<p>Hi, I'm a graduating HS senior. My goal is to pursue grad school in biological sciences (PhD or MD/PhD), and I'm currently having a tough time deciding between Cornell vs Caltech vs UGA (for full post, see my other thread)</p>
<p>For Cornell - I've gotten great finaid from Cornell. Its biology program is very good (or else I wouldn't apply at all). Although it isn't as good as Caltech, I suppose the difference wouldn't matter to me as an undergrad. Coming to Cornell, I have several concerns. Are Cornell bio major, a bunch of whom are pre-med competitive? Is it hard to get in a lab in ur first year and get involved in research right away in Cornell? Are there lots of students majoring in bio? Hence, would the profs pay lots of attention to undergrad or really provide helpful guidance? How feasible is it to aim for publication by the end of 1-2 yrs with a Cornell prof? Also, I heard that the workload is notorious, perhaps the worst among the Ivies, which makes me worried because I might not have the time to dedicate to research. However when compared to Caltech, I suppose it's not as bad. </p>
<p>Cornell is one of the schools that I know least about. ANy insights will be greatly appreciated.
Many thanks
Boom</p>
<p>No - classes are not as competitive at all as I’d thought. </p>
<p>You’d really have to take initiative in order to get to know a professor. Depending on your previous bio experience, if you start off in a intro bio class, it’ll be tough to get to know your prof. However, if you start off in a more advanced class (smaller size), it should be easy to get to know your prof. As for research, first-year students struggle a bit but when you’re in sophomore year, it should be very easy. I currently do research in a lab, and I might be able to get a paper out in 1-2 years from now. </p>
<p>I think the workload here is very reasonable, personally. As long as you stay caught up / study hard (10-12 hrs per test), you’ll be fine! :)</p>
<p>Agreed with everything said above…intro classes are going to be large, but if you make an effort to get to know your professor (go to office hours!) then it shouldn’t be too difficult to get into research second semester (though I would recommend to wait until your sophomore year). Workload is reasonable if you stay on top of it; I think a great deal of what makes Cornell difficult is that people don’t manage their time well. If you are good with that, it’s definitely easy to do work, research, and still have a social life and participate in a lot of clubs or whatever it is you want to do outside of school.</p>
<p>I don’t know if 8k extra dollars over the course of 4 yrs is worth going to Cornell over UGA. In my state school, I’m among the ~30 few who got the top scholarships and endorsement (travel grants etc) and enrollment in the honors program, plus, it’s near home, and I’ve gotten into a lab (for more detail see my other post in grad school admission category). In UGA, I got better chance of standing out and compete for Goldwater. Coming to Cornell, tho the school has more rep. and more prolific research profs, I don’t know if stiff competitions from other bio majors and the lack of scholarships will hurt me. In addition, I don’t know the prospect of profs paying attention to undergrad. Often in a large research universities, prolific profs have lots of students (both undergrad and grad), and won’t have the enthusiasm to pay attention to undergrad research, and given the rigor, I suppose my GPA will be lower in Cornell (I may be wrong, however). I really don’t know the prospect of having productive research in Cornell, whether the profs will care a lot about undergrad.
Thus, I have to weigh these factors into account.</p>
<p>I can’t speak as to Cornell, but I <em>can</em> comment on Caltech because my cousin went there. Caltech is, quite simply, the most difficult school in America. You really have to LOVE science to go there, otherwise you just won’t be able to handle the environment or the difficulty. I personally couldn’t handle a school like that, so I would take Cornell, but it all depends on you of course. Good luck!</p>
<p>I can’t give any advice on UGA or Calteach really although I would recommend aiming high and leaving your comfort zone so maybe not UGA considering you’ve already had that experience? Also Caltech and Cornell have much better bio and other departments. While I can’t compare Cornell to Caltech really I can say that the bio major here at Cornell is quite good and there is enough flexibility to take more challenging classes and experience things beyond your major. There are a lot of pre-med in the bio major maybe 40-50% are pre-med?? But this is not necessarily a bad thing. They make you work harder and while I sometimes am annoyed with them I am by no means getting lower grades than they are…the competition is not unbearable is what I’m saying. Undergraduate research is huge at Cornell and most science undergrads engage at research at some point. It is not hard to get involved early on, you just need to take the initiative and email professors first semester. It is totally possible to be published. I didn’t get published for my first project because we failed to get it working but my second project will be published. Just be sure to find a lab where publishing is important to the professor and they treat undergrads like grad students. I would also recommend Cornell because the large number of people and majors mean you can always find someone to talk to about any subject. Often research overlaps fields and it is nice to have some many experts to talk to you about it firsthand. Often my friends and I talk and troubleshoot each other’s procedures/projects. Sorry this is so long…I could talk about this forever…</p>
<p>Also even though Cornell classes can be tough at first it is not impossible to do well. Many people have high GPAs and most every bio class is curved. (this means the mean grade is set to a B or B- and one standard dev above or below equals the difference of one letter grade in case you aren’t familiar) Also on your transcript they post the median grade for the class as well as your score. This shows people that even though say you got a B+ the mean for the class is say a C and you distinguished yourself in relation to your peers. If you take initiative and go to lectures/seminars etc. it is not hard to form personal relationships with your professors. They are all generally open to talking to undergrads and willing to help/get to know you</p>
<p>How hard actually is Cornell bio? What makes it hard? Is it as hard as MIT’s? I looked thru the OCW and it doesn’t look too bad; in fact I liked it because I don’t want to learn bio by memorizing and regurgitating a bunch of facts (I mean bio doesn’t get very hard compared to math/physics), it only gets to the point of applying the concepts to hypothetical laboratory experience right? Can anyone elaborate on this?</p>
<p>practically no one has taken the biology curriculum at MIT and Cornell both…it is not easy to comment on that. I am not sure what you mean about applying concepts to hypothetical laboratory experience…that seems like a very advanced level. that means you are knowing how people are actually discovering how things work, you understand the methods and conditions, and you can put all of this together to make conclusions. I think that’s valuable and interesting, but I also think those are the most difficult questions when they show up on exams.</p>
<p>I think Cornell biology is difficult. one thing that makes it difficult is that there is a lot to learn at one time, and you never know if it will show up on the test. another thing that makes it difficult is that all of your classmates are also very capable and motivated, and so just putting in effort will not be enough. you need to put in efficient and effective effort, and lots of it, and for the entire semester. many of the courses are graded on a curve so the performance of the class matters.</p>
<p>a word about research: I don’t think finding research as anything to do with class sizes. many students work for professors without ever taking a class from them. you just need to have some kind of interest in the professor’s work, and then start trying to find your way in. sending emails is usually the best way. also, even advanced courses, ones that have a handful of prereqs, are still large enough that you will not necessarily know the professor personally. in this way, it is very different from high school.</p>
<p>(also, I looked at your grad school thread…you are not even considering Cornell according to that one?)</p>
<p>I’m not a current student (I’ll be going to Cornell in the fall), but I do know this about the biology intro classes: they’re broken up into three areas, which I believe are molecular bio, evolution/ecology, and physiology. You take two of those three. It’s my understand that the class was broken up like that partly to separate the pre-med track from the other bio majors (premed would probably take molecular and physiology while others would take molecular and e/e). I don’t know if that helps you or not.</p>
<p>I’m a prospective biology major too, but non pre-med (I like ornithology). And I have heard from current students that the competition isn’t too bad.</p>
<p>To all Cornell students: Is Cornell as hard as you thought it would be? - I’m a current engineer, and I’ll have to say they’re very reasonable. THey’re obviously hard but definitely doable. As for my math classes, I just have 1 problem set (10-12 questions) a week, and 2 prelims and one final. That’s it! The professor does cover pretty difficult topics, but if you struggle there are so many opportunities for help. As long as you commit say 8hr/week to each class, you’ll be fine! </p>
<p>As for bio classes, all they have are exams - as long as you read your textbook and stay caught up, you’ll do fine.</p>
<p>Hey, I’m a current HS junior who plans on applying ED to Cornell next year. In terms of chemistry and chemical engineering, what is the workload like for both? How difficult are both of those majors? Is it possible to still have a good social life while majoring in one of those?</p>