<p>So I have some concerns about a particular major. I'm genuinely interested in becoming a pathologist, as everything about it is an interest to me, particularly the lab-work and etc. I'm currently undeclared at my university, but I'd like to get a degree in Medical Laboratory Sciences (MLS). From that degree, I'd like to go onto medical school and pursue Pathology. </p>
<p>So I took a look at making sure a degree in MLS would be suitable for pre-med, and there is a disclaimer of being in an allied health science NOT satisfying prerequisites for applying to medical school. I wonder why this is. First, I do understand that other allied health sciences, such as nursing and pharmacy, wouldn't satisfy medical school pre-reqs. But with MLS, it nearly satisfied every single medical school course requirement, except for 2 courses, of which I can simply take on top of my other classes. Yes, I've checked, I have the room for it. </p>
<p>I can somewhat understand taking a vocational major might be looked down upon, like doing nursing and then applying for medical school, with the concept of "why study to be a nurse to become a doctor?" Is that concept applicable to MLS and pathology as well? I understand that MLS and pathology work closely together. Is there something I am missing here? </p>
<p>Basically, why shouldn't I be able to pursue a degree in MLS and continue on to medical school? The courses should satisfy medical school requirements, without taking those "alternate health courses" (aka the watered-down biology/chemistry/etc courses). It can easily satisfy medical school, except that additional courses are all geared towards lab work, and my senior year would be an internship (at my university, it's 3 years courses, 1 year internship). Let's ignore the possibility of not going into medical school for now - it wouldn't answer my questions. </p>
<p>MUCH thanks for any responses.</p>
<p>Also, I have my reasoning for wanting to take MLS versus more standard pre-medical majors, such as biochemistry and whatnot. And it's not because it may be easier.</p>
<p>A MLS program may or may not accept the science major courses in lieu of the allied health science courses. This is an issue you will need to pursue with your advisor.</p>
<p>The other issue with taking a vocational major is that your commitment to medicine as a profession will be called into question by med school admissions committees. (Do you want to a lab worker or a doctor? If you want to be doctor, then why are you hedging your bets?)</p>
<p>Medical schools are looking for people with academic training and background. MLS won’t give you that and it’s something that the adcomm (being they are all academics with the strongest of academic backgrounds) may hold that against you.</p>
<p>A couple of other questions–will this major allow you the leeway to take the courses that new 2015 MCAT requires (biochem, psych, soc, math, genetics, etc.)? What about time to engage in bench or clinical research–which is expected of all applicants?</p>
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<p>This is because most schools have 3 “levels” of science classes offered: one for science majors; one for allied health majors; one for non-science majors. </p>
<p>Only the science major versions of these courses meet med school admission requirements. If you take the allied health science major versions, your application to medical school will be rejected for failing to meet minimum academic standards.</p>
<p>PhD pathologists are not the same as MD pathologists. A PhD pathologist is not part of the medical team and will do anything directly related to diagnosis or patient care. Depending on your reasons for being a pathologist this may or may not be ok.</p>
<p>Hey I am new to this website. Can someone let me know how to make my own topic for people to comment on? For example: I am looking at grad schools and want to know which has the best medical school program between Duke, Wake Forest, and Georgetown. Any opinions or thoughts would be helpful</p>
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<p>It’s not that it will be accepting certain courses in lieu of the allied health science courses, it’s that the requirements are already satisfying the medical school prerequisites. It’s not simply “biology, chemistry, organic chemistry, physics”, it is actual courses being taken by other biochemistry/biology/etc majors for pre-med. I would be in the same classes as students also pursuing premed.</p>
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<p>However, I’d like to be a Pathologist, not necessarily a doctor. I have no interest in being a physician. My understanding is that an MLS undergraduate background could be somewhat helpful in lab work that a pathologist would do? </p>
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<p>But how come? If the courses are the exact same as the requirement and not a substitution? It would satisfy 99% of medical school requirements, and I would take the last 2 courses on my own time. But thank you for the reply, it really does help.</p>
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<p>I can understand that, but what is confusing me is that the graduation requirements for MLS are nearly the same as the graduation requirements for biochemistry - a major many students take for pre-med. It isn’t an “allied health science major version” of courses. It is the same course number and all. And this is what is confusing me.</p>
<p>This is where my academic advisor should come into play, but are all universities like this? 3 levels? If so, wouldn’t they have different course numbers and simply be a different course?</p>
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<p>Could you expand on this? The differences? The patient care is a little irrelevant. While I would absolutely love to be helpful to others in need, I genuinely enjoy doing labwork, and from what I understand about pathologists and their job, it really does seem to satisfy what I would want to be.</p>
<p>MD pathologists: <a href=“http://www.ascp.org/pdf/thepathologist.aspx[/url]”>http://www.ascp.org/pdf/thepathologist.aspx</a>
PhD pathologists: [url=<a href=“http://www.nymc.edu/depthome/academic/pathology/programs/phd.htm]Doctor”>http://www.nymc.edu/depthome/academic/pathology/programs/phd.htm]Doctor</a> of Philosophy in Pathology, Graduate Pathology Programs<a href=“both%20of%20those%20links%20are%20the%20first%20hits%20on%20google%20for%20%22MD%20pathologist%22%20and%20%22PhD%20pathologist%22%20respectively”>/url</a>.</p>
<p>The short answer is that MD pathologists learn how to use our current knowledge of pathology to diagnose disease, recommend treatment, and evaluate the response. In surgery they may be employed to guarantee that the surgeon has removed enough tissue to completely remove the tumor. They also are in charge of autopsies to determine cause of death (and manner in forensics). </p>
<p>PhD pathologists do basic science work to learn more about the molecular mechanisms of disease and how they affect the human body.</p>
<p>D2 worked for a PhD pathologist (that was the individual’s exact title:Professor of Pathology) who is a faculty member at top research medical school. About 1/4-1/3 of the pathology faculty at this institution have only a PhD. Most are MD/PhDs.</p>
<p>The professor could not make diagnoses, prescribe treatments for patients and did not go on rounds. But the prof (and her students) did have complete access to all patient files, including tissue samples. Her research groups is involved both theoretical and clinical translational studies. Specifically the group does mathematical modeling of disease progression (cancer) and uses their models to predict how well certain tumors will respond to cerain standard and novel chemotherapies.</p>
<p>Oh, my apologies for having you two go so in depth about it, but thank you very much. </p>
<p>As to the original point of this thread, will MLS simply not be a valid major?</p>
<p>If your goal is to be a pathologist rather than a technician working for a pathologist I would say its not a “valid” major.</p>
<p>Do you want a PhD in pathology or do you want a MD and then a pathology residency?</p>
<p>For a PhD, the MLS will be a negative since it’s vocational and usually a terminal degree. It won’t provide you with the academic credentials for getting into grad school. (That year of internship instead of additional science & math coursework will be a huge negative.) I’m also not convinced that a MLS degree will allow you the opportunity to engage in 2 or more years of basic lab research–which is expected of all grad school applicants. It’s your PI’s reccomendation more than other things–like your GRE score-- that will get considered for grad programs.</p>
<p>I received a reply from my advisor about combining MLS and pre-med.
So a quick clarification is that here, at my university, MLS is considered a biology major, and therefore a science major. They have told me that while it’s not common, they have had MLS majors combine their route with pre-med. So, if I were to graduate with an MLS degree, it would satisfy medical school requirements to get in. </p>
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<p>Could you please expand on this? I’m not sure I follow. How are you not convinced I would do 2 or more years of basic lab research? And this is only referring to a graduate school, not a medical school?</p>
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<p>Definitely a concern of mine as well. I’ll be sure to discuss with my advisor about this.</p>
<p>Oh, and also, it’s more likely I would try for an MD followed by a residency, rather than a PhD. However, all options are open at this point.</p>
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<p>Do you say this from a technical point of view? </p>
<p>Again, thank you both so much for your replies. It is really helping me put a perspective on everything.</p>
<p>Applicants to both medical school and science graduate school are expected to engage in research–either basic bench science or clinical-translational. 2 years is typical. (Grad schools will expect 2-4 years of bench science research.)</p>
<p>When would you have the time to do this? Not during your senior year since your time will be consumed by your internship. Freshmen usually have difficulties finding a lab placement since they lack the necessary lab, computer and analytic math skills that would make them useful to a research group. Will your schedule have space in it during your sophomore and junior years to allow to participate?</p>
<p>I don’t understand what your question is to me. In case there is confusion over the term “technician,” in medicine, technicians are people who physically do/operate things but are not the brains behind the operation. If what you like most about pathology is cutting tissue sections or plating bacteria then an MLS is good and you can just be a technician, no need for med school and residency. If you would like to actually be making the diagnosis and from that tissue sample or blood culture and then collaborating with physicians on how to treat that patient, you need to go to med school and do a residency and med schools would rather you major in bio and take courses that overlap with the MLS than vice versa.</p>
<p>Let someone who is currently finishing clinicals and actually familiar with the field chime in here…</p>
<p>You could probably do research one of the summers of your junior year, but I wouldn’t say research is “essential” to a med school app. Most academic research (even in biology) is of questionable clinical significance anyway. Also good luck finishing in 4 years with this major. It usually runs around 140-150 credits at many places (if you include your 6-12 mos internship and classes in the credit count, but if not you’re still dealing with a lot of stuff to do! The good news is jobs are easier to come by than most pure “science majors” like biochem/bio/chem. As your biology friends all fight tooth and nail for $15/hr temp lab positions, you should have options for some decent paying full time jobs with bennies available if you do a good job. The ability to understand lab test results (which most healthcare diagnoses are based on) will certainly help you in a career in medicine. Honestly, a degree in CLS would probably impress an ADCOM way more than a biology/chemistry/biochemistry major, as the knowledge is directly applicable and helpful for further medical studies. </p>
<p>As for the classes, most of the time you take chem and bio prereqs with other science majors and compete for limited spots in the internship positions (i.e. most people that fail to get accepted into CLS end up just taking a bio/biochem degree). The prerequisites should cover your medical school prereqs (minus maybe 1 math class). </p>
<p>The field suffers from lack of visibility but some MLS’ do go on to become pathologists or other physicians (or sometimes physician’s assistants). In fact a lot of hospitals have a hard time keeping their experienced laboratory workers from moving into other managerial, medical sales, or medical professions as the pay cap in these other fields is certainly better, and the field provides a good educational base for these.</p>