<p>I don’t know how I can any more plainly quote her statement that the question provoked a personal response, not a source-based one, but was graded the opposite way. that is what she straiight out says. She makes no argument about the Regents part–it’s presented as a given. (One might disagree-- again, I’m not an expert on this–but she quite clearly says that we already know that–now this new thing is what I have recently learned and am basing this essay on.) I don’t believe that’s debatable–the rhetorical argument of her essay is clear–you can argue the substance if you know differently about the test than what she says–but what her point purports to be is clear.</p>
<p>I am not speculating on her points–I am reporting what she said.</p>
<p>Garland – you say, in your earlier post "If the test really is scored according todirect use or not of sources, and if the prompt doesn’t lead to knowing that that is what the grade is based on, then, yes, i would call that criminal. We’d have to see the prompt and the grading guide to know–if it is as described, I’d have a big problem with that. "</p>
<p>You keep saying if, if, if. There is nothing in her letter to indicate what you say. So yes, I think that is speculative. Yes, it would be nice to know how the question was worded. But given how easy NYS scores most tests, it really doesnt have a lot of signficance.</p>
<p>I live in NY. These tests are ridiculous and in my district they don’t teach to the test. Instead they, like the writer of the article, stress critical reading and writing. </p>
<p>The assessment tests have nothing to do with Regents exams at all. It’s used to grade the schools, not the kids. They give these in 3rd, 5th, 7th (now) and 8th, </p>
<p>Once in high school my district doesn’t teach to the Regents either. They take a week or two towards the end of the year to go over the material that will be covered on the Regents exams. </p>
<p>Imo, the emphasis on standardized tests, resulting from NCLB, has been a huge disservice to the children of this generation.</p>
<p>I understand the downsides to standardized tests, but if you get rid of all the tests, how are you going to see what the students know? All the state tests in VA are easy as pie. I’m also generally unclear on “teaching to the test”… perhaps because it is a derogatory term and my teachers never did something I would identify as that, but I mean, doesn’t every teacher teach to the test?</p>
<p>If a class in college has a final exam, isn’t it fair to say the professor is expected to teach the skills or knowledge to allow the students to pass the test successfully?</p>
<p>I took a look at the Teacher’s Directions for English Language Arts, Grade 8 from 2010 and 2009 on the APDA web site. </p>
<p>For Grade 8, on p. 29 of the pdf, the teacher is supposed to say, “In this test, you will be writing about texts that you will be reading. Your writing will be scored on:
how clearly you organize your writing and express what you have learned;
how accurately and completely you answer the questions being asked;
how well you support your responses with examples or details from the text;
how correctly you use grammar, spelling, punctuation, capitalization, and paragraphing.”</p>
<p>So if the rubric calls for 0 points for an answer that does not provide any specific details from the text, and 1 point for an answer that provides 1 detail, then I’d say that the rubric only implements 1 out of 4 of the announced criteria. Seems like a problem to me.</p>
<p>Kayf - my kids… Pulled out of Social Studies and Music so that they can better prep for a standardized test that will teach them nothing? No thank you.</p>
<p>I have also looked at the 8th grade Book 3 from 2010, which is available at the link cited earlier on this thread. Every question directs the students to give examples or details from the written material in support of the answer.</p>
<p>What I haven’t found are the directions and questions for 2011 or 2012. Perhaps the wording of the questions changed while the grading rubric did not change. (This has been known to happen.)</p>
<p>I was talking to the principal of local MS yesterday. There is lot of pressure on the FL schools to do well on the FCATs. The school gets its ranking based on this exam. Teachers’ ratings depend on their kids showing improvement. With all that pressure, I wouldn’t be surprised if kids were asked to miss music etc for a week or two. Even so, the principal laments how much of the curriculum is structured all year long.</p>
<p>If you look at the test, you will see that it expects the students to answer questions about the passage they just read and the author’s point of view:</p>
<p>These are examples of test questions:</p>
<ol>
<li> In the passage Rufus, the author describes Rufus as having intelligence and staying power. Using details from the passage, complete the chart below with one example of Rufuss intelligence and one example of his staying power.</li>
<li> The author of the passage says that he lost Rufus as a useful working animal during a summer heat spell. Explain why the author makes this comment about his dog. Use details from the passage to support your answer.</li>
<li> The author of The Gift of Reason says that few things have moved him more than his encounter with the sparrows. Explain the most likely reason this encounter has moved him so much. Use details from the passage to support your answer.</li>
<li> The authors of Rufus and The Gift of Reason are both affected by the animals they write about. How does the author of Rufus change the way he thinks about Rufus? How does the author of The Gift of Reason change the way he thinks about animals? Which author seems more moved by his experience? Use details from both passages to support your answer.
In your answer, be sure to · explain how the author of Rufus changes the way he thinks about Rufus · explain how the author of The Gift of Reason changes the way he thinks about animals · explain which author seems to be more moved by his experience · use details from both passages to support your answer</li>
</ol>
<p>I’m sorry,but can someone please tell me what is the problem with these questions? In a reading comprehension test, what is wrong with asking 8th graders to give objective responses? I don’t see anything wrong with telling 8th graders that this test asks for them to specifically respond to questions by citing facts set forth in the essays they are reading. This test has been around for many years. I’d say it is almost criminal to find that a veteran teacher didn’t know until know how the test is graded.</p>
<p>Kayf–In every post, I said, “if this is as portrayed by the teacher” it’s a problem. I deliberately did not say that I knew it was. It’s not “speculating” to begin from the assertions a writer makes, but then say with caution that they may or may not be true. It would have been simpler on my part to say these things are true because they’re written here as true, but I was striving to concede from the very start that we’d need independent confirmation.</p>
<p>I guess that kind of careful assessment of what’s proven and what’s not is unfamiliar enough in common discourse these days that it’s easy to misconstrue.</p>
<p>But Garland, I didn’t see where the teacher stated clearly and unequivocally that the test and related instructions were not meant to also test reading comprehension. All I see is her rantings that the test should teach what she taught.</p>
<p>Please show me where the teacher stated clearly that the test and related instructions were what she implies they were.</p>
<p>shadow1-- I think that’s the 2010 test that you are referring to. I have not been able to find the 2011 or 2012 tests online. I did find information that the test had been revamped for 2011. So it is possible that the instructions no longer say that the students have to cite specific examples from the text, while the scoring rubric is unchanged.</p>
<p>garland–You might be amused by an experience that my spouse had when showing up for jury duty. The prosecutor announced that in his experience, college faculty liked to consider multiple possibilities, and therefore he didn’t want them on the jury! (Peremptory challenge) I understood you to be using the “professorial if,” i.e., this has been asserted in one source, but in the absence of independent confirming evidence, one writes "if . . . "</p>
<p>Quantmech, maybe the prosecutor was just trying to be polite, and really thought that college professors are in general uber liberal and will not consider any one else’s opinion.</p>
<p>Kayf–I quoted the relevant sections already.</p>
<p>Quantmech–thank you.</p>
<p>Kayf–yes. that’s exactly it–my understanding of basic linguistics and the rhetoric of discussion is totally politically based. That definitely clears up the problem here.</p>
<p>All that matters, it turns out, is that you cite two facts from the reading material in every answer. That gives you full credit. You can compose a “Gettysburg Address” for the 21st century on the apportioned lines in your test booklet, but if you’ve provided only one fact from the text you read in preparation, then you will earn only half credit. In your constructed response—no matter how well written, correct, intelligent, noble, beautiful, and meaningful it is—if you’ve not collected any specific facts from the provided readings (even if you happen to know more information about the chosen topic than the readings provide), then you will get a zero.</p>
<p>And here’s the really scary part, kids: The questions you were asked were written to elicit a personal response, which, if provided, earn you no credit. </p>
<hr>
<p>So please tell me where the teacher clearly states that the test and related instructions were not meant to also test reading comprehension.</p>
<p>The teacher asserts that if the student answers the prompt using a personal response with no “facts” from the passage, no credit will be given. I question this because the testing guide shows that the student will receive one point (out of four) even if the student uses “no details or irrelevant details [from the text] to support the response “.</p>
<p>In any case, the test asks the student to use “details” and “examples” from the passage to support their answer. That’s what I want my kids to be tested on. If a teacher is only interested in teaching personal response type of writing that shows the students’ creativity, imagination, and honesty, that’s a crime in my book. Students need much more than that in order to be ready for college or career.</p>
<p>What the teacher said was as follows “The questions you were asked were written to elicit a personal response, which, if provided, earn you no credit.” To me, that it is a very ambiguous statement. If the questions were written so as to ask the student to think about the material and not just repeat it, some might say that is is personal response. It doesn’t exclude actually using the material presented.</p>
<p>Costblog, the instructions for teachers for the 2011 8th grade ELA provide as follows:</p>
<p>Short-Response and Extended-Response Scoring</p>
<p>The short response questions will be scored individually, each question scores a 0,1,2.
The extended response will be scored holistically 0,1,2,3,4.</p>
<p>Scores for all of the constructed responses are based on evidence of the following
qualities:</p>
<p>• Meaning—the extent to which the response exhibits sound
understanding, interpretation, and analysis of the task and text
• Development—the extent to which ideas are supported through the use
of specific, accurate, and relevant evidence from the text
Scores for the extended-responses are also based on evidence of the following
qualities:
• Organization—the extent to which the response exhibits direction, shape,
and coherence
• Language Use—the extent to which the response exhibits clear and
effective use of vocabulary and sentence structure</p>
<hr>
<p>I couldn’t find the 2012 material (and it is not clear to me if writer is complaining about the 2011 or the 2012), but from this is it clear that the test is supposed to cover reading comprehension. </p>
<p>QuantMech:
You are right; the 2010/11 test, which I believe was given in the spring, 2011, does not seem to be available.
If I see it later on, I will revisit this site and post the link.
Here is the link that shows the changes in the test beginning in 2011. I didn’t see anything the looked unfair.</p>
<p>My main point here is that there appears to be no legitimate reason for an English teacher to use words like criminal in this matter. For a teacher to use that language and have the reader try to parse her words to see whether there is any justification for that language is a disgrace. How can one who doesn’t write well teach writing?</p>
<p>For those of you not from New York, who are interested in this topic, I’d like to explain some of the tests we have in the NYS school system.<br>
New York expects its students to pass Regents exams, which test the particular course the students have just taken (e.g., American history, chemistry). The test that the teacher is complaining about is an assessment test, which I understand is designed to allow parents to compare school districts and to show how the school district is performing.</p>
<p>In the New York suburban school districts, many of the better schools think that these assessment tests are a waste of time. I don’t find a lot of angst or concern about the assessments. Our daughter is now a high school senior. I can honestly say that I never knew or cared how she did on these tests.</p>
<p>The Regents exam is another story. Those grades are important because they are included in your grades. The complaint of many parents (and teachers) is that the Regents has been “dumbed down”. So in a lot of suburban schools, the schools do not teach to the Regents level because it is not challenging enough. In those schools, for a lot of students, the Regents exam is easier than the curriculum they are learning. </p>
<p>There are so many repairs that should be made to this system but I don’t think there is a political consensus to do so.</p>