<p>My child is a junior in a very selective magnet public school that consistently ranks in the top 20 in the nation. So everyone is super smart there. She just received the score for her ACT. She's gotten a 34 which I though was a great score I assumed that she's done with testing. But guidance counselor told her that she should probably take it again and try for a 35. I think that's just crazy. She's going to be applying to top notch schools like Columbia and Upenn. But I though 34 should be fine for any school. She also has a 4.0 unweighted GPA with tons of great ECs and a varsity sport.
So I wanted to here what other parents think. When is it enough?</p>
<p>A 34 is good enough for any university in the nation.</p>
<p>How does your D feel about her 34? My bet is that she thinks it’s good enough. </p>
<p>I knew a kid who got a 36 on the ACT, even though he missed a couple of questions. But he wanted to take it again so he could get all the questions right. It was his own personal challenge. And he did, and was satisfied. He was not looking at schools as selective as your daughter, but with his AP credits, he was actually able to triple major as an undergrad and had outstanding research opportunities each summer. When it came to med school, he applied to most of the top ten Ph.D./M.D. programs and got into all of them. He’s just that kind of kid who challenges himself; I know his parents well, they are about the most nurturing parents I know, and this was not something they imposed on him. It was of his own doing.</p>
<p>She thought a 34 was good enough until she spoke to her guidance counselor. Now she’s confused. She was going to try the SAT just to see how she does but he told her not to do that but rather do ACT again. The problem is that she got 34 on all the sections across the board so it’s not like 1 section was weaker then another and can be improved on. I just think it’s splitting hairs at this point. I would rather she just concentrated on school work and whatever else she wants to do and relax about the tests.</p>
<p>I’m no expert, but if it was my child and she was applying to top schools, I’d encourage her to try it again. While I’m sure there are plenty of accomplished students with 34s who get into the tippy top schools, the students I know with 34s, perfect GPAs and very good ECs didn’t, whereas I know students with the same GPAs and comparable ECs who DID get in with 35’s and 36’s. Of course, I didn’t see their essays, and I don’t know the scores of all that many kids, so my sample is very small, but why not give yourself the best possible chance?</p>
<p>My D’s guidance counselor also steered students away from the SAT, saying that most kids (from our high school at least) did better on the ACT. However, until you take the other test you don’t know which one you’re better suited for, so again, why not give yourself the best possible chance by trying both?</p>
<p>Your D is a junior so there is plenty of time here. I would have her get through junior year and take another shot at it next June. Without much preparation if any. With another year of school her math and vocabulary will just be that much stronger and she may better her score. If not, she has the (excellent) 34 to fall back on.</p>
<p>Agreed. Wait until the end of junior year to retake. </p>
<p>I would suggest taking the SAT also…you just never know…it could be the better result for your daughter. Do that in May of her junior year. If its not so good, then don’t use it.</p>
<p>Did she take the PSAT as a junior? If so was her score high enough for NM consideration? If so, she will need to take the SAT, I believe.</p>
<p>Our son won a full tuition scholarship to Vandy with a 34. We were thrilled with that score (although he made the mistake of not including writing) and had to do the SAT as well. Since four years plus ago, I think a 35-36 is actually the score range of the top 25% of each entering class at Vandy–the shift is to higher scores. He was certainly no “smarter” than any of his peers. I think he won his scholarship based on personal references and essays. His ECs were good but not rare. No particular hook.<br>
So here is what I think. </p>
<p>I think it is very important that your daughter forget about testing for the ACT for a while. Celebrate the achievement. Instead, take stock of the big picture of the tasks ahead in her college apps. Logistically, you have a lot to do if she visits colleges, does alum interviews, reads up on each final list college, talks to her potential reference writers and somehow keeps her busy life afloat.
Discuss with her how she wants to use her time. I think free time is important…freedom is hard to come by for juniors and seniors. Whether she is working for $, dancing, taking on a musical outlet or a sport, nothing beats some empty hours when you have essays to write and reference letters to seek out. These kids also need time to breath because they are growing and changing a great deal between now and college admission day.</p>
<p>Several of the Ivies ask for three SAT Subject exams. Make sure she does an Excel sheet at home and makes columns for such details. Some colleges “like to get two” even if the ACT sort of suffices. Figure out how to get to some colleges in person to visit classes. Figure out which colleges want evaluative interviews and have summer only appointments that disappear and fill up.<br>
Her AP scores are coming up in junior spring. Try not to let her overcommit so she can be prepared for those exams (not easy! both of our sons has tournaments etc at the same time as APs).<br>
In other words, recognize the big picture of “requirements” by charting and calendaring. Our son actually took his SAT Subject test in Spanish after he got out of high school…in June. Because his AP Spanish was a 3 which didn’t signify at Vandy. He made a higher SAT Subject exam and exempted out so he double majored at Vandy easily. Each of his colleges had completely different foreign language requirements --so get that covered with her best effort.<br>
Juniors and seniors are expected to be leaders so they must always show up in their activities–this can be burdensome so have her make a list of this year’s essay questions at her top colleges. They won’t be “her” questions but they will get her thinking. Order and read Harry Bauld’s 25th anniversary book on college essays. She has time to rest on her laurels a bit. I hope she has some creative wind under her wings.</p>
<p>You don’t have to decide to take the ACT again or not right now. The GC is only trying to get her best offer by encouraging her to take it again since the ACT has score choice. If she takes the ACT again, project yourself ahead and figure out when she would be the least busy and have the most energy for the exam. There is no reason to take it unless she thinks it is a fun challenge to go after it again. There is no reason to be worried about the National Merit scholar unless it is connected with a better admission at your flagship or private school. You do get a discount at Vanderbilt but many top colleges do not offer financial rewards for that designation.</p>
<p>Things like Paid Work, Essays and doing your best for your school in your chosen activities matter as tipping points. </p>
<p>The ACT is important but that 34 will look mighty good if it also has strong APs and SAT Subject scores near it. In my opinion, creativity time, personal time and those subject exams are more tipping factors than hitting a 35 in a couple of categories.</p>
<p>good luck~</p>
<p>the 34 is all she should need. have her concentrate her efforts on other things - whatever ec she is passionate about or acing all her junior year classes.</p>
<p>Yes, 34 is pretty good. Perhaps consider ACT retake or SAT down the road, but not now. </p>
<p>DS retook SAT for the sole purpose of getting 690 CR score up over 700. For engineering that was not really critical, but he wanted to qualify for a particular scholarship at favorite college… Based on no extra prep but a year more of IB English his score improved to 790.</p>
<p>Brown is one of the few schools that publishes acceptance information based on ACT scores. The acceptance rate for a 36 ACT is roughly twice that for a 33-35 ACT.</p>
<p>[Admission</a> Facts | Undergraduate Admission](<a href=“Undergraduate Admission | Brown University”>Undergraduate Admission | Brown University)</p>
<p>Remember that a 35.5 rounds up to a 36, so a point and a half composite increase would do it. </p>
<p>It’s certainly not critical if she’s not interested, but admission to highly selective schools is a game of inches. Also, some schools offer substantial merit scholarships for tip-top test scores and the highest scores get the offers first. My son was offered a $15,000 a year merit scholarship for 4 years from UIUC, a notoriously tight-fisted public flagship. A 34 was below the cutoff, but at least some 35s won the award.</p>
<p>The 34 is at the 75%ile for both Penn and Columbia. That score won’t keep her out of any school. It will come down to all the other elements for admission.</p>
<p>Erin’s dad I completely agree with you. I’ve already been through this process with my son. He was a salutatorian of our high school with a 2300 SAT and 35 ACT. He didn’t get into any Ivy (he applied to 6) or u Chicago. I don’t know if his ECs were strong enough. Whatever he did he did it with college app in mind. And I think maybe colleges see that. My daughter on the other hand couldn’t care less about that. All the community service that she does it’s because she wants and enjoys doing it and doesn’t care if it’s going to count for anything. She loves working with special needs kids and thats what she spent all summer doing.
She also won some national marketing competitions. In my opinion this is going to count much more then an extra point on a test. But she’s surrounded by overachievers so if I know her she’ll try it again.</p>
<p>My daughter also got a 34 the first time she took the ACT fall of her junior year - she did not retake it. She did not apply to Ivy’s though. I think the advice of waiting is good - although if she is in Calculus or above she should go back and review geometry and algebra for the test. Sometimes kids in really high level math struggle a bit. </p>
<p>In retrospect - I think my dd should have tried it one more time. She prepped very little and got a 34. But if they are not willing to prep more it really is a waste. If your dd got a 34 across the board she would have to raise at least two sections to a 35 to get an increase - could be tough. I think having a well rounded score is very impressive.</p>
<p>wonderful students with 34s and 35s just like your son end up on the wait or not admitted lists in droves to the most selective colleges in the nation with No Loans and Need Blind admissions due to the press of high numbers of fully qualified applicants.<br>
You haven’t mentioned your financial need factors. If your daughter desires a private college with gazillions of applicants, this would be a motivator to get out the Red Book of Real ACTs and go in and do it again because a short list of colleges pay out financial aid without loans in the packages. As parents, we were sort of deaf to advice about financial limits and our eldest went to Duke full pay even though he had fab admits to our VA colleges. This decision left us with limited ability to assist in any way in grad schools. As a specific example, second son won merit at Vandy and thus had a legitimate alternative to UVA. I saw so many parents from Georgia at admitted students day in April whose children had perfect test scores, admissions to Vandy and no merit dollars who were upset that their children were going to have to “settle” for the exceptional honors program at UGA for financial reasons. (I sympathized with the parents…but have wised up since paying full price for one son to a great private college). It is so natural to close your eyes to the financial aspects of things when your darling son or daughter is so hard working and deserving. But best to discuss and take the long view with your 17/18 year old re their grad school dreams as well.</p>
<p>IMHO from experience, the best favor you can give your son or daughter is to actually visualize themselves in the honors programs at their flagship or financial safety college, and then throw in their hats for merit dollars. My sons would have attended UVA and WM and Mary proudly. I have lived long enough past these years to see the outstanding graduate school outcomes for students in the 34/35 category who took their flagship college honors paths and have money now for graduate schools. </p>
<p>ACTs of 34, 35 and 36 also need happy attachments to match colleges and long term thinking re graduate school loans and costs. Many professional schools do not provide merit dollars and most involve loans.</p>
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<p>Depends: </p>
<p>How much did she prep? Zero or hundreds of hours? </p>
<p>What questions/sections she missed? Math and Science are the ‘easiest’ to raise.</p>
<p>What were her individual scores? 36,36,32,32?</p>
<p>Was it a 34.25 or a 33.75? </p>
<p>How did she feel coming out: ‘Lucky’ or ‘gah, I coulda done better’?</p>
<p>did she take the W section?</p>
<p>Since she’s only a Jr, I need no reason not to retake (besides a Saturday morning of sleep).</p>
<p>The real question is what else does she have going for her. A 34 is enough to get past the initial hurdle. If her application would otherwise be strong (national level ECs, strong interest and accomplishments in something particular, etc. . . ) testing won’t add anything. If she’s trying for the “all-around academic strength” positioning, higher test scores won’t hurt, but it might be a better use of time to improve the GPA or take on some outside project.</p>
<p>A 34 may get looked at differently depending on what state she’s from.</p>
<p>Bluebayou, she got 35 on math and 34 on all other sections. She took ACT with writing.
She had some prep but not a lot. About 8 hours of private classes and very little prep at home. When she got her score she was honestly shocked. She didn’t think she’d do this well. Science is not her thing so I doubt she’ll be able to raise it. The only section she could possibly do better at is maybe writing because she didn’t prepare for it at all. Literally went to the test without doing any sections at home. We do have the red real ACT book at home but it’s like pulling teeth to have her do it. The reason I had her take it in September is so that she can prep in summer. I knew once school started she’ll have no time. The prep she did was for SAT critical reading/writing not the ACT. Science and math she kind of did at home by doing 2 sections of each from the book. If she actually did all 5 tests in that book I know she can raise her score, but I don’t think she’ll do it. She’s in IB English HL so maybe that will help.</p>
<p>My son also just received at 34 on his first attempt as a Jr. It is a great position to be in because it really takes the pressure off and I am glad he decided to try it early rather than wait until Spring. I am not sure if he will take it again, but why not-there is nothing to lose except the fee.</p>