<p>My freshman daughter has been approached by an old aquaintence about moving into an apartment together next year. The girl is someone she was friendly with in grade school but really they have not been close in years. The apartment is very close to campus (actually closer than her dorm). But we have concerns.</p>
<p>Situation is that she started at the school with a boyfriend from HS and they somehow ended up in the same dorm. Neither have made other close friends because they were just hanging out together and not really trying to make friends. Did not join clubs/organizations etc. (basically the very things I worried would happen). Anyway they decided to break up though they have stayed friends. However she wants to move out of the dorm and get some space. Dad and I would rather she moves into another dorm. Give her a chance to make some other friends. We are worried she will be lonely if she shares an off campus apartment with someone she is not close to and who is in a completely different classes.</p>
<p>What would you do? We have told her how we feel but she is very keen on the idea. Should we let her make her own choice and mistake. We don't really have a financial lever - she is pretty much paying her own way as she has some very good scholarships, some grants and a little bit in loans. The apartment will be a lot cheaper than her current dorm so that appeals to her. But I am really worried about the social aspect. </p>
<p>We were expecting her to stay on campus another year so this is unexpected. The following year one of her closest friends is transferring to the school and they have plans to room together which we were fine with. But the proposal for the upcoming year is not with someone who she is really friends with. Am I just being a worrywart or I need to let her make the decision herself? Help!</p>
<p>I don't think it's a good idea...if she were closer with the person it would probably be easier. Does she even know what type of girl she is anymore? Are they compatible (ie do they share the same sleeping patterns, study habits, etc.). You might want to make sure she knows these things...otherwise she could be in for some VERY unpleasant surprises.</p>
<p>If she leaves the dorm can she return after a semester or a year, or does dorm space fill up with freshman and sophomores/juniors/seniors who have lived in the dorm throughout their enrollment at the school? If the former, I would not worry about her moving off campus. If the latter, I would be more concerned and perhaps expect her to commit to an EC where she could develop a group of new friends.</p>
<p>hisgrace - They have known each other throughout HS but have not stayed close friends. The other girl is very smart but on a different career path - a music major while my daughter is a science major. I think she needs to start hanging out with her to see if they even like each other any more. The talk via the internet but that is not the same!</p>
<p>dnt - I think she could move back into the dorm without any problem. Of course if she agrees to move in with her then she would be somewhat committed for the year as they would have a lease. That is a good point about the ECs - maybe we should tell her that we will only agree if she does commit to an EC. Though we do not really have the power to say yes or no as she is not dependent on us financialy.</p>
<p>I have a tin ear, but in college lots and lots of my friends were music majors. The rest were scientists (and I wasn't a scientist either.) I don't think the different interests is a problem and might even be an asset. But I do agree that it's easier to make friends in a dorm. I think a compromise would work here, tell her that you'd really like her to try out a couple of ECs and commit to at least one.</p>
<p>We are facing a similar dilemma. D wants off campus for 2nd year. </p>
<p>Older sibs did campus housing for 2 years, both in places that were less than ideal, for the cost. Then they lived in off campus places that were closer to the academic part of their campuses than some of the dorms, for less money. Their adjacent to campus areas we mostly students.</p>
<p>This last one wants to move off campus for the space. The most expensive option would get her her own room for less than the room-only portion on campus. On campus housing will not guarantee a single. She is currently in a 4 person room.
This campus, however, does not have a real walkable neighborhood of student friendly housing.</p>
<p>Swimcatsmom, I'm with you. The dorm seems a much better choice for her socially. Does she know of any roommate horror stories from her year in the dorm? If so, it would be good to point out that in those situations the people had the option of changing rooms whereas she will be locked into her situation. How busy has she been this past year? With moving out she will have to take time for cooking, cleaning and shopping. Does she own a car? If not, how will she get around for shopping? Does she know how responsible this girl is with paying her bills? A biggie. A major, major biggie. Nothing worse than a deadbeat roommate not coming through with rent. Does she know why the girl asked her when they aren't all that close? Is she just viewing this as a welcome change after the pain of a breakup? Maybe it is kind of similar to being on the rebound. A different situation can look more appealing immediately after a breakup than six months later.</p>
<p>Well, those are all the objections my overly active motherly imagination can come up with at the moment. I'm sure as the actual mother you've come up with all of those plus more. Worrywart Mothers of the World, unite!</p>
<p>I have to agree with you, swimcat. My oldest D wanted to move out of the dorms Sophomore year and we talked her out of it (no car to use, etc.). She did move out Junior year, but by then friends, etc. were well established. She got a couple roommates. Sophomore year seemed young to me and her college was in a rough area. I felt she was much safer in the dorm. By Junior year she was 20. We provided a car so she could move a little further from campus to a safer area. </p>
<p>If your D is pretty much paying for it on her own you have very little say. If it is important to you then I fear you will have to back it with some $$> Tell her you will pay the difference between the dorm and the off campus situation. If you aren't willing to do that then she will be off campus saving money.</p>
<p>Not sure whether cooking/shopping is such an issue. At some colleges, people who live off-campus can still eat in on-campus dining facilities as much as they want to or eat in fast-food or takeout places near campus. As for additional cleaning, if the students don't cook much, it's mostly a matter of bathroom cleaning -- and some people in dorms (usually those who live in suites) have to do that, too.</p>
<p>Whether your daughter would actually meet a lot of new people in the dorms depends on how the dorms are set up at her school. If freshmen and upperclassmen live in separate dorms, the opportunity to meet new people may be limited because a lot of upperclassmen have already formed social circles and don't have any great interest in making new friends. It's mainly freshmen (and transfers) who are extremely eager to meet new people.</p>
<p>My daughter, also a freshman, did not consider off-campus housing when some other people were making plans and signing leases earlier in the year. Last week, she went into the dorm lottery and got totally screwed. As a result, next year, she will be living in a double with a girl she has never met, in an area of campus far away from the area where most of her current friends will be living. So choosing the dorms is not always an ideal option, either.</p>
<p>I think moving in with someone who she is not close to and who has different interests will widen your daughter's social circle -- rather than hanging out with a small dorm-centered clique she will meet her roommies friends, try new things, and take initiative to get involved in different activities.</p>
<p>I moved off campus after my first year of college - I was only 17 -- but I can't imagine having done everything different. In my case, the dorms were like "animal house" -- noisy, lots of drinking, partying, drug use, sex - and the dorm food was terrible. The off campus apartment was quieter and we each took turns cooking an evening meal --so we all learned to cook better and had much better food. </p>
<p>My daughter's school requires her to live in campus housing, but for her 2nd year she has a single in a 6-person suite with cooking facilities. She did not know most of her suitemates before moving in -- there were no singles available during the spring housing lottery, so she had opted to go on a waitlist to get whatever she was assigned. She is much, much happier this year than last, with the added privacy and also the ability to prepare her own meals. </p>
<p>It seems to me that your daughter is the one who is living HER life, not you -- and as someone who is paying her own way, it certainly makes sense for her to go for a cheaper housing option. </p>
<p>I'm sorry, but I think it is really out of line for a parent to try to stop a student from moving off campus under these circumstances -- you've even said the apartment is closer to campus than her dorm was. Many students who live off campus move in with strangers who they've met via Craigslist or housing boards -- my son has had great roommates for the past 2 years thise way -- so I see nothing wrong with opting for someone who is an acquaintance but not a close friend. Certainly that's an improvement over being expected to share a cramped dorm room with a total stranger, which is what most colleges impose on their incoming freshmen. </p>
<p>In fact, the more I think about the comparison of apartment life with dorm life, the more I think that its nuts for any parent to want their kid on campus. My assumption is that parents who want that probably don't have a clue as to what dorm life is like at most universities.</p>
<p>For what it's worth -- my daughter moved off campus in her second year with an old-but-not-that-close friend with completely different interests, and two other people she barely knew at all also with completely different interests. It didn't keep her from making friends, or make her lonely at all. It got her nicer, cheaper housing than a dorm would have provided, and it expanded her horizons somewhat by making her deal on close terms with people with whom she would not, in the ordinary course of things, ever have become friends. Just like a dorm, in fact, although the dorm had not worked that way for her.</p>
<p>I don't have an opinion about what your daughter should do, or how you should advise her. I don't know her personality, or her campus, and there are obviously other factors involved. But my experience has been that the things you are concerned about do not necessarily happen if a student moves off campus.</p>
<p>Everyone says that since you're not paying, you have little say. However, that's not necessarily true. Many landlords require parental cosigners on leases, to make sure that there are adults, legally responsible for rent, damages, etc.</p>
<p>Do you know if your d can even move into the apartment without a cosigner? If not, that answers your questions. </p>
<p>It sounds like this other student already has the apartment. Why is she now looking for another roommate for next year? What caused the vacancy? What are the terms of the lease, and what is it that your daughter is expected to sign? How many other students are in the apartment? What kind of "rules" will there be among roommates?</p>
<p>These are all the details that need to be considered which may make the entire situation moot.</p>
<p>Her current dorm she has a private room and bathroom and shares a commons area and kitchen with about 20 other students. So there is privacy which she likes but other people around if she wants company. She could opt for a similar dorm but different building to get away from the awkward ex boyfriend situation. Or a more traditional dorm - but she does not want to share a room and is not keen on the communal bathroom idea. (she was at boarding school for 2 years so feels like she has already done the room mate and communal bathroom thing). As she has her own bathroom she has already been responsible for keeping it clean. Food wise - she already does a lot of her own cooking as she doesn't really enjoy the 'fast food' type meal for every meal. The plan for next year was to just put a couple of hundred dollars on the meal plan so she could eat college food when she wanted but would do her own thing anyway the rest of the time.</p>
<p>I think if she were sharing an apartment with more than one other student I would be more comfortable. I know this girl is very busy so will probably not be around much. We know the parents (very nice people) so not concerned about bills being paid.</p>
<p>It is good to get all the different opinions on CC. Kind of helps me put it in perspective so I can look at it less from a 'Mommy' point of view.</p>
<p>Calmom...it really depends on the dorms and the school. I have done it both ways and "the grass is always greener" if you know what I mean. There are benefits and downfalls to each. I have enjoyed living off-campus, but hated having to shop, cook and clean for myself. I have lived in the dorms, but I did not care for the rambunctious crowd around (especially during finals week). I would vote for whichever is the safest environment. Most schools have either security or volunteers that will walk people from their classes to either the dorms or their cars. Once they are in their dorms, I would expect they are safe. Once in their cars, they are on their own until they are safely inside their apartments. There are all kinds of strategies to avoid having trouble find you, but none is 100% effective. I know that bad things can happen anywhere, even on-campus (VT, NIS), but these are the exceptions rather than the rule and colleges are investing heavily in ramping up security. Being the Dad of two daughters, I would be uncomfortable if they were off campus. There are off-campus apts that have great security, but they tend to be very pricey (they know that parents will dish out a few extra dollars to keep their kids safe. If OP's D is absolutely set on it and is paying for the apt. herself, then maybe, depending on financing, the parents could help kick in a little to make certain that they are in a place with good security. Tough question.</p>
<p>Chedva - no she does not have the apartment already. The school requires them to live on campus the first year so she is also on campus but wants to move 0ff campus and has found a few apartments for them to look at.</p>
<p>This just came up a couple of days ago so we are still trying to figure out what to think!</p>
<p>We are concerned about the safety aspect as well. This is not a large apartment complex with facilities. There are some nice ones with pools and all that sort of thing but they are all a drive away and she does not want that. These ones are apartments over some shops and are closer to some of her classes than her dorm. But i don't know about security - something to look into.</p>
<p>As an employee of a property management company I would say that for every successful roommate arrangement there are an equal or more nightmare stories. The more roommates the more chance for problems. I would take 2 girls over 4 or 6 or even 8 as I have seen in some places.
Leases! Know what you are signing. Don't let her sign anything you don't look at first. Also don't let her listen to her friends about how easy it is to make a change if it doesn't work out. The majority of management companies do not allow you to sublease your room if you want to move out before your lease is up. Also most leases are for 12 months. She might need to pay for summer and that will cut into savings. Also with most leases you are respondsible for the whole rent. Not just your half so know who you are dealing with.
If it is an apartment building that caters to students it might just be similar to a dorm arrangement. Some of those come furnished and each student has their own lease. At our company the lease is made up in all the names. If someone wants to move out before the lease is up and wants to move someone else in we must approve the replacement and a new lease will be written.
My oldest has been trying to find a place. We will not cosign. To much knowledge of what can go wrong. One of the places she looked at was to replace a girl who was moving out after only 2 months on the lease. My D wasn't happy with us but we will absolutely not go on a lease. After looking she did finally find someone who would rent to her for a shorter term and in her name only if we paid 3 months up front. Another suggestion is that you require your D to pay the deposit. It is often quite a large amount and it makes them more accountable.
Also have her write out a budget. Utilities, deposit, last months rent. And let her figure out the true cost.
Also something to consider at many schools especially on the West Coast it is rare to live in a dorm more then freshman year.
Also remind her that if there are no laundry faciliites on site it is a pain to walk to the laundry mat</p>
<p>The hardest thing for young students to figure out is their first lease. Does she know if she's directly responsible to the other girl or to the landlady? If the offcampus setting doesn't work out, is she responsible to sublet her room or pay out the rest of the lease? Is it a 10 month or 12 month lease? If it's for 12 months, is she planning to stay put in it over the summer; if not, is there a market of summer students to sublet her space?</p>
<p>Impress upon her that signing a lease isn't being "sort of responsible" for it.
She's absolutely responsible for the rent x as many months as the lease runs.</p>
<p>If the other girl moves out, does she then owe the same rent or twice the rent until the place is subletted again...</p>
<p>These are the kinds of things that students don't always know to consider when they are excited about living off-campus.</p>
<p>
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I know this girl is very busy so will probably not be around much.
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My daughter is a very social, outgoing kid, but I think that one reason she has been so much happier this year with her single is the increased privacy and time alone to read and study. Her school is hard academically and she really does need to spend several hours every day with reading & studying - and I think it is a lot easier to take care of that when she is alone with no distractions than when there are a lot of people around. I think her life now has more clear boundaries: a "home" where she has privacy , quiet, and study time, and "out" where she can have fun and socialize. </p>
<p>I suppose if your daughter is very shy or introverted, then you might worry that without the hubbub around her she would end up home alone all the time -- but I think for most students, its more likely they will participate in campus life (clubs, activities) if they don't have the ready-made social life happening in some dorm common area. Honestly, my first year of college I didn't meet any students outside of my freshman dorm --so yes, I had a social life... but I had a broader connection and met many more older and more mature students after I moved off campus.</p>
<p>A lot depends on the particular college. At Rice SO many kids move off campus soph year that there is really no social drawback. You are still part of your residential college and hang out there a lot. My daughter stayed in the dorm for soph year, but it would have been better if she had moved off campus. She was ready. She moved off as a junior into a 1 bedroom apt with no roommate. She was SO happy, and still had plenty of social life. Rice doesn't have housing for all 4 years for everyone, and there is wonderful off-campus housing at all levels. My son moved off-campus as a soph and it also has no effect on social life (I wish it did.....). He is at a big city Ivy. Both of my kids were really sick of dorms (had been to boarding school) and like the flexibility of having a kitchen and their own food. My daughter really saved money on the whole food thing. WildChild- not so much.
My niece moved off as a soph at Penn State but has 4 roommates so plenty of social life.</p>