Hi, I’m new to this forum.
I’ve been wanting to be a filmmaker since middle school, animated or not. Problem is, I love both mediums very much (I love writing and drawing) and I don’t which I should study first.
I’m planning on applying to LCAD, CalArts is too impacted and expensive for my tastes… Has anyone here heard anything about LCAD (Laguna College of Art and Design)? I’ve seen accepted portfolios online and, honestly, they don’t seem ‘that’ demanding from what I’ve watched.
Hi,
Does anyone know about Pratt Animation Program well? If we compare with Pratt vs Ringling vs RISD, how should we scale them up? I know that Ringing Animation Program is one of the top schools that focuses on 3D CA (but they start building the technics from figure drawing foundation, 2D and 3D). The only drawback is that they may be too focused on the CA but it may be good for the kids who want to do the 3D CA. Pratt also teaches foundation stuff, 2D and 3D too and lets the students choose their focus. From the RISD website, I couldn’t find too much information. It seems that RISD doesn’t put too much effort into their Animation Program.
I would like to hear some of the thoughts from you folks. Thank you and have a nice day!
^ they are all excellent programs. The best one will be the one that seems like the best fit.
Here are the rankings from the past few of years. You can see that Ringling is pretty much on top the whole time, while RISD and Pratt move around a bit. But keep in mind, they are ranked as top schools. So you might want to look at things such as curriculum, placement, and focus.
@JBStillFlying Yes, good points. I am looking at the curriculum, placement and focus now. I am familiar with the Ringling curriculum and its placement since I have a friend’s daughter study there. They do have very strong courses starting from foundation, 2D & 3D as well as a good placement. Ringling focus is on 3D.
From the Pratt website, Pratt provides similar courses taught in Ringling and also allows students to choose their focus in either 2D or 3D. All of this information is based on Pratt’s website so that I am not sure about the detail. There are some famous alumni in the animation field too.
For the RISD, it does provide animation curriculum information but I am not sure that the way of naming courses is different from the Pratt and Ringling or they are totally different. I kinda got lost here. The alumni currently working in the animation field seems not easy to be found.
If you have any further information, please share it with me. Thanks.
For RISD, here is the curriculum (scroll down):
https://www.risd.edu/academics/film-animation-video/undergraduate/
And here are course descriptions:
https://www.risd.edu/academics/film-animation-video/courses/
My hunch is that RISD will be a bit more inter-discplinary among animation, film and video as they are all offered in the same department and probably are taught from the same underlying perspective in Year 2 (which typically begins your major year). RISD might allow a bit more exploration among film and animation or among 2D vs 3D, since they say you really start to specialize in Year 3. In contrast, Pratt’s program is strictly animation; film/video is in another department, and you begin to specialize (either 2D or 3D) in Year 2 according to the curriculum.
Both RISD and Pratt offer the same foundation year to the entire first year class - or nearly all of them (architecture and fashion at Pratt have their own foundation years). Could be wrong but had the impression that Ringling has a relatively specific foundation year for the CA students.
One other potential difference, which IMO is key if it still applies, is that Pratt would accept you to a particular program of study if you wanted that, whereas RISD has you wait to declare until you’ve been through some of the foundation year. Back a few years ago, popular majors at Pratt - graphic, animation, ID, etc. - had limited room for those who were “undeclared” at matriculation so it was best to know what you wanted to study when you applied. They might have changed that in recent years - not sure. So RISD is - or was - better at guaranteeing that you can enter not knowing quite what you wanted to do and then exploring a bit as a freshman. Ringling also has you apply to a specific major.
Honestly, in the end it will come down to the school that seems like the best “fit” (given financial considerations). Each will provide a unique studio experience, but each is also a top-notch school for animation. If you are set on that, you can’t go wrong with any of them.
@JBStillFlying Thanks for the detailed information and feedback.
My D has committed to Ringling! She loves the CA. Hopefully, this is the right choice for her. Thanks again and have a great day!
@mikishuhoo - congrats on committing to Ringling! I too have a daughter going into computer animation 2024 and Ringling is one of her top 3 choices - the other 2 are SVA and Pratt. Ringling’s reputation and amazing job placement stats sure make it a great choice - for my daughter, the lure of NYC is tugging at her heart and SVA and Pratt are both excellent programs as well. without the opportunity to return to any of the schools, she’s still struggling to decide - it’s going to be a long couple of weeks leading to decision day!
My D went to Ringling in CA and while it’s been a while the school’s reputation has only grown. And many things that make it a great school have not changed.
If you want a very good rundown on the driving forces look up the interview of Jim McCampbell by Animation Career Review (2017) “Q&A with Ringling Computer Animation dir Jim McCampbell”
Ringling has changed it’s curriculum a bit to give students more a taste of CA courses rather than just the traditional foundation year vs what my D experienced. Why focus on the fundamentals? Because that is one reason why the industry loves Ringling. They turn out artists who do CA and not just someone with technical ability. At Ringling a student will learn the entire pipeline, not just CA. Why? Because honestly the animation is a very small part of the industry with not that many jobs. Turning out students with many skill sets is better for the job market. And many students find their true talent and specialty along the way.
Ringling is tough. It’s a ton of work that is not a joke. Their are deadlines to meet with consequences. Another reason employers come to hire from Ringling. They know the students are ready to work. Social life might exist for freshmen but by Senior thesis time everyone lives in the labs. And that final reel is your job resume.
Ringling has a fab career services. All major studios interview here on a regular basis.
Personally I believe the student work is head and shoulders above the other schools.
But everyone has a different style. Ringling focuses on 3D because that’s where the jobs exist. Look at what companies interview at a school’s campus and review what student work is available on line. When D was a student she often had studio execs sitting in on critiques (which can be brutal at times but necessary to move forward) and commenting on student work (nerve wracking to say the least!)
The facilities and equipment (esp for CA) is top notch. When D was there it was “the most wired campus in the US”. Might still be.
Sarasota is not NYC by ANY stretch. There are things to do but not as accessible as walking out a door in NYC. The main attraction is the beach. Many nice restaurants but really requires a car to get around (my D had one and lots of friends…). The campus is very nice and kids mostly stick around and make their own entertainment. These students do art 24/7. You’ll see older reports of bad areas around the campus but the college has been buying up some of those spots over the years. It does get hot. Then it rains. It’s Florida. The best weather is winter and early spring. But the labs are always cool!
Good luck!
@gouf78 - I love your level of passion for Ringling’s program, thank you so much for this detailed reply! and I agree, it’s top notch! i hate to admit that when we first started canvassing animation schools a couple of years ago, we initially did not give Ringling the credit it deserved - but after touring in person (it was the last school we toured - shortly after her EA acceptance in december), we were 100% converted! Ringling impressed in every single way, there is no denying the value of their CA program! frankly, this was not the reaction my daughter was expecting - she thought we were traveling to Ringling to rule it out and instead, Ringling came out of nowhere to give her initial first choice school (SVA) a very real run for their money. there were a lot of tears shed after that trip, as she expected to return feeling ready to commit to SVA and instead she returned feeling completely torn and confused.
3 months later, with no way to return to any of the campuses, she is unfortunately still torn and confused (and just 2 weeks to deadline day, gulp). the memory of the magic at Ringling has faded a bit and she appears to be gravitating back to her initial/longtime first choice school - SVA. beyond the lure of NYC (a city she knows and loves), she feels like their computer arts-computer animation-visual effects degree offers a bit more breadth than Ringling’s CA … the ‘visual effects’ aspect is especially appealing to her and she feels like she’ll emerge from that program with a little more flexibility career-wise. She has been sitting with these feelings for the last several weeks, hoping for clarity that may never come as decision day looms closer. sigh. having the choice between these 2 amazing (yet completely different) schools is a good problem to have, but … it’s been a lot of heartache, the struggle is real!
Ringling consistently is ranked top 3 for animation. Consistently. I’ve seen other schools go up and down a bit on the Animation Career Review list but Ringling stays put. Just one ranking but worth consideration, especially when you look at the time-series.
All top animation programs will be grueling. Today - Easter - my D is holed-up in her apt on the Cintiq cleaning up her senior project (animation lab is closed so grad gift from mom and dad came early this year). In her words: “if we pull this off it’ll look amazing for employers and that’s incentive enough for us.” It’s been a long road and now job opportunities have suddenly become significantly compromised, internships getting cancelled, etc. But that hasn’t stopped this group of determined kids who will be newly-minted animators in a couple short months. Their yearning to instill life and soul into their stories is what is driving them despite no lab and spring quarter shortened by one week (SCAD needed the extra week to help faculty and students convert to remote learning. And: they are all still receiving letter-grades, unlike so many other colleges across the country which converted everything to mandatory P/F). The pressure is on: they are primed for it.
I totally understand the dilemma your D is in. Making these decisions is HARD!
My D already lived in FL so location was never a consideration. It was already home so that wasn’t a factor. It might be for your D (although FL looks better health wise than NYC at the moment! But could change very soon I hope! But Sarasota is NOT NYC!)
I think your D will do well no matter where she goes so it’s actually a win-win to have those opportunities.
My question is why is it difficult to make the decision? If the reason is she thinks the “visual effect” aspect of SVA is a plus for job breadth then I can lay that to rest. Ringling hits all the pipeline which is a huge plus. That’s their goal and always has been. My D still praises Ringling after several years for giving her the depth to fit into so many niches in the industry.
Here’s another super plus to Ringling for your D that SVA might not have (I don’t know)…if she finds the CA program is NOT what she wants she can transfer into one of the other majors that Ringling offers. That includes motion design, game art, virtual reality, (pretty cool), film, etc. Look over the other possible majors in your search.
Internships? Ringling students have opportunities all over the country.
Location? Ugh. Can’t lie. It gets hot but the labs are cold. Too much work to do anything anyways.
Work load? Ugh. It’s A LOT. Up for it? Critiques? Up for it? I emphasize it because many students don’t expect the workload that can come down on them. Some are ready and raring to go. And still have a hard time. Ringling has been called the “Harvard” of animation schools part of that due to work load.
But…first day of class the admonition was to "Look around at who is here. These aren’t just classmates. They are who you will be working with for years to come.:
It’s held true.
@JBStillFlying - indeed, Ringling’s ranking is consistently at the very top, that’s a hard fact to look away from. but the very same survey (animation career review) ranked SVA 3rd in 2018 and 6th for both 2019 and 2020, so that’s certainly not far behind. your daughter’s program at SCAD has also been in the top 10 for the last 3 years and clearly she has been very successful there. They’re all such respected programs - I think it’s less about where it sits on the top-10 list and more about what you make of it.
fortunately (or unfortunately?!), I know first hand how grueling animation can be. my older daughter is a junior pursuing game art at champlain college - so much specific work is required in 4 year’s time that you apply directly into the program. the freshmen hit the ground running and then start dropping like flies, transferring into other majors - animation is a surprising amount of work and at champlain there is a production team element as well. she has pulled many an all-nighter in the computer labs just to keep up, and although the work can be very time consuming and tedious (not to mention the technical frustrations), she’s still very passionate about her craft, she has grown beyond measure, and she’s excited to finish next year. I say all of this to clarify … the workload, the critiques, the pace, the deadlines, I get it - it’s just as you say, @gouf78 … A LOT!
in late-breaking news, my daughter tells me that Ringling will be hosting a virtual revisit for accepted students next weekend and she wants to participate, hopeful to take another close-up look at the CA program before decision day. so although it looked to me like SVA had the edge, this clearly isn’t over yet!
@JBStillFlying - i forgot to mention that your advice on it all coming down to where she feels the best fit is 100% spot on - I so agree, and so does she. but that’s a lot easier said than done in this season of empty campuses and virtual “revisits”! we’re doing the best we can to suss out the “fit” factor, and she can sense it to a certain extent by seeing current student work - but without being able to look around the room at a revisit lecture and meet the other prospectives who will be her future classmates, it’s definitely a tricky time to find “fit”!
@LadyBugPicnic Your D has probably already looked it up but Ringling’s facebook page includes the links for virtual tour plus has the videos from CA senior thesis.
I’m glad you already know about work load. It’s a surprise to too many students which is why I warn about it. Glad they’re having a virtual revisit day!
How would you compare DePaul with the art school based animation programs? It seems that the rankings of animation programs are dominated by art schools - although there are a few university based animation programs in those rankings - like UCLA, USC, NYU, CMU, BYU, SJSU and DePaul?
MCAD seems to offer a good program in animation. Just a bit concerned that its location and smaller alumni base would make it difficult for its graduates to land jobs in the big animation studios. But then, RISD, MICA, SCAD are also in secondary cities? Do you think the other players’ (like Pratt, RIT, etc.) reputations are significantly better than MCAD’s? Would the slightly better reputation be worth the
^ I liked the product that I saw coming out of MCAD when my D looked at it a few years ago. It is smaller and less well known than the other guys but they might place their grads well - you should contact them to find out. Also, take a look at who their animation instructors are and where they have worked. It’s such a rapidly changing industry that keeping the instruction fresh and to industry-standard is important!
I’ve toured the campus several times and have always been very impressed with the facilities. I don’t recall what the animation studio specifically has in terms of technology and so forth, but they are a fairly “techie” art and design school in general so it’s likely have the needed equipment.
My son is strongly considering DePaul for animation. Can he get in touch with you?
Thank you for sharing your daughter’s experience at Ringling. DD got accepted for CA this month and we are very excited (and nervous) about that. Do you know how big is the CA department and what the teach/student ratio is like? Only found the total student number of Ringling is about 1500 but didn’t see any breakdown data for departments.
When my D went the total class size for CA admitted was around 60 students. I believe it is now around 120 total. The class sizes for CA are very small but I can’t give you a number. Of course for a gen ed class the number may be larger. The admit rate to CA was about 10% when my D went and I believe it still hovers between 10-15 percent.
I do see most of the same excellent faculty listed on the Ringling site my D studied under plus a few new names including some more from the industry now teaching at Ringling.
Jim McCampbell is the department head of CA at Ringling and is the driving force behind the department. You may want to look him up (there are a few interviews with him on the internet.)
Amazing person all around. He’s the reason it’s the number 1 program.
It’s an amazing program but it’s a LOT of work. A student basically creates their own film from start to finish. All those steps are the “pipeline”. It’s not always the final animator job that students end up in. It might be story, lighting, visual effects, etc. as they discover their best talents. It’s not for the faint hearted but it is a reason that so many big companies hire from Ringling–after Ringling it’s a piece of cake to step into the industry. And they’ve taught you a whole slew of potential places to start your career and not just one technical aspect.
Advice from my daughter…critiques. Tape them. They can be tough to hear. Especially as things ramp up. All that work you’ve done and someone just blew it up! But you’ve only got two choices–keep it the same or make changes. The successful student will swallow their pride and listen. Tape so you can be less defensive with a clearer head a bit later and analyze better. You are paying a ton of money for professional advice–they want you to succeed.
My D LOVED Ringling from the beginning, made a lot of friends despite the work load. She joined some clubs (even started one of her own at the time) as a freshman (the workload increases as you go). It was a very welcoming atmosphere. Even teachers she didn’t like at first turned into her respected mentors. I hope the same for your daughter!
Congratulations!
PS. Look up DeepFriedPaint videos (Ringling) on youtube. These are from a Game Art design student at Ringling done over her years as a student at Ringling. It’s not CA of course but a great record as a student at Ringling. Things To Know About Game Art and College - YouTube