IPEDS can be useful for information on the number of students at a college who choose math as a “first major.” For example, see College Navigator - Williams College.
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I have no advice. But it is lovely that you see your kid. I hope he finds a place of pure contentment.
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Thank you so much.
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This is great advice. Thank you.
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@mikemac, you are the second person to recommend CCS— it sounds amazing. He’s definitely interested.
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@Twoin18, @InfoQuestMom, My son read your comments and now Cambridge is on the list as well. Thank you.
I know you can only apply to one or other other— but can you sit Step 2/3 and then afterwards decide to apply to Oxford (if Step 2/3 scores aren’t what they should be for Cambridge?)
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This is very helpful. Thank you. Are you saying that Pomona and Harvey Mudd together will have more advanced courses than a single LAC? We’d been looking at Harvey Mudd— in your opinion, would Pomona be the one to apply to?
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Have you taken a look at Pomona’s course catalogue? I’m no expert, but, I’m not seeing a lot of advanced math:
Mathematics - Pomona College - Acalog ACMS™
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Yes that’s exactly what you should do, though scores have to be declared so don’t take it just to see how it goes without substantial prep. UK students will have at least 1-2 months of intensive revision after mocks in Jan/Feb. Two 1s plus a strong MAT score and interview may be enough for Oxford whereas Cambridge likes at least one S.
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I second this list, especially UCLA, which has a phenomenal math program and is a great in-state option.
I agree with @ucbalumnus that LACs are probably not the best option for OP’s son, even those in a consortium. Caltech (~900 undergrads) is perhaps a better choice if he’s looking for a smaller school. Rice is also on the smaller side for a university (~4000 undergrads), although it’s not quite as strong in math as many of the schools suggested above.
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@Twoin18 What is the basis of your ratings? Have you/your child attended more than one of these programs? Are you basing it on people whom you know with math degrees? Published info? Would like to know if it’s personal opinion or fact based (which could be very useful). Thanks.
I did my maths undergrad and PhD at Cambridge. I know that program and Oxford well. The Berkeley vs Stanford opinion is based on the professors I worked with/know in Cambridge who did sabbaticals and/or PhDs there.
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Cambridge has a phenomenal reputation for maths. I don’t have the direct department exposure that @Twoin18 does, but I do recall when I was applying for a masters in a different field, a number of US students were applying to part III maths (masters) there as graduating from that was considered a significant advantage to get onto a top US PhD program.
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Bingo. My Oxford math son didn’t even apply to Chicago because of the core curriculum.
He also went to a HS math camp at Williams and found it way to “pure” for him so he didn’t apply their either.
I think both Oxford and Williams would be good options.
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@BeekMom- I don’t have much advice for undergrad but, from one math mom to another- I completely understand!
My DS did not find his “future” until undergrad but is now working on his Math PhD at Harvard. He will spend most of his spare time working on problems/proofs & asks for text books for Christmas/ Birthday presents. lol
I know this was not something you specifically asked about but, has he looked into summer math programs for High School students? (don’t know how Covid has impacted them???) He may apply and have a chance to visit another school, meet other students with similar math interests, and meet other professors that could give insight to programs to consider.
I wish you all the best for the future.
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Thanks that’s useful.
Pomona in itself does not offer too much in math, but Harvey Mudd does have a good variety of courses and many talented students interested in the subject. I mentioned Pomona in that context because it is a LAC and because of its connection with Harvey Mudd (all 5 schools in the consortium are contiguous).
Havey Mudd itself could be an option as well, I guess I did not mention it directly because I do not consider it to be a LAC (although I understand many do).
Just to add another school, University of Michigan has an excellent undergraduate honors math program, and all the resources of a major university. Very hard to justify going there, though, when Cal and UCLA are in-state options, but UM would be an easier admit for sure.
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The only problem with Harvey Mudd for OP is that - for its own students - it requires about of third of their coursework to satisfy a core curriculum - which is ironic. The OP’s son would quite possibly wind up having to take more humanities and social science courses there than they would at Pomona.
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@BeekMom, Williams has a robust math program, one of the strongest among LACs.
The IPEDS data on the number of Williams students majoring in Math is a bit misleading. According to Williams’ website each year from 2016 to 2020 an average of 64 students majored in Math (plus 17 in Statistics). I think the discrepancy is because about 40% of all Williams students graduate with more than one major. (Williams doesn’t have minors). Math is commonly combined with majors in Economics, Computer Science or seemingly disparate disciplines like philosophy, music or art.
For study abroad Williams “offers a yearlong program of study at Oxford University in collaboration with Exeter College.” Academics – Williams-Exeter Programme at Oxford
Other points of differentiation are Williams’ “Oxford-style” tutorials – one professor, two students; the SMALL summer program for undergraduate research in math; Winter Study (January term) which is an informal month of low pressure exploration.
Plus Williams residential “entries” in which a group of 30-40 first years live together under the guidance of 3-4 Junior Advisor, providing a ready-made social group for meals, events and hanging out. If your son wants to continue piano, Williams offers ample performance opportunities for non-music majors.
Williams does have distribution requirements (but not a core curriculum): Loosely 3 courses in each of 3 general categories: Languages & Arts, Social Sciences and Math & Science. The environment I would say is upbeat and collaborative, although the individual students tend to be academically driven. Faculty support both during the student’s time at Williams and for years beyond is extraordinary.
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He should look at math summer programs coming summer. Great for being challenged, finding community, and being immersed in math. PROMYS, Ross, SUMaC, Math Camp etc. are all great. I also feel that sometimes a big university might work very well since you can find different kinds of people. Our child was very similar and is now very happy at a big top 5 university. Also went for one of these summer programs and loved it .
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