Advice sought on foreign language programs or software

Parents Forum
1

<p>We are thinking about a summer French program for our daughter headed into 9th grade. Cost is a consideration. Any experience out there with the Abbey Road program in Quebec, Canada? Also, any advice on the cheaper route of software programs? Our daughter wants to try to skip ahead to French 3 so that she can fulfill IB language requirements a bit earlier and give herself scheduling room to try another language in high school. </p>

<p>I'm a total kluge at foreign language. Any advice appreciated. Her school is really big on a summer home stay program but it is not offered until summer following junior year.</p>

2

<p>I teach French and Spanish at an IB school. Rosetta Stone is a good software, but in my opinion it is pretty hard to learn a language fluently enough through a computer. Traveling to Qu</p>

3

<p>Speaking as a mom/language learner, not as a pro like franglish, I just have one suggestion for right now, while you're still scouting out and evaluating options: Head down to your library and scoop up a couple of children's let's-learn-french cd/book combinations, and have your D listen to them in the car, etc. </p>

<p>She's old enough that she'll likely find them amusing, rather than embarrassing, and I think even the pros will agree that the more you're exposed to a language, the more smoothly things will go when you set about trying to learn it formally. </p>

<p>We love the Berlitz series, with Nicholas the cat. :D</p>

4

<p>One of my son's good friends (now at a Very Prestigious University) spent a number of summers at a place called Camp Ouareau in Quebec that really functions as French language training in an enjoyable context. The friend is an excellent French speaker who got through the AP level in 10th grade without difficulty, and had two years of college French lit courses in high school. It's hardly cost-free, but I think it's much cheaper than something like Abbey Road.</p>

5

<p>Thank you, Oh Wise Ones. These are great suggestions. </p>

<p>My D loves the idea of listening to children's books in French and I will look into Camp Quareau. So glad to hear that Franglish thinks Quebec is a reasonable substitute for France (so much cheaper!)</p>

6

<p>mammall, my S skipped Spanish I entirely at the suggestion of the lead Spanish teacher at our HS, and started the language with Spanish II in 9th grade. (He was already advanced in French, having taken French II at the HS while he was in 8th grade, so in 9th he was in French III.) This is the course of action suggested by the HS:</p>

<p>Firstly, they agreed to test him at the end of the summer, and if he had learned enough, skip him. </p>

<p>Secondly, they gave him a copy of the text used for Spanish I, and he met with the Spanish I teacher who gave him a list of the chapters/sections he needed to cover to be ready for Spanish II. </p>

<p>Thirdly, they recommended a rising Spanish V student to "tutor" him over the summer. (The teacher said that having someone to speak it with was the most important thing.) Since he was away for the first 5 weeks of summer vacation, they started meeting 3 times per week for an hour and a half around the end of July. This was also motivational! :)</p>

<p>Correct me if I'm wrong, but your d isn't <em>starting</em> French this summer, she's just looking to learn the equivalent of French II so that she can skip a year?</p>

<p>If so, I'd suggest that you meet with the langauge folks at the HS, get them to loan you a copy of the text they use for French II, and find out what really needs to be covered to succeed in French III. Make sure that they agree to skip her if she succeeds in learning it. Be aware language programs don't always match, and that a student can be advanced in one area (familiarity with a broader range of verb tenses, for example) but behind in another (vocabulary, for example), and that it can make it very hard to do well.</p>

<p>Lastly, you might want to look into Concordia Language Villages. I'm not sure of the age bracket they serve, but I've heard good things about them.</p>

7

<p>Concordia Language Villages came to my mind also. I don't have any firsthand knowledge of their program, but recall a student on CC who had attended (and I think eventually worked for the program) and really liked the program. I'm not sure they would be any cheaper than the Abbey Road program. Here's the link to the page with fees: 2008</a> CLV Schedule and Payment Information There is a four-week session for high school credit available.</p>

8

<p>For what it's worth, here's how I learned languages. (My school obviously did backflips for me, for which I remain grateful.)</p>

<p>7th - 8th grades: Spanish IA-IB; Latin I - II; Hebrew School
9th grade: Spanish IV (sub AP class)
10th grade: [in Spain] Spanish Lit AP, Intro Catalan
11th grade: French IV; college Spanish lit class
12th grade: French Literature AP</p>

<p>I was a good student, but it just wasn't that hard. Sure, skipping two years of Spanish (and being a 14-year-old in a strong class of juniors and seniors) was a challenge, but I got up to speed very quickly. Skipping French I-III was a little outrageous, but I was going into a class full of my friends, and the deal was that no one would expect me to be at class level until the second half of the year. In some ways, I never really caught up; my accent has always been less than a thing of beauty. But I know more French than my daughter, who between switching schools and college got stuck in some version of intermediate French (including a not-very-successful French language AP) for four years.</p>

<p>I have no idea -- except, of course, through my child -- what the heck they do with all those extra years of language classes. The boredom level of her high school French classes was off the charts -- nothing but memorization, utterly inane conversation, and reading that would not have engaged a 10-year-old. My kid went from reading Camus and Baudelaire on her own to being completely allergic to anything having to do with French. It was criminal.</p>

9

<p>I've got no particular facility for languages, but I still managed to skip French 3, I did it just to avoid a teacher I loathed! For tapes my brother likes Pimsleur. You may be able to check tapes out of the library. I've also heard positive things about the Concordia Language villages. I'm sure this is more expensive than the Canadian option, but it's where I learned to speak fluent French: INSTITUT</a> DE TOURAINE They have summer classes.</p>

10

<p>
[quote]
The boredom level of her high school French classes was off the charts -- nothing but memorization, utterly inane conversation, and reading that would not have engaged a 10-year-old. My kid went from reading Camus and Baudelaire on her own to being

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Whoaa, JHS, I am so sorry; I really hope you don't know me and that your D wasn't in one of my classes! ;) Anyway, she shouldn't give up on French. Traveling and speaking it in a place where it is lived is what we are all aiming for. We teach foreign languages in a fake environment, unless it is a total immersion one. I am the first to admit that! It is SO boring to repeat conjugations and vocabulary lists. It is very contrived to speak about stuff and read stuff you're not interested in. It is all practice for the day when your horizons get expanded and you find out that people really live this stuff!</p>

<p>I would hope that she won't give up forever. College classes in every subject (history, sciences, math, yes, even French) are different that what they are in High School. It sounds like she may just have had one bad teacher (?) French is really pretty cool. Let her rent some movies, listen to some good music, maybe do a bit of traveling. I really hope she gets it back in her life.</p>

11

<p>Another vote for Concordia Language camp, in northern Minnesota. It gets rave reviews. I'm told that Chelsea Clinton attended one of the camps.</p>

12

<p>Online HS programs in French include Aventa (aventalearning.com), UTexas Austin (college level, but 1 semester= 2 years HS), Athabasca University in Canada (again, college level- oral exams by phone are a challenge). D did 5 weeks at ILSC (International Language Schools of Canada ilsc.org) over the summer. Intense, homestay. They also have programs for younger students.</p>

13

<p>franglish, I'm confident I don't know you, so it's not YOUR fault.</p>

<p>My daughter started French in 7th grade, and took it every grade thereafter through her first year in college, except for 11th grade. She also took Latin in 8-10. That was not boring at all -- her 10th-grade Latin class, which was double-credit combined with a classical history class, was a thing of absolute beauty. At the same time she was writing history papers from original Latin sources, her French class was spending three entire months reading Le Petit Prince. She actually burned her copy of the book when the year ended.</p>

<p>For a long time, she was extremely motivated. She has been to France three times in the past 10 years (only for a total of about five weeks, though). She read four or five real books in French, including a French translation of The Unbearable Lightness of Being. Our house is full of French books, including graphic novels, young-adult fiction, polars, pop lit, and classics. We also have French hip-hop, French rock, Quebecois folk. And we would watch French movies all the time (sometimes with the subtitles off).</p>

<p>It wasn't one bad teacher, either. I'm not certain any of the teachers were bad, although clearly they weren't inspiring. From my standpoint, it was just horrible, soul-killing curriculum.</p>

14

<p>My younger daughter has gone to Concordia for Spanish. She had a great time. The counselors/teachers are native speakers, many returning year after year. She came back (2 weeks) able to understand a faster natural rate of Spanish and learned lots of silly songs. The food was all themed and she tried a lot of new food, all of which was wonderful.</p>

<p>There are more than one location for the camps - perhaps three for Spanish. She chose a camp that was the size she liked (Callaway location). Dates are grouped by age. She had a quick interview upon arrival for her language placement. The cabin she was in was cozy with built in drawers for her clothes.</p>

<p>This is Minnesota. The lakes are cold and there are mosquitos. I don't know anything about the other locations like Georgia.</p>

15

<p>mammall, I noticed that franglish mentioned Rosetta Stone; if you decide to use the program as a *supplement *, check with your local library first to see if they have a subscription. You can frequently access the program from home with a library card. Like franglish, I would not recommend it as a sole source of instruction.</p>

16

<p>mammall---we just got a French tutor for our 6 year old daughter (splitting the cost w/2 other girls' families). She comes 2X a week for $40 a session. She's a middle school French teacher & very nice. We found her on Craig's List, where I posted an ad requesting a tutor. I got many, many responses (often, they were accredited teachers looking for additional work).</p>

<p>Btw...I came to this idea after reading about a homeschooling mom (here on CC) whose daughter had a French tutor for 12 years.</p>

<p>It is possible to do exciting, enriching things on a less-than-luxury budget!</p>

<p>Maybe you'd consider the tutor route (our classes are held in our home, btw, and the teachers does all kinds of fun games w/them). </p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

<p>PS Cross posted w/ballerstatus...that looks like a great program, thanks for sharing it!</p>

17

<p>We used Pimsleur to get a head start on learning German before we moved there. H was the only one consistent with it, though. He got it from the library and listened in the car to and from work (hour commute). It's not an "academic" program, but rather, a conversational approach.</p>

<p>S2 used it as a supplement to school - both for German and for French. The main advantage, I think, is that it got me used to listening to the language.</p>

18

<p>Hey! What happened to ballerstatus's post about the Foreign Service online programs? It was incredibly useful.</p>

19

<p>Let me second (or third or fourth) the rec for Concordia. My daughter went on the four-week Russian program and goes out of her way to recommend it whenever the subject comes up. She felt she learned a lot (after two years of HS Russian) and had a great experience all around. We also have good family friends who say similar positive things about the French and Japanese programs. Our rising 8th grader will probably do the Spanish program in a year or two.</p>

<p>PS -</p>

<p>They were also VERY good at helping her deal with homesickness.</p>

20

<p>JHS, I agree the link to the Foreign Service online programs was incredibly useful. I was able to pull up the page again by googling "fsi language courses."</p>