My daughter is a junior in high school in NOVA. She’s a good kid- good grades, involved in school, a kind, happy person overall.
But lately, I’ve noticed that she’s been feeling extremely stressed and lonely about the college admissions process, even though she’s only a junior. I know that she puts a lot of pressure on herself, and that some of the things in her HS career haven’t gone to plan as she would have hoped (a B here and there, not building relationships with teachers for recs, etc).
We live in a competitive area where all of her classmates are the stereotypical “overachievers” who want to go to all the big schools everyone knows. My daughter has been telling me about how she feels inadequate compared to her classmates, and it breaks my heart because I simply do not know what to do. She spends all of her time on CC and Naviance reading the threads everyday for hours, and constantly worries about her GPA. Sometimes she is so stressed that she simply cannot do anything other than cry and scroll these online threads on CC.
This is unhealthy behavior and I have absolutely no idea how to change her mindset. She is an amazing, hardworking kid, and it hurts me as a mother to see her being obsessed with college instead of just being happy and living. She has completely lost her self-confidence. She has lost her sanity being focused on her dream school and constantly thinks about what people would think of her
The main thing that is causing her a lot of anxiety is teacher recommendations. She has been a good student in her classes and her teachers seem to like her and give her good grades, but she isn’t a standout student- not the most insightful one (in her opinion) and she hasn’t built relationships with her teachers- she says that the other kids in her grade are better than her and already have relationships with them. My daughter is not shy at all, but her classmates and teachers intimidate her. She thinks its too late to build relationships and that it is not worth pursuing anymore. She wants a good rec because she knows she is a good student.
It breaks my heart to see her like this. I want to know what my family and I can do about this and ease her worries regarding her teacher recommendations.
I would imagine that some of this is related to her hyper-competitive school environment but as you well know and have articulated, it is worrisome and seems, from what your wrote, to be a little obsessive. Would she see a counselor?
You could tour some cool schools (look at the Colleges that Change Lives website) to unstick her from fixating on one school or one type of school.
Does she have any authentic interests that are not related to admissions?
Is she anxious about leaving home at all or is it mostly a problem of her self-esteem relying on college chances?
Her recommendations will no doubt be fine. I honestly don’t think teacher recommendations play as big a role as she seems to think, in admissions.
If this continued, I would perhaps do something drastic like online school for a semester. Getting her out of the pressure might strengthen her and give her perspective. I realize that is drastic and a counselor might be a good first step.
Maybe talk with her guidance counselor, as it sounds like the atmosphere at her school may not be very healthy in this regard. There are so many great colleges and surely many that would both suit her and welcome her as a student. It sounds as though she already has a “dream school,” but it might be helpful for her to think more deeply (holistically?) about what she, as the individual she is, wants to do and would enjoy. What size school, small town or large town, LAC or big university, Greek life or not, close to home or in a new environment, etc. When we started this process, I spent an hour with my son one day asking a list of questions along these lines that I found in one of the college books I bought. My son was not very proactive about researching and digging up schools on his own, but the questions got him thinking and gave us a framework for starting work on a list. We also toured a bunch of schools in the spring of his junior year to help him confirm what kind of school might be the best fit. Would she accept your help in suggesting schools she could consider? Maybe try to get her off CC and Naviance and focus more on something like the Fiske or Princeton Review guides? (As a parent I love CC but it’s my impression it’s not the best source of information for kids, especially as to LACs below the top 10 or so, where they might just not find that much to read.) We are lucky in that our kid is in an international school in Asia where the students will be going all over the world for college and there is not the kind of “one path” pressure cooker atmosphere that you describe, but even here, all the kids who want to go to the US seem to be focused on a couple of big, famous universities (UCLA is hot!). Once my son realized that wasn’t what he wants, he kind of set off happily on his own path. He also has a great GC, who has encouraged him and gone out of her way to praise his individualized list of schools. She’s also had the kids take a couple of personality and career tests, I think in part to get them focused on the idea that everyone is different.
Does your HS offer parent-teacher conferences? You could meet with some of her favorite teachers and I bet they will indicate that they think well of your daughter. The whole “relationships with teachers” thing seems overblown.
** Tell her to run her own race. ** There will always be someone smarter than you. Have her focus on what she enjoys an d values.
I am pretty sure that most teachers don’t have super close relationships with the students that they write recommendations for you.
This is two years in her life where it seems everyone cares where you go to college. Once she picks…noone cares much.
She will get the idea that she has to go to the most highly ranked college…but she should find the right fit for her. I read a post here on CC about a student who went to a Boston College because she thought that was “the best”…but she was miserable. And then she wanted to come back home but was worried about what everyone would think.
Nobody will go to college with her…they don’t get to have opinions.
THey aren’t paying for her college, they don’t get to have opinions.
It’s hard to make a kid to “just be happy” and not think about college, but it may be possible to reorient her to think of longer goals. What does she want to do after college? Where does she see herself in ten years? You can start with these goals and together find out there are many possible ways of getting there, most of which don’t include going to a school with single-digit acceptance levels.
The funny thing is that when you get to college, you’re surrounded by people who are also going to that college. So it seems really normal to be there.
And don’t worry about the recommendations. The teachers will want a brag sheet – a sort of resume where your kid lists her activities and awards and other things of interest. The teachers weave a few things from the brag sheet into the recommendation along with their observations of what kind of student your kid was.
Why don’t you help a little in the college search? there are a ton of colleges out there that aren’t geared towards the over achievers. Lots and lots of lovely little Liberal Arts Schools with a loving environment where she can succeed, find wonderful friends and have that “college experience” you and she both want.
And, to be honest, I would suggest strongly that she avoid CC. It’s probably the one place in the world guaranteed to make a typical kid feel incredibly inadequate.
Do a college match quiz, or several. Find schools within a few hundred miles that seem like good fits, regardless of what US News or CC are preaching. Maybe visit one or two over spring break-- do a road trip to PA or somewhere and visit some likely contenders.
As to the whole relationship with teachers thing: I’ve been teaching high school-- and writing letters of recommendation-- since 1980. I’ve written lots and lots of strong letters for kids with whom I’m not best buddies. In fact, in October I pulled aside one of my C students and told him I would be happy to write him a letter. He’s not good at math, but I can see his work ethic, his determination. I wrote one last month for a kid who is very quiet in my class, but in whom I can see lots of wonderful qualities. Being a good candidate for college doesn’t have to be about hanging out after school shooting the breeze with a teacher. And any teacher with a bit of experience can craft a good letter for kids like your daugther.
Maybe we can help her a bit. Can you tell us what she is looking for in terms of major, school environment, cost, SATs, whatever? Let’s see if we can come up with a list of schools to look at.
We just went to a junior night at my D’s school. There were 6 admission counselors there from various school. One person asked about teacher recommendations. The Adcom from a top 20 nationally ranked school said that they are a “tiny part of the application. They have never had a potential student go from a yes to a no or a no to a yes based on teacher recommendations.” They are there to simply support whatever else is in the application. They basically said no one ever writes a bad recommendation, some are stronger than others but no teacher is going to make derogatory comments about a student in a recommendation. Their only requirement was to make sure the teachers were from junior year and in two of their core subjects. All
of the other Adcoms there totally backed up what she had said about how unimportant they really are.
As the mother who has a D who has had some mental health issuers, I would run, not walk, to find your daughter a therapist to talk to. It sounds as though she is heading off the deep end and she needs help now. Please do not let her try to convince you otherwise. And not a counselor from her pressure cooker school, an actual mental health professional outside of the school system.
I would also find her a college counselor. She could help her identify some schools where she has a realistic chance of getting in. Preferably schools that are far away from NOVA and where other kids from her school don’t typically apply. I would then go tour some schools. Once you are on campus it is very tough to tell if it is a top 20 or a top 200 school. She can also help her try to focus on parts of the app that she does have control over, I.e. studying for the SAT’s or starting to work on her essays.
First, get her off CC. It’s an unrealistic view of the world where every child is the best and only gets great stats. Also she needs to know that college admission is tough for everyone and she will get accepted, rejected and wait listed by some really good colleges. It not about you. It’s about who they want to make up their college class.
We told both our kids especially my son, who went to a terribly competive high school, that you can sorta reinvent yourself in college. You don’t have to be that same person. This spoke to him and he took that lead in college.
Is there a college counslers that goes through the college process with her? Maybe start this now to lessen the anxiety so she knows what to expect.
Start the teacher rec request early. Sometimes her counsler can help her determine who is best to ask. I think she can request and it’s uploaded into Naviance for later use. I assume teachers get bombarded all at one time. At my son’s school there were specific rules to this. Also keep in mind, teachers want to help their students succeed. That’s why their teachers.) :
If she hasn’t been on any college tours do you have any colleges local to you? We took our kids to close local ones first. More like “let’s go to lunch and walk around Northwestern” Then they did the full college tour. It also helped get an idea of size, fit, feel of colleges they liked. I think the unknown is scary for some kids. She will also see that college students pretty much look like high school students but a little bit older.
Lastly there is no competition. It’s just her trying to get into some colleges that match her profile. What others do is their business also, not hers. My son congratulated kids that got into schools he didn’t and vice versa. It’s just a game. Don’t take it personally.
If she has already spent a tremendous amount of time reading CC and Naviance forbid (or get her to agree) from these sites. No good can come of it. She’s simply got to stop going to CC and Naviance. She already knows enough!
As far as teacher recommendations reassure her she will get a good one. She knows which one to ask.
This is what we’ve done to kids - it breaks my heart. My own sophomore has stated, “I’ll go into the military because I’ll never get into college.” He has no reason to say that. I enlisted the help of a math teacher who he has a strong rapport with. I explained to her that he was already feeling defeated and asked if she couldn’t causally talk to him and check in with him because they have such good rapport. She was flattered and has started a dialog with him. It is helping. He is the type who will listen to someone else more than me. (He doesn’t know I spoke with her)
Good luck. We’ve gone overboard in our culture with what we are expecting and putting teenagers through.
My youngest asked his pre-calc teacher to write him a recommendation even though he’d gotten a B+ in the class. He absolutely adored the teacher. The teacher showed him the recommendation and it was amazing - it basically said that my kid had one of the best math minds in the class, but was held back by his ability to memorize formulas. He’d show all his work, where he basically derived them from scratch. He got into a number of colleges where his math SAT scores were in the bottom 25%.
There are schools that are right for every kid. I suggest you spend spring break visiting some safety and low match schools. I bet she’ll find a lot to like.
CC is great for parents who need guidance and sometimes a reality check. I think it’s terrible for students and would also echo the above sentiments to get her off of the site ASAP.
Also agree that LOR are a small part of the application and your DD shouldn’t be stressed about that.
Give up the “dream college” idea. It’s a recipe for heartbreak. A good student can be successful anywhere.
The best piece of advice I can give is to try to drill home that there are thousands of colleges around the US and your daughter will find the right fit for her.
This isn’t a competition. Tell her to stop talking to friends about college and for sure don’t say where she is looking to apply. If she’s pressed by friends, she should have a generic “I’m not sure yet” response.
FWIW, many, if not most, students make their college decisions based on finances, not “prestige.” Lots of people turn down T20s for scholarships at lesser ranked schools.
It would likely be difficult to get her off CC or other similar sites unless you have 24/7 access to her computer and phone. If you (and your dd) were comfortable with it, reach out to the GC (some would not help in this situation but many would) and hopefully the GC can tell her the range of colleges that she is good for and also reassure her that she is in good company with many other students.
I also agree that if she continues to be laser focused on this issue, have her talk to a therapist. It could really help her to have someone to help process her anxiety on this issue. She really may not “hear” you when you tell her to stop thinking about this or that it is not a competition. She may think that mom has no clue what it is really like for her at school.
And, as others have said, try to get her excited about colleges she can get into. If UVA is out, what about JMU or if your finances allow, private colleges. But that will only work if she can give up on the “dream” school.
There have to be hundreds if not thousands of schools where she would get in. You don’t mention a SAT or ACT, but you can show her evidence that she would get into plenty.