I need a little reassurance about having my D start her high school math progression with honors algebra in ninth grade, which would be next year. She is bright but dealing with health issues at the moment. Otherwise, it wouldn’t really be a problem to get her through algebra by then end of the school year. I don’t want to put any additional stress on her right now, but I also feel bad that she will be limited in the math and sciences she can take during high school. Can anyone make me feel better about this?
Sorry…I’m a loner out there. We declined to have our kid accelerated in math. My husband, an engineer, felt that a strong foundation was more important than acceleration.
We called our school and asked if there was some compelling reason why they were recommending acceleration for our kid. They had no compelling reason…so we declined.
Her last HS math course was precalculus. She was a strong math student.
Oh…and her undergrad major was engineering which requires quite a bit of higher level math. She took calculus in college.
You can send me a PM to find out what she is doing now.
I took algebra in 9th. It was not an option to take it sooner at my small private school.
I doubled up and took calc senior year of high school. I went on to get a BS math and BS comp sci in a competitive tech program getting into grad level math. Math talent and interest will rise to the surface if it’s there.
My daughter went to a HS where even the kids who’d had algebra in 8th grade mostly were forced to take it again. It’s a top feeder school for the best engineering schools and they never saw it as problematic. Some kids like @MusakParent doubled up. Some didn’t. It was all OK.
Algebra 1 in 9th grade will lead to precalculus in 12th grade (assuming normal progression without doubling up).
The number of colleges that require or recommend calculus while in high school is very small:
http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/21642599/#Comment_21642599
As a practical matter, there may be some advantage in terms of scheduling flexibility for engineering, physics, math, or statistics majors to have calculus in high school and start math in college in a course more advanced than calculus 1. But it is not generally required.
If she is a strong student in math who likes math and is likely to go into one of the above majors, she can typically double up geometry and algebra 2 next year in order to get to calculus in high school. But it is typically not really worth the scheduling trouble otherwise, and definitely not worth trying to force the issue if any of the above conditions are not the case.
Did you and your husband have knowledge that the school may not have had that she was not ready for algebra 1 in 8th grade?
For the most part there is no choice in the local high school. Reg algebra or honors algebra. If your not at the level for algebra then it was basic math which didn’t count toward your three years of math credit to graduate. One thing to check is if they don’t take honors algebra will they be denied entrance into any other classes later on that they might want to take? Here you can take honors math classes without taking honors science classes but not the reverse.
@GloriaVaughn That’s a really good point about the science classes.
I’m not sure I would want her to do the honors science track because at that school they complete bio, chem, and physics in two years, not the usual three. I’m not crazy about the way they do that. But I would rather her be able to start in bio rather than physical science in the regular track.
D2 took algebra in 8th grade. The district changed placement policies while D2 was preparing to register for 9th grade and was going to force her to re-take algebra (and start over in her foreign language despite 3 years in middle school). We enrolled her in a private school that offer multiple accelerated math tracks. D2 was placed into the advanced track (geometry in 9th grade), decided she wanted to accelerate even more and taught herself algebra 2 & trig over the summer, took and passed the 3 hour challenge exam and moved into pre-calc in 10th grade. Took Calc BC in 11th grade, and Calc 3 & Linear algebra w/ differential equations in 12th grade.
She also took AP sciences starting in 10th grade (bio in 10th, chem in 11th and phys C in 12th).
She had most of a math minor already completed when she started college.
I don’t believe the OP was looking for (for lack of a better term) humblebrags. She wants to know if others who followed the “typical” math track of Algebra I in 9th ended up OK (however one wants to define OK). So let’s not share stories of the exceptional things the kids did to race through the curriculum. Nor should we split hairs over what is the typical math track in your school/district. There are other threads for both those discussions.
@ucbalumnus in my opinion, accelerated math has taken on a life of its own. My husband agrees. It’s some sort of “shame” if you don’t get invited to accelerate…when really, it’s not necessary.
Fact is…our daughter is a very very good math student. And always was. But that doesn’t negate the fact that a good foundation is needed. And the school had no good reason for recommending the acceleration.
At our HS, the normal sequence is Algebra 1 in 9th grade, geometry in 10th, algebra 2 in 11th, and precalculus in 12th.
Accelerated students take algebra 1 in 8th grade.
Not sure what the OP sequence is…but seems to me that this student would need to double up math someplace if they are taking algebra 1 in 9th grade and expect to take calculus senior year.
Back when I was in high school, good, very good, and very very good math students did accelerate (usually +1, rarely +2) starting in middle school, based on them having a solid foundation of pre-algebra math; they would have been bored waiting to start the normal sequence (+0) of algebra 1 in 9th grade.
Now, I do not agree with the apparently inappropriate pushing ahead that seems to be more common these days, where students who are not ready are pushed into the +2 track (and end up having to slow down when they get to calculus, taking two years to cover AB and BC, or not earning easy A grades in high school math like appropriately accelerated +2 track students tend to do). But I also find it odd to hold back a very very good math student if she had solidly learned pre-algebra stuff and is ready for algebra 1 without needing another year of (probably boring) review of pre-algebra stuff.
And yes, being on the +1 math track is not necessary in most cases, but it helpful in some. Not enough that students have to be force-pushed into it, but strong math students should not be held back from it either.
@MACmiracle if they do Bio, Chem and Physics in two years, what do they do the other two years? My oldest’s school did not do physical science and it was great. They did Physics sophomore year, too, and then Chem in 11th. Younger daughter is slogging through Intro Physical Science now and it really is a giant waste of time.
There is definitely no problem taking Alg 1 in 9th grade. Several students do. Abstract math ability develops at different times in youngsters. If a student is pushed too early they end up thinking they’re dumb and can’t do math. That’s usually not true. They were just pushed into it before their brain was ready, see “everyone else” doing ok, and convince themselves they’re dumb. More than once I’ve heard adults who have gone back to CC to get a degree worry a ton about the math, then come out of class saying, “Well that was easy - why didn’t I get it back in school???” Because you were pushed too early and/or talked yourself out of it, that’s why.
That said, if a student grasps math easily, there’s no reason to hold back either. Some brains develop more quickly and holding them back tends to bore them.
With my own three kids, two did Alg I in 7th grade, but youngest needed to wait. Same parents and upbringing - different brain development times. It was easy to see - and easy for him to do it well once his brain had developed enough. All three ended up just fine - though youngest also never opted for Calc as he simply wasn’t interested in a math heavy major. Pre-Calc was his math “ending” spot. (And Stats as that was more useful for him.)
If someone wants to double up on math to get Calc in after Alg 1 in 9th and their school doesn’t do Block Scheduling, they can always take Geometry and Alg 2 together. Those two are independent classes. Many kids in high school end with Pre-Calc though - even college bound kids. It all depends upon what they want for their future.
My D19 had health issues in 8th grade and we decided to have her drop Algebra. She took it in 9th grade and continued with Geometry in 10th, Algebra 2 in 11th, and pre-Calc in 12th (none of these were “honors” classes). She enjoyed math all the way through and did very well.
It didn’t affect which science classes she could take as she was plenty challenged in AP Physics 1 and 2 (no Calc needed).
She was just accepted at William and Mary Which is a wonderful match for her on every level. She is on cloud nine!! I shouldn’t have wasted any time worrying about her not having Calculus in high school.
@MACmiracle, best wishes to your D and I hope her medical issues resolve soon, or that you find many ways to cope and manage.
How does your daughter feel about taking Algebra in 9th grade? If she thinks she can handle it, then let her try. Check with the school and ask if she finds that she cannot handle algebra, can she drop down a level.
I would much, much rather teach a kid who had a strong year in Algebra as a freshman than one who rushed that course to get to Geometry.
Algebra is important!! It pops up over and over and over again. My Calculus seniors have a test today. (I just picked up the class a few days ago; I’m covering for an ill colleague and don’t know the kids well at all.) If any of them have less then stellar math skills, they’re in real trouble for today’s test.
I see lots and lots of kids here in a rush to check off as many math courses as possible as quickly as possible. And I think it’s a huge mistake. Let her stay on track and really get a comfort for the material. Let her understand it instead of rushing through it to get to the next class.
It will pay off over and over again as she takes other math classes.
There are often more Algebra mistakes in Calculus than from the Calculus material itself. A good understanding of Algebra is incredibly important - regardless of when it is taken. Pick the year that is best for the student.
From what I have seen in our area, it entirely depends on the individual kid. Only the parent and teachers can make that decision. Some of DS friends love math and are very accelerated in math and thrive on AMC/AIMEs etc, some do not like the contests but are also very accelerated. All of these kids performed very well on their recent PSAT/SATs they took, all making perfect scores or close to it in math.
DS has other friends that like math but not to the same extent and they are very good students and on a normal-accelerated track. These kids also performed very well. In some threads I have seen some suggest that if you accelerate kids too much in math, they will not have a solid foundation and it is probably true in many cases, but I believe many of the top math kids have an incredible foundation in math and are ready for advanced courses.
I would definitely avoid accelerating my child in any subject if they did not want to do it and/or I did not think they had the ability/skill to do it.
OP, your kid will be fine.
That said, I recommend paying close attention to your kid’s school’s course offerings and the opinions of kids in higher grades at her school when she’s picking math courses for the next couple years.
For instance, my kid’s very large school offers both on-level and honors math classes through Algebra 2. But pre-calc is only offered in an honors variety, and calc is only offered as AP. One of my kid’s friends took on-level Algebra 2, and is really struggling in pre-calc this year because the on-level version covered much less material than the honors version did. While theoretically on-level Algebra 2 is a prerequisite for honors pre-calc, the most common fourth year course for kids in on-level Algebra 2 is concurrent enrollment college algebra.