<p>I too think St. Mary’s tries to act the part of the exclusive honors college and discourages some kids from even applying. It has a good reputation in Maryland but certainly does not appeal to everyone because of its remote location.</p>
<p>Interestingly, the mid-sized non-flagship public I teach at is looking at a greatly expanded freshman class next fall. Which I attribute to less families being willing to pay private school rates.</p>
<p>My daughter applied to St. Mary’s. She loved it. Part of the problem, was you had to apply by Nov 1st to be considered for scholarships, and they didn’t even let you know if you were admitted until the end of March. By that time, we had committed to Frostburg, which is small, had a better match for her major, was 1/2 the cost of St. Mary’s and gave my dd a scholarship. In order to consider St Mary’s after that, they had to give a great deal, which didn’t happen. Only a $3000 grant, as opposed to Frostburg’s $5000 scholarship. St. Mary’s would have cost us $27000 out of pocket as opposed to $12,000 at Frostburg. Just their room and board cost was $5000 more a year. So, the late notification, high cost were the issues.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Yes. This seems like a problem that will need to be addressed by a change in philosophy and strategy in the admissions office and a serious focus on enrollment management. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>If the director of admissions still has his or her job, I can’t imagine why.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>See, that is one reason it was on my D’s list for a while. She ended up with admissions to U of Chicago, Swarthmore, and Harvey Mudd – high end schools. But if for some reasons those admissions hadn’t worked out, or if she had wanted a less competitive environment, I could see how she could have gone to St. Mary’s of Maryland. The things that put her off in the end so she did not apply: (1) she felt that the campus was not very gay friendly – a couple of different items in the school papers we picked up while visiting made it clear that there are some issues on campus, and (2) there is a significant jock-“laxbro” type contingent on campus that she didn’t really like, and (3) in her senior year she decided she wants to focus on physics in college instead of her original plan for biology/possibly med school. Although I think she felt like she would find friends that weren’t in the #2 category and that part would probably be okay, #1 was kind of a deal killer because she is gay and #3 because they are not so strong in physics. Regarding the expense, even from OOS it is a heck of a lot cheaper than the $60K per year schools that were on her list – so it was even something of a “financial safety” compared to her other choices. So she ended up with Lawrence as her safety instead (with the good merit aid she got, it would have been quite inexpensive) – but we both still have a little soft spot for St. Mary’s. And tweaking her circumstances just a bit, she could have easily ended up there.</p>
<p>I just read their website about the Early Action program ABCkids mentioned–one has to apply by Nov 1 but won’t hear until April 1. How is this even early action! If they changed this one thing I bet their numbers will improve a bit.</p>
<p>I found this article from the <em>Christian Science Monitor</em> interesting. Here’s a few choice quotes:</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>
[Quote]
Telltale signs, she says, include hiring of large numbers of part-time faculty, deferred maintenance, and a frantic'' marketing position.Sometimes the glossier the brochure, the more the problems,'' says Ms. Thrash.
Good management and a clear sense of purpose are often key variables, too, in whether an institution survives or falls, says Mr. McGuinness. ``It's amazing how many places you'd never dream would survive that have done beautifully,'' he says.
[/Quote]
</p>
<p>What makes it more interesting is that the date on the byline is 1990! It appears that financial pressures on small schools have been around for awhile, and whether this time is different in terms of many not being able to survive, I have no idea. </p>
<p>Link to the article</p>
<p>[Drop</a> in Students, Income Squeezes Small Colleges - CSMonitor.com](<a href=“http://www.csmonitor.com/1990/0806/acol.html]Drop”>Drop in Students, Income Squeezes Small Colleges - CSMonitor.com)</p>
<p>If the by line is 1990…I’m wondering…in the last 23 years, how many of the schools folded? </p>
<p>St. Mary’s was on our daughter’s radar as well for a bit. She decided she wanted a more urban campus. We both liked the school a lot…especially programs in the humanities. They have a great sailing program!</p>
<p>1990 is the year I started college, and I remember hearing that our year marked the start of a period where the birth rate drop in the early 1970s would impact colleges. </p>
<p>Colleges will likely do what they have to in order to make it work. I believe my freshman year apparently had been the first in a while with no temporary triples is study lounges, and my sophomore year the first in a while where they did not grant many (or any) permission to live off campus, when the year before requests were pretty much rubber stamped because they wanted some sophomores to move off.</p>
<p>Families have to make choices on what they can and will afford. So do colleges. I teach at a state university in an arts program that does not have a lot of scholarship money to offer. It is a terrific “deal” for in state students, and for OOS reasonable… less expensive than private school sticker price, and close to comparable to IS tuition at some surrounding state universities. However, I know we lost some OOS students this year who were offered large enough awards from small private universities to make them less expensive. </p>
<p>We are not under enrolled in my programs… actually at target this year, as opposed to last year where we were over target (interestingly enough with OOS students). </p>
<p>Things fluctuate and families and colleges make adjustments and choices.</p>
<p>:-)</p>
<p>Sent from my DROID RAZR using CC</p>
<p>St Mary’s probably picked their Nov 1 deadline because it’s the same deadline UMd-College Park uses-- which is still way too early so a lot of instate kids throw in an application if there’s any chance they may attend. But College Park notifies in January I think and is a much larger, well-known school so they may have more wiggle room than St Mary’s. That said, the kids I’ve known who went to St Mary’s absolutely loved it. </p>
<p>As far as price, the last time I looked into it, instate residents could cut the cost a bit by purchasing a Maryland prepaid plan. Plan prices are the weighted tuition average of all instate public colleges but St Mary’s is, I believe, the most expensive instate public option. The catch is that a family has to own the prepaid plan for at least 3 years before they can use the benefits so buying one if your child is a junior or senior will only get you a discounted tuition for your child’s last year or two of college. Still, it’s some savings, particularly for a family that might be full-pay. </p>
<p>I am not surprised that some schools have miscalculated yield. Yes, there’s a significant population drop but students are applying to more and more schools. I remember when one of my kids applied in 2008, 10-13 schools was about the max you would see here on cc. Now, there are kids on this forum who say they are applying to 19 or 20 schools! I am sure they’re the outliers, but that has to make it hard for a school like St Mary’s to compete. It’s in a state with many high income residents, with a well-known flagship and seems to compete not just with the public colleges but with private liberal arts colleges that may be more generous with merit or financial aid.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>They are going after the wrong students. It’s being marketed as a safety for top-tier students - which appears to be exactly what is happening. The admissions department is not positioning their product correctly for a high yield.</p>
<p>^^wrong students targeted, wrong price…agree. Personally I think any college is foolish to position themselves as a “safety” school. What a ridiculous marketing premise. They should be marketing themselves as the system and academic choice for the kid who doesn’t want a large campus environment. Or a public education in a private environment or half a dozen other positions.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Right, and no doubt that is not the intention. But by marketing to students with top scores and attempting to create an elite aura, instead of working hard to attract applications from good, academically attractive students several notches down, that’s the result.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I am not sure “high yield” is what they are or should be pursuing. I think “accurately predicted” yield, and a class mix of students paying enough to cover the college’s expenses is what they should be pursuing.</p>
<p>My D1 was not as strong a student or test-taker as D2, and this would have been a very good college for her. She was good, but not spectacular at the time she was applying in high school. But we had never heard of St. Mary’s… we live in the midwest, and just didn’t spot it in Fiske when we were ■■■■■■■■ for options the first time. Otherwise I could see how she could have ended up there. I have recommended it to a few kids from our area, and will continue to do so. </p>
<p>But they don’t have much recruiting presence in the midwest. Maybe because they are a public school. By the way, I think the school did NOT make an attempt to market to my D2 as a safety. That was our reading after evaluating and visiting the school. They have plenty of merit on their own for the right kids.</p>
<p>I have long been impressed by what I’ve read about St. Mary’s of Maryland, but we crossed it off Lake Jr.'s list because of the OOS price tag Yes the location is remote, but the Eastern Shore of Maryland has some really picturesque qualities.</p>
<p>I would investigate it for my kid, definitely, if there were better merit aid for OOS.</p>
<p>It’s not on the eastern shore, it’s southern Maryland. And it’s called St Mary’s because that is the name of the county where it is located. Very historical area as it’s the first capitol of Maryland. </p>
<p>We live by there, beautiful area, the water views are gorgeous, great sailing team. Unfortunately a big lax bro culture. But of course here it’s so local it’s not viewed positively by the very tri county students that could afford it. You know - how could anything be good that was in my backyard syndrome. </p>
<p>They have an interesting music department there that puts on some tremendous outdoor concerts. </p>
<p>I don’t see how it could possibly overlap with UMD CP, they may be the same state, they’re worlds apart.</p>
<p>I think that St Mary’s is a wonderful school. But that sort of school, small, LAC, out of the way location, no town really (it’s truly dead there) does not have universal appeal, and part of what gave it publicity back when my son was interested in it was the value. When a school in a similar category, like Frostberg can discount that much more, those who are cost conscious are going to take that option. I found the place was gorgeous, the academics sound, the atmosphere wonderful, but now for OOS, it would be price for any of my kids, plus difficult transportation wise as it is in an out of the way locale.</p>
<p>I loved this school for DS, but the OOS was not reasonable enough for our us to handle.</p>
<p>Remote = transportation problem for OOS.</p>
<p>We crossed off many-a-school because of no airport transportation. They are
1 1/2hrs from DCA, 2hrs from BWI.</p>