Affirmative Action In Admissions

Student Lounge College Life
101

<p>Why the obsession with AA as opposed to other preferences? At most of you prestig colleges AA hasn't resulted in more than a handful of black students - - usually 2-4% of student body (slightly highter at the Ivies and some top southern schools).</p>

<p>The number/percentage of students entering through other preferences - - legacies, athletes, geo pref - - is greater than the number/percentage of black students entering through AA. </p>

<p>For example, a friend's S (White) was recently admitted to a top tier school in Western Mass. S plays baseball (pitcher). Baseball coach was giddy when he saw S's stats and called the family stating, "He's strong enought to sqeak through admissions, so I can still pull 4 players from the reject pile!" Four is by no means a large number, but that was for just one D-III team. </p>

<p>Similarly, a teacher friend took a sabbatical in Nebraska, in part to improve her D's chances of admission to prestig colleges. D (White) applied from Nebraska h.s. with mediocre stats (1300, 3.1 a couple of APs) and was admitted to every Ivy to which she applied except Harvard. Very different result than if she'd applied from the tri-state area (spit and hit a kid who scored 1450+). D (White) of another friend (a legit VT resident) had a similar experience. </p>

<p>Why should my D be penalized b/c she's applying NY (a particularly strong candidate pool) instead of from Georgia, SC, NC, Mich or even OH (Much Minn, Ore, Wyo, Miss and AL)? I'm certain NY families would apply from their country homes - - if those homes weren't in rural/suburban CT.</p>

<p>I don't think I need to say anything about the legacies (by far the largest of all preference groups - - outside of D-I athletes, for whom college is really a f/t job).</p>

<p>So, if you're really concerned w/ fairness or just motivated by healthy self-interest, AA is the least of your worries.</p>

102

<p>vincent...you obviously need to pay more attention in speech class :)...and you're right kb...idiots are entertaining...especially when they try to explain something that they know absolutely nothing about</p>

<p>Basically, the point I'm arguing is that...minorities that qualify for benefits under AA are just as capable of making the grades and participating to ensure their admission in to top name Universities...Furthermore...African Americans have more representatives in big name companies and in government than Asians who are at even more of a disadvantage than Caucasians in college admissions...Chinese immigrants came to the states working on railroads, and other low paying, manual labor jobs...they worked their way up without the help of AA...and African Americans can as well....nothing inhibits them...if they're low on finances, they can take out loans and apply for financial aid, and scholarships are available if they distinguish themselves.</p>

<p>Note: The Republican Party takes no responsibility for anything VincentP77 says...he doesn't belong to us...he's Republican vote, not a Republican.</p>

<p>Note 2: Everyone ignore what he says and hopefully he'll go away...if you'd like to see WHY you should ignore him...read the few pages before this one on this very thread.</p>

103

<p>nyc...please take the time to scan over this report...it will take only 10 minutes.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.ceousa.org/pdfs/VAS%20Report.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.ceousa.org/pdfs/VAS%20Report.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

104

<p>Why more attention. It is the facts and I have the articcle right here which was in the NYT.</p>

105

<p>See the thing that you don't realize farhansfa is that Vincent's ideology is quickly becoming mainstream in the GOP. Join the Dems...we'll have a kickass time...get it...kick...ass...donkey.....nevermind.</p>

106

<p>farhansfa, though the admittance rate for blacks/hispanics was larger the bigger fact is the racial breakdown: at least 80% white followed by about 8-10% asian. This is hardly a minority uprising. Also, at W&M there's only a 2% acceptance rate difference between blacks and whites, hardly statistically significant.</p>

<p>And I'd also dare to guess that minorities that make it all the way to applying to such prestigious law schools are probably pretty darn motivated and not exactly slackers. Maybe I've not read the article throughly enough but this article seems to use GPA & LSAT as the main standard of 'acadmically competitive'. Once again, SCORES ARE NOT EVERYTHING. I find that minorities with such motivation to pursue professional schools (e.x. law school) are very much involved in their community, these people were more likely to be leaders in black education clubs, societies, programs, than the average non-urm who doesn't feel the urgency to get more people like them in college. </p>

<p>And I would think in law school it would be especially important for people to be exposed to different ethnic, religious, and gender groups. What good is a lawyer who's been with fellow white upperclass all his/her life? As displayed in these many threads, people from different insulated walks of life may THINK they understand how the other half lives, but they really have no clue. I thought that's what college is partially about.</p>

<p>farhansfa, I would be interested in your finding such an article breaking down female acceptance rates. I'm sure you could find similar discrepancies if you looked as hard as the authors of the article you posted did. And women definetly make up a larger percentage of law schools.</p>

107

<p>IMO todays democrats live in a fantasy world. thinking they can have things that just arent possible. i say Thank god kerry didnt get elected.</p>

108

<p>Flashback to '60s (1860s)</p>

<p>"IMO todays' northeners live in a fantasy world. thinking they can have things that just arent possible. i say Thank god we secceded."</p>

109

<p>(mainly directed at 'farhansfa') </p>

<p>I didn't thorougly read all the posts in this thread, so this might have been said already, but there seems to be a misunderstanding of what Affirmative Action exactly constitutes. Affirmative Action states that when there are two equally qualified candidates, the minority will be given, in this case, the acceptance, (in other cases might be the job or the position). </p>

<p>Now, it is important to remember that college admissions have alot of ambiguity. There is no set formula for admisson, and it is fairly common knowledge that alot more than High School GPA plays into admissions--there are essays, recommendations, extra curriculars, etc...Candidates are judged on a holistic level. So, your initial post describing the scenario of a minority with lower grades being accepted, doesn't necessarily qualify as a breach in the affirmative action policy. </p>

<p>Your arguments then shouldn't be directed against Affirmative Action, because Affirmative Action does not say that minorities are allowed to be "weaker" candidates. You might instead direct your arguments against colleges/universities using the guise of Affirmative Action to fill unwritten quotas (which may or may not be true--but would be extremely difficult to uncover since there is no set definition of what a more "qualified" candidate is. </p>

<p>And, in an attempt to better examine the situation on a bigger level, you might also consider arguing against legacy admissions, and admissions on the basis of connections or celebrity status. It also comes off as if you are saying "it is safe to assume that the minority will be the weaker candidate". </p>

<p>You have the full right to believe that it should be based on socio-economic status, and not whether or not you are a minority (which I believe you mentioned)...or to think that when there are two qualified candidates the minority shouldn't necessarily be given the spot. Whether or not you agree with Affirmative Action is up to you, but be sure you know exactly what you are arguing against. </p>

<p>Sorry for the long post, and I apologize beforehand if I misunderstood your stance.</p>

110

<p>-----Black Power---</p>

111

<p>Vincent's ideology will not corrupt my party....i refuse.....let Pat Robertson and the Christian Coalition spread their fundamentalist propaganda somewhere else...if it was up to them, the CC would run the government, and regular church attendence would be required, regardless of your faith...they don't speak for the entire Republican Party, and neither does Vincent...infact...Vincent can't even speak.</p>

112

<p>Yeah we do</p>

113

<p>and where I was going was...I don't believe that minorities with lower relative qualifications should be granted acceptance in to Universities, and replace those who may be more qualified...Don't get me wrong..there are extremely qualified minorities....but the ones that are LESS qualified should not be given priority over whites or Asians that don't benefit from AA and might be slightly more qualified...Jeez the restraints of the English language...this seems hard to put in to a formal sentence...but hopefully you'll get the idea.</p>

<p>It shouldn't be difficult for me to get in to UVa with a 4.0, many ECs, a good essay, and an above average SAT score when an African American with a 3.3 GPA gets granted admission. We should be evaluated equally and if he or she is more qualified than me, then he or she should get accepted and I shouldn't. Get the grades, and if you don't have the money, then the University should take extreme measures to make sure you're able to pay for college...anyone that works hard enough should be allowed the chance to go to college....not just the ones with enough money to pay full tuition.</p>

114

<p>Ur just not smart enogh to put it in a sentance. No restraints</p>

115

<p>and you're not smart enough to spell a word you idiot.</p>

116

<p>I really don't like you...you're the stupidest person I've ever had to put up with...you don't know anything...you dont' know about politics, you don't know your history, you don't know your Cabinet Depts./Agencies, you don't know the foundations of public policy, you don't know how to talk...i have a hard time believing you know anything</p>

117

<p>actually im very good with computers. Have 7 certifications</p>

<p>including</p>

<p>A+
Network+
server+
security+
CCNA
MCSE 2003
CCDP</p>

<p>and now working on my GiAC.</p>

<p>and yeah. i do know about that.</p>

<p>also work for rescuecom <a href="http://www.rescuecom.com/index_fla.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.rescuecom.com/index_fla.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>yeah and make $24.95 pr hour.</p>

<p>Maybe i cant read write or spell, but as a college student. i am doing pretty dahm well.</p>

118

<p>----Black Power----------</p>

<p>Oh yeah did I mention starting may 23rd i start my Internship with Citigroup. i will be doing IT/Network administration.</p>

119

<p>why do i doubt that very much :D</p>

120

<p>If you do then that is fine. I could care less.</p>