<p>Since I seem to have inadvertently hijacked this thread, I think I'll take the opportunity to point out that this was to help someone decide between the business schools at USC and UC Berkeley, not between USC and UCLA, or between USC, NYU, and UCLA. Maybe we should either start our own thread or else get back to the original question (although based upon the fun comments, I kind of like the "start out own thread" option):-)</p>
<p>hay thats a good idea.</p>
<p>you know, if your talented enough to get into haas, you are talenetd enough to do what you want and still be a success. JSR, with that said i believe you can do what you want going to either haas or Marshall. go with yur gut, try and visist both to see where you really fit. DO NOT let undergrad competition be a factor in your decision and DO NOT let the grading curves be a factor in your decision.</p>
<p>but dont have any illusions: haas is haas, and Marshall (despite a powerful alumni base) has yet to truly establish itself as one of those name brand b-schools like wharton and stern. either way, both will get you a fine first job.</p>
<p>in addition, i strongly do not recommend taking most of the informnation posted here as good information. pm me, i wouldnt mind letting you know what Marshall has to offer you.</p>
<p>Consider the quality of both programs,
Haas.</p>
<p>prestige of the programs,
Haas.</p>
<p>prestige of the universities,
Berkeley.</p>
<p>opportunities for jobs,
Haas - great placement, better deeper A-list of recruiters
Marshall is just as good in SoCal, Haas is better everywhere else.</p>
<p>and opportunities for grad school
Haas</p>
<p>Other notes:
-grading has gotten a little easier at Cal.
-Haas has a very intimate college experience, small-school feel in a big school, best of both worlds.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Consider the quality of both programs,
Haas.</p>
<p>prestige of the programs,
Haas.</p>
<p>prestige of the universities,
Berkeley.
[/quote]
mmmm...it's debatable, but i'll give it to you. USnwr has ug haas and marshall at #3 and #9, respectively and #20 and #30 overall
[quote]
and opportunities for grad school
Haas
[/quote]
mm..Again, arguable, but i'll hand haas the edge..
[quote]
opportunities for jobs,
Haas - great placement, better deeper A-list of recruiters
Marshall is just as good in SoCal, Haas is better everywhere else.
[/quote]
You're wrong: Marshall stumps Haas in this arena. I challenge you to find proof that Haas' ug list of recruiters outmatches that of Marshall. Even businessweek gives marshall a better grade in job placement.</p>
<p>And marshall is not only good in so cal, but nationally. I don't know where Haas stands nationally (don't care), but marshall is not only "just as good in SoCal" but it stomps haas to the ground in our backyard.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Other notes:
-grading has gotten a little easier at Cal.
-Haas has a very intimate college experience, small-school feel in a big school, best of both worlds.
[/quote]
I don't know if that's true b/c i don't attend cal and i don't care, but:</p>
<p>I guess the easier grade curve at Cal can be seen as a really good thing if you're one to shy away from competition and look for the easy grade...</p>
<p>About the intimate college experience-i understand the desire for a small class setting, but wouldn't a larger business class be good since it leads to more expansive networking? (pretty important in BA major)</p>
<p>Lastly as mentioned before, networking is KEY in a major like business. Sure, prestige is nice (esp. in majors like medicine, law, etc), but ultimately, you gotta ask: will my future business employer care that marshall's 2006 ug ranking in usnwr is 6 slots lower than haas', out of the over 400 b-schools in America? or will that alumni connection be more of a factor?</p>
<p>Certain top national (east coast) recruiters make only two stops on the west coast, Berkeley and Stanford. Someone mentioned Lazard Freres; there are many other employers with that profile. I know that from recent Haas undergraduates who went through company presentations in 2004.</p>
<p>The curve at Haas still isn't all that easy, but it's far from cutthroat. The business school setting and the Haas building and classrooms are pretty nice and posh, on par with or better than those from top private schools. Classroom sizes are small (classrooms at Haas only have ~34 seats), but the undergraduate class is large enough (260 undergrads/yr.)</p>
<p>Haas' stature in the business community ensures solid placement. to give you an idea, macroeconomics is taught by the Chief Economist from the Bank of America. Other classes on macro and the regulatory environment are taught by the head of the Federal Reserve Bank of SF. VC seminars are taught by the founding partner of the top law firm in Silicon Valley. Some of the lecturers in that class included the top 10 venture capitalists in the world, people who have founded/funded companies like Cisco, EBay, Yahoo and so forth. In my marketing class, we discussed Gap's strategy in one class session, and had Don Fisher (CEO of Gap, Cal grad and a client of our marketing prof) on the next class session to offer his insights on their strategy, fielding questions from the 34 students in the classroom.</p>
<p>You know, CalX, this is one of the main reasons to attend a great school like Haas--the quality of the professors. </p>
<p>I remember when I went to UCLA's Anderson school (a lot of years ago), one of my professors (Granfield) had been the Chief Economic Advisor to President Ford the previous year (before Ford was voted out of office), and another professor (E. Buffa) was one of three keynote speakers (along with President Reagan and the Chairman of GM at an APICS conference I attended five years later), and my thesis advisor (G. Steiner) essentially invented the concept of strategic planning and the SWOT analysis model (strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, threats). </p>
<p>On the other hand, one of my older friends had me beat--he went to MIT and had Professor Samuelson--who won the Nobel Prize in Economics--while he was taking his upper-level econ class.</p>
<p>P.S. I'll leave it to others to discuss the quality of professors at USC. I'm sure they rank highly as well--but I'd like to hear examples if you have some.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Even businessweek gives marshall a better grade in job placement.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Excuse me... I thought that grade was a survey...</p>
<p>H
A
S
S</p>
<p>all i have to say</p>
<p>I had two Nobel lecturers at Cal, both in Econ, but the best econ class was that of the chief economist from the BofA.</p>
<p>
</a>
Here's an outdated and incomplete list of who recruits at USC. Keep in mind this is for the 2003-2004 schoolyear, and i guarantee you the list has grown since then.</p>
<p>I'm too lazy to look up Haas', but someone feel free to do so and post it.
[quote]
Haas' stature in the business community ensures solid placement. to give you an idea, macroeconomics is taught by the Chief Economist from the Bank of America. Other classes on macro and the regulatory environment are taught by the head of the Federal Reserve Bank of SF. VC seminars are taught by the founding partner of the top law firm in Silicon Valley. Some of the lecturers in that class included the top 10 venture capitalists in the world, people who have founded/funded companies like Cisco, EBay, Yahoo and so forth. In my marketing class, we discussed Gap's strategy in one class session, and had Don Fisher (CEO of Gap, Cal grad and a client of our marketing prof) on the next class session to offer his insights on their strategy, fielding questions from the 34 students in the classroom.</p>
<p>I had two Nobel lecturers at Cal, both in Econ, but the best econ class was that of the chief economist from the BofA.
[/quote]
OOooOo..Ok, Ok, i'm sure Cal's impressive list of profs adds to the "prestige" factor and will make a great bedtime story for your grandkids, but how does that ensure job placement? Just b/c you were a pupil of so-and-so doesn't guarantee anything. Also, just b/c a prof comes in with awards up the gazoo doesn't necessarily mean he can teach, or even speak good english for that matter...</p>
<p>And yes, i can ramble about the accolades of certain usc profs, but i'm not going to simply b/c i believe it's pretty pointless.</p>
<p>check doostang for both schools and see what you'd rather</p>
<p>I appreciate all your comments. I do live in Southern California and there is a lot of USC pride here. For a long time I was only looking at USC because even though I knew that I had the ability to get into Haas, considering the facts, I thought it was a long shot. So I am very proud of myself for being accepted, and I appreciate your congratulatory remarks.</p>
<p>Let's say that I apply for a job after graduating from Haas, and the person that makes the final decision is a USC graduate. Do you think that if it comes down to me and a USC alumnus, the employeer would hire the fellow Trojan despite the prestige of Haas? </p>
<p>What do you guys and gals think?</p>
<p>Congrats on being able to have that choice JSR. </p>
<p>About your question, if you're applying for a job with the most prestigious consulting company in the world, McKinsey, the person that makes the final decision is not likely to be a USC grad. McKinsey (aka "The Firm") doesn't even recruit at USC. They've recruited at Cal for decades. McKinsey is not the only top firm that doesn't stop at USC.</p>
<p>The person making the final decision at a Haas interview is more likely to be a Cal alum than a USC alum. The way it usually works is that they set quotas from each school before their recruiting cycle and pick that number of students from their target campus.</p>
<p>Trojanman: it's not just a matter of prestige, the Haas faculty is plain better. A big part of the quality of the education received is a function of the quality of the faculty.</p>
<p>"Congrats on being able to have that choice JSR.</p>
<p>About your question, if you're applying for a job with the most prestigious consulting company in the world, McKinsey, the person that makes the final decision is not likely to be a USC grad. McKinsey (aka "The Firm") doesn't even recruit at USC. They've recruited at Cal for decades. McKinsey is not the only top firm that doesn't stop at USC.</p>
<p>The person making the final decision at a Haas interview is more likely to be a Cal alum than a USC alum. The way it usually works is that they set quotas from each school before their recruiting cycle and pick that number of students from their target campus.</p>
<p>Trojanman: it's not just a matter of prestige, the Haas faculty is plain better. A big part of the quality of the education received is a function of the quality of the faculty."</p>
<p>sometimes things are not so black and white.</p>
<p>first, if you want to work with mckinsey then haas is probably the way to go. but thats assuming you want to wokr with mckinsey in the first place. and frankley, your chances of landing a job at a firm like mckinsey is slim to none even if youre a haas alum. second, mckinsey does recurit at USC. they were listed on interviewtrak. so was at kearny. both have offices in OC and LA, where do you think those regional offices recruit? uc irvine? lmu?</p>
<p>dont concern yourself with the difference in recruiting bwetween Marhsall and haas if you plan on working in so cal. it really is trivial at the undergrad level.</p>
<p>ive said this 100 times, so im going to say it for the 101th time. finance here at Marshall is the same kind of finance taught at haas. acct here is the same acct thats taught at haas. Marshall undegrad/grad and ucla's anderson grad use the same course books fro acct and finance. imagine that. now, it doesnt matter if your prof is stephen hawking or the economic advisor of whoever-the-hell-cares. if yoru prof isnt willing to go the distance to make sure you know material, its uselless. great rearchers dont exactly make great teachers. lets be frank, uc profs dont exactly have the rep of being great teachers. thats common knowledge among cali college students. on the the other hand, Marshall profs are lknown to go the distance fro their studenst. regardless, none of thsi effects job placement.</p>
<p>if your still concerned about recruitement:</p>
<p>"The CPPC maintains an internship listing partnership with Stanford, Harvard, Columbia, Rice, and Northwestern universities. This gives you access to shared, national internship opportunities through the USC monsterTRAK system."</p>
<p>thats straight from USC's CPPC website:</p>
<p>
[quote]
great rearchers dont exactly make great teachers. lets be frank, uc profs dont exactly have the rep of being great teachers. thats common knowledge among cali college students.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Woah, hold on there with the hasty generalizations. The reputation is that SOME professors aren't great teachers; and to be honest, that's a common complaint at all top research universities.</p>
<p>im a transfer form ucirvine. believe me, i have a good idea of uc profs. and i mean uc profs in general, and the general uc way of doing things.</p>
<p>MrTrojanMan,</p>
<p>You think UCI is indicative of every UC? Gimme a break. </p>
<p>I had a buddy at UCLA who transferred from UCI to UCLA and said that the difference was night and day. UCI is particularly notorious for teaching issues.</p>
<p>and i just checked on trojan network. i searched for mckinsey and there is a mckinsey alum listed. basically what that means is that guy is volunteering his info so that anybody interested can ask him questions. thats a pretty solid contact right there. and i can search any firm you want. i can also search by city. mind you, these people make the effort to get listed on this network for the sole purpose of Trojans like me to wokr where they work, or atleast help.</p>
<p>"You think UCI is indicative of every UC? Gimme a break.</p>
<p>I had a buddy at UCLA who transferred from UCI to UCLA and said that the difference was night and day. UCI is particularly notorious for teaching issues."</p>
<p>ucirvine and ucla are particularly similar. i hear different thingsfrom my buddies. so just agree to disagree.</p>
<p>I don't think so. If you look at alumni satisfaction and more academic measures like peer review, the gap between UCLA and UCI is fairly noticeable. Not all UCs are cut from the same cloth, and different campuses are known for different strengths, particularly when concerning teaching philosophies.</p>