<p>Hi, I am a high school senior and this summer I attended a summer program at St Andrews in Scotland. I decided to apply to go to college there because it's a rolling admissions basis and I loved it in the summer, and I found out that I was accepted this week! </p>
<p>I currently attend a suburban public school in New England and nobody from my school has ever gone to college abroad. I am definitely still applying to all the American schools I like, mostly LACs (I am probably EDing to Dartmouth or Amherst) but I was wondering how any of you parents would feel about sending your child abroad for all of college? My parents are very reserved and don't really tell me what they're thinking, but I know they'd have their doubts.</p>
<p>CONGRATS!!! As a parent, I would be both excited for my child-and a little nervous about them traveling so far to attend college. If it is any consolation, my daughter did attend Cambridge (England) during the summer of the London bombings-and she was fine. The school was good about communicating, as was my daughter. If you feel St.Andrew's program is the best fit for your academic goals-then go for it!</p>
<p>Study abroad is done soo much more now--back in the 70's,no email, expensive plane tickets, expensive phone calls--yikes, but it was still great! You will get few chances in your life (barring some unusual careers) to immerse yourself as a participant in another, foreign culture. Go for it! This chance, as a young adult (few responsibilities, footloose-fancy-free), is hard to repeat,and may not come around again. I spent my junior year abroad, and it was one of the best of my life (in England, Nottingham). Just don't hitchhike any more nowadays. You won't be that much farther away than you would be on another coast, which students do regularly.</p>
<p>It's one of my strongest ambitions for my first-year college son, that he go abroad and have some wonderful adventures.</p>
<p>Go for it. The only negative I can think of is that financial aid my not be as forthcoming at UK schools (since you'll be a foreigner) than it will be at US schools. But if you can afford to pay for it, then I think it would be a fantastic experience. </p>
<p>In today's world those who have spent time (I'm talking years, not just a few weeks here and there) living, breathing, and learning outside the US really have a huge advantage over those that haven't. Perhaps find a way of slipping that into a conversation with your parents at some point ;-)</p>
<p>My niece is there. Some things to think about.</p>
<p>As a generalization - the UK grading system can feel a little harsher and the ego can take a bruising. Be sure to connect with whatever writing system or coaching they have. (Back in the dark ages) I found that how Americans are taught to construct an academic research essay is slightly different than the UK way. So, forewarned is forearmed.</p>
<p>Comments heard from my niece. Much of the winter is overcast and windy. Some of the dormitories can be as much as an half hour walk to your classes. There are lots of international students there from around the world and she enjoyed meeting them.</p>
<p>If money is any kind of consideration, take a look at how much the currency has fluctuated in the last year. Try running your cost estimates by the different exchange rates. When you are exchanging large sums of money, a currency change of $.25 can really add up.</p>
<p>The exams for first term are after Christmas. If you go home for Christmas/New Years (and the campus does pretty much empty out), what are you going to do for the post exam break which is maybe two weeks? Are your parents willing to pay for you to travel around? Are you going to need to stay put?</p>
<p>The summer term ends later than the majority of US colleges'. Do you live in an area where all the good summer jobs will be taken before you come home?</p>
<p>Many students leave university housing after the first year. Try to find out what is a typical rent for some one sharing a flat. Typically UK house prices and rents are higher than average US, but if you already live in a high rent area it may not seem too high to you.</p>
<p>Which department have you applied to? Some departments are more highly regarded than others. I think the Times of London has a student area that you should search for that information. If it is one of the lesser departments, you would be better off at Amherst or Dartmouth. Shh! Don't tell her, but my niece would not have been competitive at those colleges. St Andrews is good, but not at the tippy top except for a couple departments.</p>
<p>This is about all I know. Try going over to the international board. Several of the students last year knew the UK system in addition to the US.</p>
<p>My oldest attends high school in Wales -- it has not been an issue for us, as parents, since we can call him very inexpensively and we also exchange emails and/or chat regularly.</p>
<p>The biggest negative for you will be the lack of financial aid -- as far as I know, there is virtually no financial aid for US citizens attending school in the UK aside from stafford loans (where the amount you can borrow is minimal). With the current exchange rate, not only is the tuition/room/board expensive, but travel and personal expenses are costly.</p>
<p>If the finances are not an issue, then I would definitely go for it -- you will get alot out of study out of the country.</p>
<p>I applied for Modern History and Economics...I think History is pretty high up there.
Also, I get no FA from any US schools, my EFC would probably be over $45,000 so actually, St Andrews is pretty much a bargain in terms of cost for us, at about $35,000/year compared to $50,000 for say, Dartmouth/Amherst.</p>
<p>St. Andrews is a very good school. Studying abroad will change you for the better! Sure, apply to others if you like (it is always good to have something close) or be happy that all the applying is over and done!</p>
<p>Just to add something about the grading system here in the UK to put it in perspective: 70%+ is considered 'first class', the highest level of honours. </p>
<p>So if you're used to getting 95%, don't get upset if you get marked at 65% - that's still very good! In the UK, students are not marked against what they <em>should</em> know about a particular topic based on the readings assigned - you will be marked against a theoretical 'perfect' essay written by your tutor. This is because you are expected to read far more widely and deeply around your subject than is actually assigned. That's why they call it 'reading for a degree' ;)</p>
<p>Also, don't underestimate the power of the exchange rate and just how expensive the UK is. Have you factored things like flights, rents, meal costs, books, stuff for your room, clothes etc. into your calculations? If not, you need to.</p>
<p>Oh that makes much more sense then, because at the summer program at St Andrews I went to, I had a final grade of 77% overall, but it was considered an "A". I get it now - thanks!</p>
<p>Any one know anything about funding for US students pursuing a PhD in the UK, it does not seem that the UK universities there fund every one the way US ones do; but perhaps there is some outside funding to be pursued?</p>
<p>I would also consider whether you plan to stay and work in the UK or return to the US. There are 2 issues I see:
1. Are you even allowed to work in the UK or are there visa issues? I know when we lived there for 3 years only my husband had a work visa through his company and I was not allowed to work.
2. If you plan to come back to the US for work how difficult will it be to find a job without good career placement help from your university?</p>
<p>A UK student visa automatically allows you to work for up to 20 hours per week during term time, and full time during the summer. So there would be no problem doing an internship in the UK (not sure if the visa would be valid in other European countries though, if you wanted to work elsewhere). 20 hours per week on minimum wage will NOT pay for your tuition though!</p>
<p>St Andrews actively recruits Americans and won't turn anyone down who will pay apparently. I once played against their cricket team and they were pretty much all Americans. Kind of bizarre (playing cricket!)</p>
<p>What I meant was working after you graduate. One of my kid's teachers is from New Zealand and loved working in London but could only work 2 years after university due to visa issues.</p>
<p>No it's not "like the rest of England", since St Andrews is in Scotland (if you said that in Scotland, you'd be lynched), and actually the degree system is fundamentally the same.</p>
<p>If you do a BA in England it usually takes 3 years, and a masters takes 1 year.</p>
<p>In Scotland nearly all courses last 4 years and you end up with an MA.</p>
<p>Either way, after 4 years you have a masters degree. </p>
<p>There are quite a lot of 4 year undergrad masters in the hard sciences in England. Or you can do a BA and apply for a masters separately. The only difference is that most Scottish universities do not offer stand alone 3 year BA courses. </p>
<p>As for working after you graduate, there is some special scheme for graduates of Scottish universities which allows you to work after graduation in the country. But you must stay in Scotland, which could be hard to do as most graduate jobs seem to go south. Anyway, google it because I am at a university in England so it doesn't apply to me. I only know that this exists.</p>
<p>It's a bit more complicated than cupcake suggests. Scottish students sit Highers at 17 generally. This is the basic entry qualification to university in Scotland. At this point they've had 12 years of schooling. You can stay on to do more advanced exams (Advanced Highers) and people often do if they are applying to English universities as these are regarded as the equivalents to English / Welsh / Northern Irish A-levels which you generally sit after 13 years of schooling. The first year of a Scottish degree can be skipped by English students with high A-level or Scots with high Advanced Higher grades as a result. The award of an MA is just traditional (Scottish science degrees get a BSc after 4 years so it's not even consistent...), and it's not viewed as a graduate degree just as an undergraduate degree. Proper Scottish undergraduate masters degrees like the MEng take 5 years rather than 4 in England. Complicated beyond belief really....</p>
<p>The key thing for Americans about the Scottish system is not to get deluded into thinking that American graduate schools will think an MA from St Andrews is equivalent to an American MA - they know it isn't. Otherwise the Scottish system at the ancient universities often works well for American students as there's less need to specialise from day 1 than in England, and highers seem to map better onto US school qualifications than A-levels do.</p>
<p>Cupcake's absolutely right about the political importance of not mixing Scotland and England up though! The SNP got into power with a promise to hold a referendum on independence by 2010 so it's even more sensitive than usual at the moment.</p>
<p>"St Andrews actively recruits Americans and won't turn anyone down who will pay apparently" - just wondering which Cupake is slagging off more - St. Andrews or Americans.....</p>