<p>Because of the significant leg-up gained from checking a box on the Common App, no one in his/her right mind gives a damn about any philosophical justifications for doing so (i.e., checking a box).</p>
<p>Don’t listen to strange people who are trying to guilt you out of doing something that you can honestly and legally do.</p>
<p>OP, you are white. Being white doesn’t hinder you from going to college, and being Hispanic or black doesn’t really help the process much either.</p>
<p>If a black man with a 1800 SAT score and a 3.0 GPA applied to Harvard, he would still most likely be rejected. Think about that. Your stats have to be good enough for the college, not your ethnicity.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>This is untrue.</p>
<p>No it’s not.</p>
<p>Moving this to the Hispanic Students subforum so that the OP can get some facts, rather than emotion, about Hispanics and college admissions.</p>
<p>jewel, please read the following thread. While everybody has their POV about how admissions “should” work vis-a-vis URMs, here are the FACTS about how Hispanic is defined for the purpose of college admissions:</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/hispanic-students/641650-hispanic-latino-defined-aka-am-i-hispanic.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/hispanic-students/641650-hispanic-latino-defined-aka-am-i-hispanic.html</a></p>
<p>We’re all human. Being black or Hispanic doesn’t mean that colleges have to lower their standards or accept us because of our race.</p>
<p>jewel, he is Hispanic. There are white Hispanics. There are black Hispanics. There are brown Hispanics. </p>
<p>If his biological grandfather was Black, he can check off the African/American box.
If his biological grandfather was Native American, he can check off the Native American box.
If his biological grandfather was Asian, he can check off the Asian box.</p>
<p><a href=“http://latinostories.com/Latino_Facts_and_Statistics/Census_Stats_Latinos/Definition_of_Hispanic_Origin.htm[/url]”>http://latinostories.com/Latino_Facts_and_Statistics/Census_Stats_Latinos/Definition_of_Hispanic_Origin.htm</a></p>
<p>^
“Origin can be viewed as the heritage, nationality group, lineage, or country of birth of the person or the person’s parents or ancestors before their arrival in the United States.”</p>
<p>“People who identify their origin as Spanish, Hispanic, or Latino may be of any race. Thus, the percent Hispanic should not be added to percentages for racial categories.”</p>
<p>Multiracial students face many questions that pose this sort of dilemma; on the minority specific applications that I’ve seen where specific guidelines are given 25% minority qualifies. My personal opinion is that having a Hispanic last name adds weight to your claim because, regardless of what you look like, with a Hispanic last name you are most likely regarded by others as Hispanic.</p>
<p>The high rate of interracial marriage between Asians and Hispanics has created a group of students that are racially ambiguous - begging the question of whether any racial preference should be given for anything. In my experience socioeconomic status would be a better measure of diversification.</p>
<p>On the subject of race - I know Korean adoptees who don’t consider themselves Asian because they haven’t been raised in that culture. Their Asian friends do consider them Asian because of the way they look. My bi-racial children have been told that they’re Asian by Caucasian classmates and not Asian by some of their Asian acquaintences even though they have been raised with strong influence from both cultures.</p>
<p>Jewel - Do you consider Barack Obama white? Or black? Or is multiracial a separate category in your mind? Just curious.</p>
<p>When my children became aware of race in elementary school we had the opportunity to vacation in Hawaii. It was an especially enjoyable trip because there my kids were surrounded by people of mixed heritage just like themselves. It helped them gain perspective on their state side classmates who perceived more definitive boundaries.</p>
<p>OP - I think many students in your situation probably have inconsistent reports of their racial identity throughout their school years. Go and visit with your guidance counselor to make sure that your school records match what you plan to report - chances are when that data was entered years ago (perhaps over a decade if you’ve lived in the same district) that the options given were more limited since the previous census didn’t give accurate options for multiracial people either.</p>
<p>OP,
Now that you’re here, please spend some time reading threads on the Hispanic Students forum, particularly the sticky ones and those on NHRP. You will find excellent information and resources here from members with actual experience with college admissions for Hispanic students.</p>
<p>Don’t listen to jewel… by his logic neither George Lopez nor Eva Longoria are Hispanic because their families have been in the states for generations.</p>
<p>You can be both.</p>
<p>I also think you can be both, it’s part of who you are. Also, I live in Latin America and can assure you Hispanics come in all colors, shapes and religions. So don’t base your decision on “looks” to figure out your ethnicity.</p>
<p>By now it is ridiculous to pretend one can only come from one ethnic background. I think you should check any option you honestly think applies.</p>
<p>Indulge me…
My father is Mexican and mother is Caucasian. Who am I? What am I? Where do I belong? I belong to no group… these were the complex questions that came up in my life as a result of “checking the boxes”.
The boxes available in the 1970’s did not apply to me - really! It is not a simple task and it is certainly not something I think of as an opportunity or an advantage. I am forced to identify myself BEFORE anyone knows who I am, what I am capable of, or what I value. The agencies/people I disclose my race/ethnicity to have the power to admit/accept or deny my application. I always wonder if they are biased toward Mexicans. When I took my GRE in a computer center, I was asked to ‘check the boxes’. Did I get a different test? Was it scored differently?
We live in an affluent midwest neighborhood near a large, highly ranked university. Someone told my younger child to go out for track because Mexicans can run fast (from border agents) and jump high (over border fences). They thought it was funny. It’s not so funny.<br>
My kids work hard and excel in school. I expect it from them because others do not, simply because we have a hispanic last name and their sole experience with Mexicans is what they see on TV (taking our jobs, etc)
The OP who used the term ‘opportunist’ should be ashamed.<br>
I could go on and I might another time:)
Economic studies illustrating the benefit of a elite university education for disadvantaged and a study in which 2 job applicants with identical qualifications and experiences(one with obvious hispanic name and the other with an obvious caucasian name). They sent in their identical resumes (except for name) for the same jobs with very different results.</p>
<p>OK DONE!</p>
<p>Now - what is my child?
Father: Guam - native peoples
Mother: 1/2 Mexican, 1/2 Caucasian </p>
<p>Thanks for indulging me. And, hopefully, giving a little more thought to the real advantge of identifying yourself on paper:)</p>
<p>sorry - did not mean to kill the thread!</p>
<p>This thread typifies the reason I am sure many URMs do not post here. The defnitions of URM are set by the college boards, not the people on this board. To voice your non fact based opinions and to try to guilt people from utilizing what is available in the process, you are turning this into a political message board. Whether iyou 100% minority complaining about 50% or less minorities meeting the definition of URM or 100% non-minority, I find it insulting. You live in a democracy, exercise your right to vote to voice your opinions, not to misinform or intimidate people following the process to the letter of the law.
W</p>
<p>waitlistman,
My intention was not to intimidate, misinform or cause anyone to feel guilt. I apologize if my statement insulted you on any level.<br>
I was simply hoping to convey that identity is not a simple task.<br>
this thread was not intended to house an editorial - apologies!</p>
<p>sunnyone,
I’m not sure that wlm was referring to your post specifically. There was a lot of emotional misinformation being bandied about earlier in this thread because the OP was started on the general College Admissions forum, that’s why I moved it here as we try to keep things more to the factual aspects of Hispanics and college admissions rather than opinion.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>The Common Application asks optional, separate questions about ethnicity and race. They first ask if the applicant is Hispanic/Latino (Y/N); if the answer is yes, you indicate your background, from the following options:</p>
<p>Central America
Cuba
Mexico
Puerto Rico
South America (excluding Brazil)
Spain
Other----blank box comes up if checked (“if Other please specify”). </p>
<p>So, your child would check Yes and indicate Mexico.</p>
<p>Next, regardless of what you indicated for ethnicity, they ask you to indicate any race(s) that apply and background. The options are:</p>
<p>American Indian or Alaska Native (including all Original Peoples of the Americas)
Asian (including Indian subcontinent and Philippines)
Black or AA (including Africa and Caribbean)
Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander (Original Peoples)
White (including Middle Eastern)</p>
<p>It seems like your child would mark NH or Other PI (Guam), White (where ever the mother’s ancestors are from), and if it applies, AI or AN (Mexico). The last indication is debatable because the AI/AN category addresses “all Original Peoples of the Americas” which would indicate many people from Mexico, CA and parts of SA where a large percentage the population are a mixture of native peoples and European lineage. The problem comes because there is not the documentation in these countries as there is in the US with AI & AN tribes. And I know that some schools do ask for verification from candidates that indicate AI/AN on their applications. I have not heard anything one way or the other from adcoms on how they recognize and consider other Original Peoples of the Americas who are outside the US.</p>
<p>Sunnyone,
I just typed a reply but it got zapped cuz I was not logged in. Sorry I was away from my Mac and you did not get a reply from me on your post all day! Yikes! I did not realize by posting after you you would think I was referring to your post. In fact it was your post that brought out my own feelings of dismay about how some people treat others on this topic.
With little understanding of the process, and the posts on the thread were mean spirited in general and in addition were discouraging people from using a program that was set up for a reason. If they do not agree with it they are free to disagree but they have no business making people feel guilty for checking the hispanic, black or any other minority form just because they do not like the definition set up by the college boards.
Being married into a latino family as a caucasian I have experienced the prejudice from the other side, seeing my own family surprise me, and then seeing how my wife, who is a professional, was treated with less respect in spite of having a full degree from a superior school to many of her colleagues. So people should know that this small attempt to level the playing field for minorities addresses only a tiny part of the problem. The real solution comes from having people like my D and your S get into schools and prove themselves every bit as smart as the other students there so that the next generation suffers less than the current one. I think your post was sincerely felt and that is why nobody replied to it. And I think the thread is now where it belongs so maybe people will stick to focusing on their own problems rather than making more for us. 
W</p>
<p>Thank you WLM for the clarification. It’s interesting: what if an application were listed be SSN only? No names (sometimes easy to spot URM), or gender. Would we then be truly colorblind and decisions made on merit only?
Is there a board to post my idealist vision as a parent?</p>
<p>Sunnyone,
Well, I think for this board the best we can do is to utilize what is offered and in this case its not viewed as a negative or an unkwown But I understand that “checking the box” on other occasions is confusing and in some cases demeaning. It evokes all different feeling as you want to feel your being treated fairly. In this particular case its one of the few cases where you probably are. I can not say I think the idea of SS or some other less transparent method would be better, it could potentially serve to obfuscate things and make people even less sure how the rules are applied. The ideal is when America reaches a point where we no longer need these programs but I think your life experience and mine bears out that checking the box is a double edged sword and in some cases is a negative, but in this case I think its a positive. Our kids are very qualified and I do not see why anyone would begrudge someone getting into a top school with your son, or my daughter’s qualifications. I do understand the arguments against AA but I would still be in favor of this particular one even if I had an all caucasian child, I grew up in the city and I know that the kids they bussed into my schools did not get the chances that the kids from neighborhood did. They put a few token kids in honor classes just to make things look fair but it was a joke. Anyway, I do not want to talk about the emotional parts of this any more, rather just focus on the great opportunities we have given the successes we have been blessed with.</p>