Admission in Harvard with no work experience after graduation

Graduate School Business School - MBA
1

<p>Hi Buddies... </p>

<p>I would appreciate if some one can look over my concern of getting admission in Harvard MBA without any work experience after graduation.... However, I have good academic background with leadership skills...Here is my profile..</p>

<p>Mechatronics Engineering Graduate with 80% from University of Waterloo , Canada GPA:- 4.0/5/0
6 months of International Experience in Germany , TUHH, Hamburg
1 research paper on ... Ultrasonic Object detector for visually impaired personnel as undergraduate student</p>

<p>International Experience award of $2500
Alumni award for international experience $2000
Queen Elizibirth undergraduate scholarship $7000</p>

<p>I also have 16 month of work experience as undergraduate in the field of engineering... and apperently 12 months will be counted towards my engineering licence in canada...some of the companies I worked for are General motors and NCR... </p>

<p>Please I need some comments from other current students in Harvard University for adressing my concern over getting admission.... how would more work experience will help me to get admission in harvard...</p>

2

<p>Why are you so invested in getting around the rules? Why can't you apply to HBS in a couple of years?</p>

3

<p>Hanna..thanks for replying</p>

<p>I believe that its better for me to not give myself a break from studies for personal reasons... However, I have not given myself a hard and fast rule that I must study without having enough work experience... I just want to get idea about my profile, if it is competitive enough to apply for HBS after/before work experience..</p>

4

<p>sumair: OK, so say that you -- against the explicit recommendation of HBS that you must have work experience before you apply -- go ahead and apply to HBS anyway without any work experience. And get rejected. And so then you go and do what they told you to do in the first place -- work for a few years and get some useful experience. And then you re-apply to HBS. And on the application, in the spot where it says "Have you ever applied to HBS before?" you now get to answer "Yes, and I got rejected". And then they pull your file from the first time you applied, and they say "Oh yeah, now I remember. That's the one who couldn't follow directions". </p>

<p>Just sayin'...</p>

5

<p>


</p>

<p>There are no such "rules". HBS can admit applicants at will, and HBS writes on its web site that there is no minimum work requirement (of course; how else to admit the unqualified children of big-shots?). Yes, the chances are far lower for most applicants without the work experience, but there are certainly cases of unhooked applicants who make it in without the 2+ years of work after college.</p>

<p>These forums are not a satellite of the Harvard admissions machine and it's not the job of users here to enforce any rules that Harvard sets for itself. There's nothing wrong with anyone interested trying to get the full range of information available, including calculations related to chances, strategy, the exploitation of rules or "how to game the system". What the questioner does with that information is his own business, and what Harvard does with the applications is (literally) its business.</p>

6

<p>You are probably in the wrong place for getting much if any advice from current HBS students. ( at least you were before the thread was moved) Checking out the HBS website and calling admissions is probably your best bet. Your work history will not keep you out - in fact HBS just started a 2+2 program only for students applying directly out of undergrad schools.</p>

<p>However - you have made no mention of your GMAT, which is rather important - especially w/o significant work experience - and your GPA looks low. Don't exactly know how 4.0/5.0 coverts to x.x/4.0 (3.2 is the straight calc), but HBS 2011 avg GPA was 3.66 and the first 2+2 cohort admitted had an average GPA of 3.73. </p>

<p>From HBS web site - 1:</p>

<p>For the right person, now is the right time to apply</p>

<p>The emergence of an individual's leadership talent does not follow a pre-determined schedule. Though some applicants choose to apply after four or five years of work experience, many promising candidates are optimally prepared for the HBS MBA after two or three years of experience—or even, in some cases, directly from college. Ultimately, you are in the best position to determine whether you are ready to apply.</p>

<p>If you have thoroughly explored our Web site and think that HBS may be right for you, we encourage you to carefully review the Admissions and Financial Aid section. Begin with our Admission Criteria page and be sure to complete the Introduce Yourself form so that we can send you additional information relevant to your interests, including invitations to MBA Admissions Events in your area.</p>

<p>From HBS website -2:</p>

<p>Class of 2010*</p>

<p>Admissions
Total MBA Enrollment 900
Applications 8,661
% Admitted 12%
Yield 91%
Class Composition
Female 38%
US Ethnic Minorities 27%
International 33%
Countries represented 71
Admits Within 3 Years of College Graduation** 363
Undergraduate institutions represented 267
GMAT Score Range 550-800
Middle 50% GMAT Score Range 700-750
Average GPA 3.66</p>

<p>From HBS website - 3:</p>

<p>"We are delighted with this inaugural group of 2+2 students," said Deirdre Leopold, Managing Director of Admissions and Financial Aid. "The Harvard MBA degree offers a wide range of options after graduation - from startups to giant corporations, businesses to social enterprises, hospitals to the halls of government. HBS 2+2 enables undergraduates to understand that flexibility early in their education. It also contradicts the conventional - and incorrect - notion that prospective students must have worked for five or six years before applying to the School. As far as we're concerned, there is no single profile for the successful applicant to HBS."</p>

<p>Class of 2013 2+2 Admitted Student Profile</p>

<p>Total Applicants 630
Admits 106
% admitted 17%
Undergraduate Institutions Represented 52
Female 41%
International 25%
Countries Represented 15
Average GMAT 718
Average GPA* 3.73</p>

<ul>
<li>Excludes GPAs not on 4.0 scales. </li>
</ul>

<p>Educational Background
Humanities and Social Sciences 49%
Engineering and Natural Sciences 48%
Business Administration 3%
The 2+2 program gives undergraduates a guaranteed place in a future Harvard Business School MBA class, contingent upon their graduation from college and the successful completion of two years of approved work experience. As many as 76 organizations, including Google, Teach for America, The Clorox Company, and McKinsey & Company, serve as recruiting partners to facilitate the job search process; and HBS 2+2 admitted students receive assistance from HBS in finding a job for the two years between their college graduation and full-time matriculation at HBS.</p>

<p>During their two year-work experience, students also participate in on-campus summer academic programs that allow them to experience HBS classes taught by HBS faculty as well as meet their fellow classmates. In addition, HBS 2+2 admits have a dedicated career coach and access to strategic career coaching advice through the self-assessment on-line tool CareerLeader-CollegeTM (developed by faculty at HBS).</p>

7

<p>I'd say apply to HBS, but think about a better answer for why you can't wait to go to business school other than "personal reasons". Even if you explain those reasons to the admissions office it will still seem like you are pushing your agenda. They are looking for someone who can get the most out of the degree and be successful in the real world with the degree.</p>

<p>You ask how more work experience will make you more qualified for HBS? Well, for one thing, you will come to find out that working doesn't mean a break from studies, as you indicated in your second post. Education doesn't end at the school's doors. Second, you will learn how soft skils and corporate politics play in an work environment. Third, you may find that what you thought you wanted to do in academia isn't really what you want to do... what then?</p>

<p>The Value of the education is derived from the one obtaining it, as well as the one delivering it. Harvard prides itself in not only delivering an excellent education, but providing a valuable one as well (though mostly through the network).</p>

8

<p>
[quote]
Why are you so invested in getting around the rules?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>There are no such rules. That's just silly...</p>

<p>
[quote]
Why can't you apply to HBS in a couple of years?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Probably because he/she read that HBS is asking people to apply as early as their junior year--and certainly before they have 2 full years of work experience.</p>

<p>
[quote]
There's nothing wrong with anyone interested trying to get the full range of information available, including ... the exploitation of rules or "how to game the system".

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Uh, there's plenty wrong with breaking rules and 'gaming the system'. That's how you end up with a financial crisis. I am not sure however what the 'exploitation' of rules involves.</p>

<p>The fact is, though, there are no rules that ask you to wait X years before applying to b-school at Harvard. At some other schools, there are (eg, Babson, I think).</p>

9

<p>Quote:
"Don't exactly know how 4.0/5.0 coverts to x.x/4.0 (3.2 is the straight calc), but HBS 2011 avg GPA was 3.66 and the first 2+2 cohort admitted had an average GPA of 3.73."</p>

<p>well I have recently discovered that All universities in Ontario, canada follow the following standard from percentage to GPA calculations.
Grade</a> (education) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia</p>

<p>I believe HBS will incorporate the marks in the same way! and the GPA comes out to be 3.67.. My GMAT score is 701. With all the information I have provided would I be considered a strong candidate for HBS given that I work for 2 more years?. Also since I work in Aerospace company , would it be beneficial for me to get Private pilot license to strengthen on my leadership profile while I am working.</p>

10

<p>
[quote]
I believe HBS will incorporate the marks in the same way! and the GPA comes out to be 3.67.. My GMAT score is 701. With all the information I have provided would I be considered a strong candidate for HBS given that I work for 2 more years?. Also since I work in Aerospace company , would it be beneficial for me to get Private pilot license to strengthen on my leadership profile while I am working.

[/quote]
Nothing you have said makes you a strong candidate.</p>

11

<p>It's not going to happen, not even close. Those they take right out of college have something exceptional on their resume that no one would miss. A business they ran during school, something phenomenal academically--4.0 at Chicago with references from profs saying Wall Street can't wait for this brain, international recognition in something....</p>

<p>Disregard if you're a minority female with a 750.</p>

12

<p>

Uh, there's plenty wrong with breaking rules and 'gaming the system'.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Breaking rules is a new topic. What does it have to do with the quoted material?</p>

<p>As for "gaming the system" (that is, using rules to one's advantage in a way not anticipated or desired by the authors of the rules), exactly how would that be a problem in the context of admissions, especially to HBS? Are the university admissions practices embodying some sort of transcendent ethics to the point that applicants should work "within the spirit" of the rules and not their letter?</p>

<p>


</p>

<p>That is correct, but the examples are exaggerated.</p>

13

<p>They're actual examples of three people who work for my firm that went straight to Harvard and Stanford.</p>

14

<p>
[quote]
As for "gaming the system" (that is, using rules to one's advantage in a way not anticipated or desired by the authors of the rules), exactly how would that be a problem in the context of admissions, especially to HBS? Are the university admissions practices embodying some sort of transcendent ethics to the point that applicants should work "within the spirit" of the rules and not their letter?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I'll let you figure it out.</p>

15

<p>The idea that international recognition, or testimony that applicant is a genius, or similarly over-the-top credentials are necessary is what I think is exaggerated. I also know people that got in straight from college and their backgrounds were impressive but not godlike.</p>

16

<p>

I'll let you figure it out.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>That's an evasion, not an answer. For instance, do you have a position on whether providing vague descriptions of the jobs and education held by a privileged college applicant's parents ("banker", "manager") is unethical behavior?</p>

17

<p>Applicants aren't "gaming" the system. HBS is playing these students, many of which are among the best and brightest and will have absolutely no need for an MBA.</p>