<p>UTSW is located just north of downtown Dallas. Rotations are done at Parkland, Children’s St. Paul and Zale Lipshy Hospitals which are all part of the surrounding campus area, and also at the VA which is located across town. Having the opportunity to do rotations at both Children’s and Parkland are major pluses for students at UTSW. Parkland"s ER is the major trauma and burn center in the whole southwest and Children’s is rated in the top ten. Most UTSW students will deliver more babies during their rotation at Parkland than some residents at other hospitals do in their residency.</p>
<p>The school is is in an area that could best be described as “transitional” with major new housing (mostly multi-family apts, condos and townhomes) being built nearby. Just east and south of the school is a heavily Hispanic neighborhood but it is also only minutes west of Love Field, as well as Highland Park and University Park which are two of the most exclusive and most expensive areas of Dallas.</p>
<p>Personally, I would be hard pressed to call Temple “nice”, Round Rock isn’t exactly small; it’s rapidly becoming a sprawling suburb of Austin, and only Aggies (A&M grads) love College Station. </p>
<p>I’ m not sure that many MS3s or 4s are terribly excited to be in Temple (though it does have a good hospital in Scott and White) but most would probably not object to Round Rock given the close proximity to Austin.</p>
<p>UNT is in Denton and again calling Denton nice simply because it is small is really stretching the definition of “nice” in my opinion. I live in SE Denton County (just north of the Dallas County line) and have to go to Denton for things like jury duty etc…it’s a 40 plus minute drive in no traffic from my far northern suburban Dallas home and there really isn’t much to the city other than UNT and TWU.</p>
<p>You would not believe me if I tell you that our family has been in this state for almost twenty years (and still so ignorant about this state.) We visited Dallas only one time in these years, if we do not count the flight connection at the DFW airport as a visit. We are very immobile – except for my child (in recent years only), who has accumulated over 50k miles on his frequent miles program. He is very tired of long-distance travelling now.</p>
<p>We know of UNT because several students at my child high school went there for their last two (?) years of high school (some kind of “magnet” high school program). Also because the Jazz program there is considered the best in Texas. (and Norah Jones :-)) I bet my child may try to audit some classes there (if allowed) in the past few years if he can commute there easily.</p>
<p>We heard about Parkland from a doctor who once had a surgery on my wife. He used to do head and neck, but in the past 10 years or so, he was specialized on Thyroid surgery mostly (lower insurance rate, not such a stressful life maybe?) The surgery went well, so he must be a good doctor and Parkland must be a good hospital. He was with Parkland for 15-20 years before he ran his own office – kind of semi-retirement for him. He is also a “cash-only” doctor as he is tried of dealing with the insurance company.</p>
<p>The only reason why I think a medical school physically within a college is “nice” is that a college almost always has facilities like gym. My child almost can not live without a gym. Well, maybe I think too much!</p>
<p>He would be hard pressed to commute to UNT from UTSW to audit classes since it’s at least an hour drive from the area of the Med school, and if he’s at UTSW, when would he have the time to audit classes somewhere else?..</p>
<p>He is fully aware how tough it will be if he manages to get into any medical school in the future. Right now, he is still a “happy” premed whose workload is definitely not as heavy as MS student’s.</p>
<p>I’m hoping to go to UTSW for medical school, as I currently work in a lab there now and absolutely love the school. Like eadad said, for getting hands on experience in medical school, UTSWMC is about as good as it gets being right in the middle of the hospital district. I spoke to an MSTP in my lab and she said exactly what eadad said, that you will get more experience at the hospitals surrounding UTSW than just about anyone else will. I’m pretty sure delivering babies in a hallways of a hospital would be something very interesting to talk about for residencies and whatnot.</p>
<p>I’m pretty sure there are gyms within a short driving distance of UTSW.</p>
<p>mcat2, the program you are talking about is TAMS correct? I know a few people in my lab (and others) who are summer students from there.</p>
<p>UTSW’s Student Center has a fully quipped multi level gym that offers a wide array of activities and services right in the center of the campus:</p>
<p>"Many CCers on this forum believe that most BA/MS programs are not worth going into, for various reasons. "</p>
<p>Very much worth going into. They accept only top of the top (hundreds of very well above average kids apply to 10-25 spots). It is not true that these very top of the tops who have tried so hard their entire life and got used to primarily straight “A”, all of a sudden decided to slack. Kids are surronded by very best cream of a crop students, and reguirements are still reasonably high especially if they want and can to apply out. Having this one quaranteed spot is a very warm feeling. I do not know what that means “OK bs/md”, classes are tough and in programs that I am aware off (non-accelerated) survival rate is about 50%. I am talking about less known programs at state schools. The others are probably more stringent.</p>
This is my argument precisely. Since these kids are going to get into medical school eventually anyway, there is no point to a BS/MD program. The only thing they end up doing is compromising their undergraduate choice AND underpreparing for medical school itself.</p>
<p>BDM, just because a student in this program could probably get into medical school anyways, doesn’t mean they want to go through all the work. An 8 year BA/MD can be a nice way for a really really smart kid who wants to relax in college, and not have the typical stress of the pre-med student. To many people, even though they are smart enough, they would rather NOT have to take the mcat and maintain a 3.6+ GPA and would instead be thrilled to have a guaranteed spot at a US allopathic school. And why would it underprepare you for med school? Pre-med prerequisites have no bearing on what med school is like.</p>
<p>Sure, but I’d strenuously disagree with that choice. Going to a school you like less just because it’s less work is a really, really bad tradeoff.</p>
While the typical pre-med student is under a (relatively) high degree of stress and must do much more work to get into medical school, the student in the combined program has it easier. Given the workload in medical school, I’d assume the student who’s been busting his ass for 4 years will be much better prepared to tackle it than the one who took it easier.</p>
<p>Of course, I’m not in med school so correct me if that’s not what you meant.</p>
<p>BDM, why do you think it is a bad tradeoff? Going to a Top 20 Medical School isn’t really all that different from going to any other US accredited allopathic school (unless your interested in academic medicine or bragging rights). That is, going to any specific US medical school is not going to limit or really impact which specialty you can go into, whether you go to Hopkins or a SUNY. From what I understand, the big emphasis for residencies is Step I and 3/4 Year evaluations, both things that are more up to the individual and the effort they put in, rather than the school they attend.</p>
<p>These BA/MD programs get you into a med school guaranteed (if you maintain their often menial standards), and you can spend 4 years chillin’ stress free, probably studying abroad, and living the life that most pre-meds can never dream of. Sure, you ‘may’ have had the potential to get into a better, Top 20 Medical School if you worked your ass off. I just can’t see how the benefits of going to a top tier medical school outweigh the costs of working intensely hard for 4 years, as opposed to a relaxed schedule with a guaranteed MD acceptance.</p>
<p>at GoldShadow (sorry, don’t know how to quote)- Tons of people who take the traditional path and only take the bare minimum prerequisites do fine in medical school (i.e. most non-science majors). In fact, non-science majors do better on all sections of the MCAT (including science) on average, and did just as well as science majors in medical school. This suggests the same would be applicable to a BS/MD student who only took the bare pre-requisites in college.</p>
<p>Also, it is not a fair assumption that the student will not like the undergraduate institution of the BA/MD. Yes, some students would probably not apply to the undergraduate institution alone of a BA/MD program, but that is probably because they will look at superficial things like rank/prestige etc. Maybe the BA/MD school will turn out to be a great atmosphere for the student, and a really good fit that one may have overlooked had they only applied to schools within their target SAT/GPA range…</p>
<p>"Since these kids are going to get into medical school eventually anyway, there is no point to a BS/MD program. The only thing they end up doing is compromising their undergraduate choice AND underpreparing for medical school itself. "</p>
<p>It is not the in real life, it might be the case in theory. My D is in a program and we have visited some of them. There is no way she will be underprepared, classes are so challenging that good number of Honors kids in pre-med of various majors are not considering going to Med. school any more. That mostly happen after thier very first Bio. Those Honors are mostly valedictorians from private HS. Kids in a program (10 students) and outside of program are going thru the same classes and acceleration is not permitted. The only difference is that those 10 are guaranteed a spot in Med. School if they have GPA=3.45 and MCAT=27 both of which is not a quarantee at all for regular applicants into Med. School. They also can apply out if they want, still retaining their spot, which D considers if she gets high enough MCAT. D graduated #1 from her private HS and never ever regretted her decision. Actually, she considers herself very lucky, since her program is cancelled starting next year, this year was the last one when they accepted freshmen. Classes continue to be extremely challenging.</p>
<p>It also depends on the program. A student at Youngstown State as part of the NEOUCOM program is not going to get the same undergraduate preparation or education that someone at Rice/Baylor is going to get.</p>
<p>I personally know several students who are grads of NEOUCOM and one who is currently in her second year of undergrad and they would not have gotten into Rice even just for undergrad let alone the Rice/Baylor program.</p>
<p>Will they all be MDs?..sure but they will end up back in NE Ohio because the residencies they get are far from stellar. If that is what they want, more power to them but it is certainly not for most I would guess.</p>
Fortunately, this is not what I was referring to. They’re giving up their *college<a href=“by%20which%20I%20mean%20undergraduate”>/I</a> experience.</p>
<p>Maybe they’ll end up liking it, but that’s no excuse to pick the school which you a priori like less. Adding one more improper criterion doesn’t solve anything.</p>
<p>BDM,
Why are you saying over and agian that “They’re giving up their college (by which I mean undergraduate) experience”. What do you mean? They have majors of their choice, minor or couple, participate in Greek if they wish, taking electives (D took Paper Making class just to have fun), working, volunteering, doing club or varsity sports and work hard and having fun just like the rest of student body. Actually they are trying to keep it low profile about being part of a program since it might create negative social situation. D is just at state school and has been having a good time, came from month of hiking trip to New Zealand organized at school, went to national sorority convention. I do not see what she is missing in her college life. Forgot to mention, she is Junior and still gpa=4.0 with very challenging classes behind and ahead of her.</p>
<p>In regard to Neoucom, I personally know somebody who got residency at Mayo clinic after NEOUCOM. Is not it number 1 in a world?</p>
<p>I actually think that the BS/MD program would make my undergraduate experience better, some of the stress is gone, and it would leave me more time to focus on things I want to do…(I am guessing it would, because I am not in a BS/MD program nor am I an undergrad yet)…</p>
<p>Normal premeds have any of these choices open to them as well, although perhaps not ALL of them. The difference is they get to do it at a school that they chose for its own merit rather than a gimmick – and this difference matters. A lot.</p>
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