<p>I as not legacy, not URM and not an athlete. My paents have not donated a dollar to ND, but I got accepted at ND. My SAT and SAT II are not at the top level of those I've seen admitted to ND. SAT and SAT II are quasi-equalizers. GPA alone is not a good measure because shigh chools have inflation/deflation grade situations. Ranking is apples to oranges because high school competition varies. The best comment I read in a post is that colleges are not admitting students based on a simple mathematical formula or number/type of EC, but they are "forming a class". They could probably form 2 good classes with the applications they are getting, but they can only admit so many based on their capacity. Schools don't know us "personally", so, we should not take it personally. What hurts is when we fall in love with one school, and they don't fall in love with us. I got turned down from my #1 dream school, but prepared myself emotionally for "four dream schools" because of pure psuchological self-preservatoins. My dad always told me, part of growing up is learning to set realistic expectations and learning to cope with unpredictable results. College admissions seem to be a good dose of reality for us young people to prepare us for the entropy of the real world.</p>
<p>Compared to most schools, Notre Dame is quite upfront about its legacy preference policy. Legacy is defined very narrowly at Notre Dame and last year they aimed to enroll 23% legacy. My daughter was waitlisted last year while a domer friend's son with slightly lower statistics was admitted. But, we knew that was a possibility going in and, while disappointed, did not feel as if we were cheated by Notre Dame. The fact is that for whatever reason, Notre Dame did not need for the class of 2011 another white, non-athletic, female, midwestern, Catholic with solid (but not overwhelming) scores and grades. Was it lack of legacy? Was it because she was female? Was it (fill in the blank)? Who knows. The fact is that Notre Dame has far more qualified applicants than they have positions in the freshman class. Decisions of who is in and who is out are not necessarily going to make sense. But, the fact that Notre Dame will give preferences to legacies is well advertised.</p>
<p>I know that ND upped their intake of legacies this year. I have a source (extremely reliable) that says letters were sent out to alumni with children who applied stating that they were aiming to accept at least 50% of all legacies that applied this year.</p>
<p>I'm sorry to all who feel that they were not accepted for lack of a parent having attended. You may be absolutely right... you may have been much better qualified than some legacies that were accepted. But, that is Notre Dame's choice... they want to keep it a family atmosphere, and they view that the best way to do so is to keep the families attending throughout the generations.</p>
<p>wow. </p>
<p>I never knew that. Can anyone confirm this?</p>
<p>wow.</p>
<p>Per the Observer yesterday, " Additionally, about 23 percent of the members of the incoming class are children of alumni,"</p>
<p>well yes, I knew that.</p>
<p>But they accept over 50 % of legacies? I was thinking it was around 30-35%... with about 70 percent of them attending.</p>
<p>"I know that ND upped their intake of legacies this year. I have a source (extremely reliable) that says letters were sent out to alumni with children who applied stating that they were aiming to accept at least 50% of all legacies that applied this year.</p>
<p>I'm sorry to all who feel that they were not accepted for lack of a parent having attended. You may be absolutely right... you may have been much better qualified than some legacies that were accepted. But, that is Notre Dame's choice... they want to keep it a family atmosphere, and they view that the best way to do so is to keep the families attending throughout the generations."</p>
<p>My dad didn't receive any letter.
I was rejected</p>
<p>Okay, everyone here talks about how legacies get in so easily. Yes I know my stats were low. </p>
<p>ACT- 30
RANK: top 8% of the class. </p>
<p>I am also extremely involved in school/my church, and I played varisty sports (captain) all throughout high school. </p>
<p>I didn't think I was low enough not to be considered...</p>
<p>And my line of legacy, is 4 generations.
My great great grandpa went, my great grandpa (who is actually BURIED on campus), my grandpa, and my dad. There is a street in South Bend named after my family too. </p>
<p>Please can someone just put me in my place, as reading all these numbers and people complaining about legacies with low stats getting in... are my stats just INSANELY low? </p>
<p>I'm trying to argue that I don't think legacies are getting in as easily as you think. </p>
<p>Maybe I'm still just very upset after being rejected.</p>
<p>The reason for the increase in legacy admits may very well be related to the decline of the athletic programs. This may be an avenue for ND to appease the alumni who do not take losing lightly.</p>
<p>Sorry Tim, I got confused- long day. I think that 50% sounds a bit high too, I can't remember where I read this, but I thought they admitted to a legacy admit rate of 40%. I'll try to remember where I read this number. I know 3 legacies this year that applied and all three were rejected.</p>
<p>AC419
Comparing your stats to other legacies admitted, you surely should have received a thick envelope. Has there been a donation within the past five years from your family? I certainly think you are in a position to demand an explanation.</p>
<p>my dad part of our county's alumni club, he pays dues?
And my grandpa has a special parking pass for the games, he's part of some association as well. </p>
<p>I don't think my rejection letter was a form letter, it talked about my legacy status. </p>
<p>Kind of discouraging you know? Being a legacy makes it easiest to get in, and you still don't</p>
<p>Tim,
I bet it was in the book "The Price of Admissions" Notre Dame's legacy policies are highlighted in that book.</p>
<p>Dark Horse 90--Excellent Post!! I have refrained from commenting on this thread, but have to agree with Dark Horse. Yes, one can say that ND has a legacy rep BUT--each year admissions forms classes based on many things. As Dark Horse stated, there is no mathematical formula and the composition from year to year for classes probably varies widely. It is very important for all prospective students to remember NOT to pin hopes on one school, as difficult as that may be. You should have 3 or 4 dream schools and of course matches and safeties. You should be comfortable attending ANY of the schools you apply to. This has, once again, been a brutal year for admissions across the board, not just ND. And, keep in mind, that rejection at your dream school is but one of life's many disappointments ahead of you. Try to begin now remaining open and positive about what your future holds. Good Luck to all of you!</p>
<p>What % of applicants are legacies? If 23% of the applicants were legacies, then that would show there is no preference given.</p>
<p>Just saying that that piece of information should be part of this discussion.</p>
<p>you are bring up an interesting point.</p>
<p>But, Notre Dame is upfront about their treatment towards legacies.... but AC's case shows that legacies are not auto-admits at all.</p>
<p>Interesting point though</p>
<p>I know they treat legacies differently, but one girl who got a 1800 on her SATs doesn't add much to this conversation. Knowing what the acceptance rate of legacies is and what the acceptance rate of non-legacies, as well as average stats for the two groups, is all that needs to show how much of a preference they get.</p>
<p>Yes, we legacy applicants received a letter saying that they aimed to accept 50% of the legacy applicants and that they hoped the class of 2012 would be 25% sons/daughters of alums.</p>
<p>Having a parent who works in the ivy league admissions process and who receives much criticism for being "too lenient" with legacy apps, I asked him the same thing; do legacy applicants deserve the slight edge? He responded that the legacy students on average have a higher gpa than non-legacy students which shows that the criticism IN MOST CASES can be very unfair. Pointing fingers at legacy admits saying that someone else deserved their admit is unfair because, who's to say they wouldn't have been admitted without their legacy status? Say a legacy doesn't have the highest stats, which can be true, who's to say that other facets of their app didn't get them in, like we see in so many cases? A great essay or other subjective aspects can nullify low stats. </p>
<p>Moral of the story, apple doesn't fall far from the tree?</p>
<p>I don't think that ND upped the intake of legacies this year. If I remember correctly, the legacy letter 5 years ago also mentioned that ND aimed to accept about 50%. A rejection letter followed in April. Last year the legacy letter definitely stated that ND aimed to admit the 50%. Ouch! Another rejection letter.</p>
<p>hihoofigo,
I don't think it's fair to criticize CTcutie for getting in. While her SAT scores may seem low for the ND average, she sounds like she's got an amazing family who's dedicated to community service and social justice, which is directly in line with Notre Dame's mission and Catholic social teaching. I mean, this girl started her own foundation, and did a ton of community service. In addition, her family donated a ton of money to Notre Dame so that less fortunate kids could get a chance to attend. So she's not good at taking tests? She shines so brightly in other areas, that the admissions people thought she deserved to attend. In addition, maintaining a relationship with her family probably benefits other students for years to come as they will continue to donate money. </p>
<p>Finally, it is wrong to assume that because you have higher SAT or ACT scores than someone else that you are more qualified than they are. Sitting for 5 hours (or how ever long that test is now-a-days) doesn't say much about your intelligence, or your character for that matter. As most people know, the SAT in particular is far from an equalizer, as certain groups of students (particularly minority students and students from poorer backgrounds) traditionally do worse on it. In addition, several studies have shown that the SAT doesn't predict one's success in college. If you ask me, they should be thrown out! I do agree with many who say that ND gives WAYYY too much attention to SAT scores.</p>
<p>I'm sad that Notre Dame had to reject so many well-qualified, amazing-sounding people, but that is the nature of the beast. It helps no one to attack those who got in.</p>
<p>We're complaining about a girl getting in with a 18xx SAT score, but check out the Stanford thread...there is a new member of the Cardinal freshman class with a 1700 SAT.</p>