public funding.</p>
Actually, everything that you cited also applies to why total endowment is not useful. I don't see anything that relates specifically to endowment per student in what you wrote at all.
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<p>If a donor restricts the funds for undergraduate financial aid purposes only, then the university can only extract money from that fund only. WashU has like $435 million dedicated for fin aid within its multi billion dollar endowment. If you want student related and student specific numbers, endowment (which encompasses research, faculty salaries support, administrative cost, building maintenance, sports recreation athletic support) includes figures that is not relevant to the amount spent on students themselves.</p>
<p>As others have mentioned, public institutions also receive some measure of support from the state (albeit perhaps not what it was decades ago), so their endowments don't need to be as large as privates.</p>
<p>All things being equal, I agree that for two endowments of the same size that, yes, endowment per student probably becomes more relevant. However, I don't believe that you can compare a smaller overall endowment but higher per student with a much larger (but smaller per student) overall endowment due to economies of scale and raw overall economic strength of a much greater endowment. The ability to finance large construction projects, bring in star faculty, and fund many programs is more a function of the overall endowment strength than a per student number. </p>
<p>As an aside, it's funny you mention Princeton vs. UT as an example. Just an anecdote showing why total endowment or endowment per student don't always tell the full story: </p>
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[quote=]
Increasingly, Princeton curators have found themselves standing glumly on the sidelines. “Because we don’t have a lot of money, dealers don’t even bother to come,” says Primer. </p>
<p>Horowitz confirms that. He did not call Princeton about the Mailer papers. Why bother? He knew that Princeton almost certainly would not match the kind of money he could expect to get from the Ransom Center [at UT-Austin].
<p>"If a donor restricts the funds for undergraduate financial aid purposes only, then the university can only extract money from that fund only. WashU has like $435 million dedicated for fin aid within its multi billion dollar endowment. If you want student related and student specific numbers, endowment (which encompasses research, faculty salaries support, administrative cost, building maintenance, sports recreation athletic support) includes figures that is not relevant to the amount spent on students themselves."</p>
<p>Um... i know endowments are restricted to particular aspects of a university.However, I still do not see a single reason why this factor particularly discounts endowment/student as a valid means of comparison while supporting the use of total endowment. If the parts are restricted, then the whole is partly restricted too. Also, I mentioned the POTENTIAL money going towards students in my earlier post.</p>
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However, there are other factors in the wealth of a school. What are the restrictions of the endowment? How liquid is the endowment? What are the other assets of the school? Other income of the school? Economies of scale? What percentage of the endowment gets to students? How much is that in dollar terms? What are the liabilities of the school? The costs of running the school? What is the cost-benefit of going to a particular school?
What areas is the school strong in? Can you get a great education at the school? Does the school offer what I want?</p>
<p>So the_prestige...what are the answers to my questions?
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<p>There are other factors to consider? Really? Who knew? Of course there are other factors to consider when discussing endowments. But, wait a minute, aren't you totally shifting the discussion here? Who said anything about analyzing endowments from every single possible level? I wasn't. </p>
<p>Let's take a step back here, did I ever claim that endowment per capita was the ONLY factor that mattered? No. I never did. You see, folks, this is your classic strawman argument. Sorry pal, but you'd better find yourself a weaker debater if you want someone to take that bait. No, you see, my position was merely countering the single claim by others that endowment per capita was NOT relevant. I was never claiming anything more than that.</p>
<p>It wasn't like I was going around saying, "You know what little Johnny? In life, all you will ever need in your back pocket when you want to know anything about a school is "endowment per capita". Go ahead ask me. Best school for minorities looking to major in computer science in the Northwest? Endowment per capita. Best school for a country kid looking to expand his horizons at a big city university with a diverse social scene? Endowment per capita. Which girl should you marry? You guessed it, Johnny. It's all about endowment per capita.... Geez, I should send an email about this to Obama right now before I forget..."</p>
<p>So, I'd answer your questions if it were in any way relevant to countering my claim that endowment per capita is at least a relevant consideration, because that is all I was claiming. Nothing less, nothing more.</p>