Any thoughts on professor availability?

College Majors Music Major
1

<p>As my daughter considers her options for schools, one of the data points we look at is whether the professor is full-time on campus or not. For instance, faculty that holds a position in the local symphony and teaches at the university/conservatory vs. faculty who's basically full-time on campus. I've had people tell me professor availability is very important, and I've had people tell me it really doesn't matter.</p>

<p>What's everyone's thoughts on this? In particular, has this played out one way or another for your child? Keep in mind, this is for undergrad if that affects your opinion at all.</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

2

<p>I’ve weighed in on this before - but seems to me the majority of the time a student spends in an undergrad program is with the other students, in classes, and in ensembles, with conductors and coaches. The private lessons tend to be once a week for one hour. And maybe a studio class or composition seminar. Is it essential that the primary performance professor be on campus all those other hours of the week? Didn’t matter for my kid - composition student ( and the professors were full time in that they didn’t teach at another program - but they certainly weren’t hanging around the college day in and day out with open office hours. Although they would show up to the occasional concert.)</p>

3

<p>My S is a performance major and I think it has been a huge benefit to him to have his professor be full time and more available. His choices basically came down to his current teacher who is full time and another teacher at a different school who was in the Cleveland Orchestra and came to the school once a week to teach. He also tried to have a studio class with all his students at 3 different institutions about once a month. He gets an hour lesson weekly from his current teacher, weekly 2 hour studio class and the teacher splits his students into 2 groups and teaches them each a 1 hour technique class every week. So he has interacted with his current teacher a minimum of 4 hours a week for his whole time so far at his current school. His professor has also been available for chamber music coachings and extra time for recital prep. Their mentor/ student relationship is incredibly strong and I think it has been invaluable for my S.
There were other factors effecting his decision, but he did like both professors equally well. Knowing the amount of time he would be spending with his professor was certainly one factor in his decision and he has certainly benefited from the extra time spent with his current teacher. </p>

4

<p>I would think that having a teacher who comes in for lessons once a week would not be so bad, but I’ve heard from some whose profs were traveling to gigs so often that they were rarely available to actually teach. That seems like something worth knowing about, and a potential downside to working with big names in current performance.</p>

5

<p>There’s a difference between “physically” available and “emotionally” available. My D really likes to connect with her teacher, and has chosen people who are open to being emailed/texted/called with life issues or emergencies. (She tries not to be intrusive with things that can wait.) That doesn’t mean she’s having coffee with them every day at 10:15 but it does mean she can text her teacher as she did today that she might be late for her lesson because the bathroom in her apartment is flooding (must check this: last text said “the toilet is in the bathtub” :0) and the teacher can attend recitals, important perfomances etc. </p>

6

<p>My DS has a teacher who still conducts and solos so he travels quite a bit. His teacher has done a really good job (IMO) of scheduling extra lessons when he knows he is going to be away. Some students might not like this but it has not been an issue for DS. </p>

<p>If you think a teacher being away or teaching elsewhere might be an issue, ask the teacher for the contact info for a couple of his/her current students (assuming the teacher gets permission from students first to do this). They will be able to tell you if it is an issue or not.</p>

7

<p>My daughter’s teachers have always been very busy, schedule-wise, in terms of traveling and performing. For undergrad she did a split studio (which means she studied with two teachers.) Both were only at her conservatory, but the had large studios and were in demand elsewhere professionally so there were always some lessons with TAs. But the TAs were fantastic teachers in their own right. One of her teachers was very much an emotional support; the other was simply not that kind of person. But having his perspective was invaluable. Her current teachers for grad school are both very busy performers at the peak of their careers. And they both teach at other conservatories. Time with them is certainly at a premium because every minute of their day is tightly scheduled. Despite all this, she would not trade her teachers for someone who has more time available. Every moment with them has been precious and well-used. </p>

8

<p>To add to my comment above-- remember that as students mature they become more self-reliant. When my daughter was 11 she had 2 lessons a week, and that usually meant about 3 hours of face time with her teacher. Now it’s a 55-minute lesson once a week (and that’s how it was through undergrad.) But a mature student needs less hand-holding and can process lesson content much faster. Add to that a weekly studio class (with the teacher generally attending) and scheduled play-through classes (generally moderated by TAs) and there is a lot of support built in.</p>

9

<p>Thanks for the input everyone. I think the thing I keep forgetting is how little these students actually see their main professor anyway. I think the chant of “it’s all about finding the professor you want as a mentor” can make one leap to the assumption that a lot of time is spent together, when in reality it might only be an hour or two per week.</p>

10

<p>If it is for oboe, then one question is how is the reedmaking equipment set up? Some schools have a separate room that students have access to at all times. At others the reed room may be a part of professor’s office and students may stop in whenever professor is there. So if he isn’t there often that could be a problem. Even if the room is a separate room, if the student is still perfecting reedmaking skills, then access to the professor 's expertise is necessary. It is possible that a school may have a good mix of genial advanced students who are often available and happy to offer assistance, but you can’t count on that. Some schools offer a special reedmaking class at specific times, but students often are working on reeds at odd hours even so.</p>

<p>But it also depends on how advanced in reed making your D is and what sort of equipment she has. If she already has everything she needs to start from tube cane to completion and also the skills to do it well without guidance, then this may not be a factor for you. I don’t think that is common for an entering undergrad, but perhaps your D is set there. </p>

11

<p>@celesteroberts‌ - GREAT thoughts and something I hadn’t considered. (Great questions for campus visits) My daughter is fairly well along on reed making as a HS Jr. She’s not making reeds yet she’s comfortable with for performances, but doing very well. She doesn’t have all of the highest level equipment, but the skills seem to be developing well. We’ve found out from comments she’s getting from other oboists her age that she’s a bit ahead of the curve on reeds. That said, it’s such a black art that I can see the benefit of having that knowledge accessible to you. Even more so because some instructors want their student’s reeds made in a very specific way.</p>

12

<p>Like a lot of things with music, it depends on the student. There are downsides to teachers who are active performers, in that they may not be available a lot and depend on TA’s to do a lot of their teaching. Note as GH said that TA’s are not necessarily what you expect when you hear TA in a college, ie Grad students teaching lower level UG courses, many of them are teachers in their own right, but work with a more experienced/famous teacher (for example, a number of top teachers today once upon a time were TA’s for Dorothy Delay), so it isn’t like the kid is being ripped off…but it is part of the tradeoff. Some famous teachers see their students part time, and depend on TA’s to do the other teaching, or they share teaching, which is fine if it works for the student. Where it can be a pain is if the teacher constantly has to reschedule lessons because things came up, that does happen, and having regular lesson time from what I have seen makes a big difference for many students, having a lesson one week on tuesday at 3 then next week weds at 5, and so forth, can be disruptive, and there are teachers out there where this happens from what I have heard. </p>

<p>It is great if teachers can make recitals or solo performances and such, but to be honest, that is not going to be all that common, some teachers never go to those things, others make the attempt and go when they can, and it may be difficult to find a teacher who is that available. Some teachers do studio classes, others simply do the one lesson a week/hour model…so it all, again, comes down to the student. </p>

13

<p>You know, we always say it’s all about the teacher, and in many ways it is - but I think it’s also all about the fellow students with whom a college student spends most of their life, and, in music, likely their future life as well, as it’s such a small world.</p>

14

<p>DD and her best friend were in the same school but DD’s teacher had retired from performance but her best friend’s had not. They ended up with the teacher they needed. DD needed the consistent access her teacher provided but her best friend thrived with the more random lessons that could be made up in batches. It is a combination of the needs of the student and getting that match with the teacher. </p>

15

<p>Looking around on these boards, it sure seems that East Coast oboe parents are over-represented. I’m yet another one, though my daughter is young. </p>

<p>The oboe world is small and peculiar, and I’m not sure I’d apply generalizations that might make sense outside of the oboe box (such as teacher availability = good) to oboe professors. For the most part, oboe professors are first and foremost oboe players. Most good oboe players are extremely busy people. If I ran into an oboe professor who has a lot of time on his/her hands, I think I’d have the same feeling I get if I walk into an empty Chinese restaurant at lunch time … Maybe this isn’t the place to be. </p>

<p>As far as reed-making… Yes, your daughter will need to be able to make reeds at 2am on any given Tuesday, right? I wouldn’t think that would necessarily mean access to the reed room, though, if she has her own tools. Of course, most students wouldn’t have gouging equipment, but gouging is typically done in batches.</p>

<p>I found the list of oboe players in this old thread very interesting:</p>

<p><a href=“A music Major? I Must be Crazy, right? - Music Major - College Confidential Forums”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/989454-a-music-major-i-must-be-crazy-right.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>On another recent thread, the “big three” were mentioned: (listing alphabetically) Douvas, Ferillo, Woodhams. All three are on the East Coast. There are also rich oboe playing traditions in Cleveland, Chicago and California. Largely because of generational waves (not to mention untimely passings), you won’t find principals with long teaching histories that rival the big three, but there’s some absolutely beautiful playing going on out there, and I’m sure great teaching is, too. (I’m feeling very “New Yorker’s view of the world,” lumping in Cleveland with the west coast) I happen to particularly like Cleveland (oboe-wise, anyway…) which sadly no longer has John Mack, but his influence is still felt strongly there. In addition to graceful playing, I’ve noticed a certain personal gentleness among Mack-influenced oboe players. </p>

<p>If my daughter were ready to look at college now, I’d be encouraging her to consider Colburn (Ghez), CIM (Rosenwein) and Oberlin (Walters). I don’t know anything about their teaching, but Ghez and Rosenwein play exquisitely; Walters (who plays beautifully, as well) has some YouTube videos in which he comes across as a natural pedagogue. Indiana seemed to be dismissed in the recent thread I mentioned … Based on the list in the old thread I linked, I sure wouldn’t overlook it. </p>

16

<p>Ariana Ghez went to college at Columbia, where she was an English literature major and participated in the Columbia-Juilliard exchange program. She graduated in 2003 and then did graduate work under Woodhams at Temple before joining the Rochester Philharmonic and then the LA Philharmonic where she is now. Another reminder that there are many paths to a successful music career. I thought this story about her in the Columbia alumni magazine (from 2006) was interesting: <a href=“http://www.college.columbia.edu/cct_archive/jan06/updates6.php”>http://www.college.columbia.edu/cct_archive/jan06/updates6.php&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;

17

<p>Jazzpianodad,</p>

<p>Interesting article, thanks. I think I’d see Ariana Ghez – who studied with Ferrillo, Mack AND Woodhams – as an example of the adage that where you study is less important than with whom, rather than an example of an unusual path to the top. In any case, her playing is beyond gorgeous, and I imagine she’ll be one to watch as far as teachers of the next generation of oboe players.</p>