Perhaps start doing the research about financial aid for students over 24 (“Independent”) - from the little bit I’ve heard, parents can still help with support. That could give a long term goal, after some short term part time school and/or work.
Thank you @jym626 , I thought that narcissistic personality disorder was now in recent years considered to be part of borderline personality disorder. Sorry that I muddled the two together!
My brother lived with us while he was going to tech school. It was payed for by our Dad because he was a prof at the school. But at somepoint he kind of dropped out because he got sick or something…but after awhile I said “I am happy to support you while you go to school, but if you are done with school then you are ready to go live your adult life.”
My suggestion to you is to consider reimbursing her for classes. Tell her if she gets a C (B, whatever) in a class you will reimburse her for the cost, but you cannot give her money up front anymore. Also that sometimes people that have a hard time planning things may need extra help and you are willing to work with therapy for that.
It is hard to say if this is immaturity, executive function disorder, or a personality disorder. I would try to help her get help to figure that out.
Number one, don’t let her make you feel guilty via her blaming or lashing out. That’s her own childish response and it does seem you have tried to be fair, all along.
As parents, we’re allowed to, at the right points , say, No Mas, no more, here are the conditions for our support, period. Sometimes, that’s hard on us and our own counseling helps walk us through that.
And it sounds like she needs to be back on her meds. I wonder if Dad mentioned that to the counselor, who might be willing to urge D to be reevaluated.
Thanks all – I am sure my divorce affected her; let’s say due the circumstances of her father leaving us it was particularly ugly. That said, the issues she has are not at all new, and surfaced far before-- she did regress once she no longer was under my roof (and in college away from home). And there she was stuck.
The mental health issues are common for those with her LD-- I appreciate all the feedback and the back up that not just ponying up all the time is ok.
Her father and I talked yesterday- he said that the trip to the counselor (him) with her was good as she reacted immaturely and over emotionally (and negatively) to his reasonable boundaries right in front of the counselor. So I think the counselor has a better perspective of how she reacts to us when faced with something she doesn’t want to hear even when reasonable. He did talk about meds-- I think the counselor is moving that way too.
You know, sometimes the back story and reasons just don’t matter in terms of the final decision about providing financial support. There are limited resources available, and when they’re gone they’re gone, especially when those limited resources need to provide for 4 children.
It is truly ok not to continue to pony up all the time. It is ok to cut off this child’s funding for school and rent support even though she’s got an LD and has some mental health issues. Those things do not obligate you to keep her on the payroll forever. Try not to feel so guilty, ok? She’s an adult. You can’t really force her to do anything, including take meds. At some point in the future could you step back in an reimburse her for cc classes that she does well in? Sure, but it’s also ok if you don’t because your resources have been used up.
@ordinarylives Thank you and in my mind I know, but it is hard for my heart., But the fact that she is unwilling to listen and accept that her issues are hers to deal with (LD and mental health) is the reason I have to make her fish or cut bait-- she just isn’t coming around this way and doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result makes no sense.
She may or may not have it -but The over emotionality and reacting negatively to something they don’t want to hear even when reasonable is hallmark BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). They can also SEEM perfectly capable and reasonable to counselors when “selling their story” i.e. when others aren’t around to contradict, or appear to criticize/abandon them (in their own minds), so this would explain why she may have appeared to be a different person to the counselor initially and the counselor didn’t pick up on the over emotional reactivity. You might want to read a bit about BPD to see what you think…
I just wanted to add that while CBT (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy) is good for many issues… it doesn’t work that well for BPD. They have had a lot of success with DBT - Dialectical Behavioral Therapy for BPD. You really need DBT for BPD!! It also works for many other issues and can help w over emotional/ immaturity…
Its harder to find trained counselors in DBT than CBT but worth the effort- Schema Therapy works too but its even harder to find. Unfortunately they haven’t found any medications to “cure” BPD like they have for Bipolar… but meds can be helpful in managing some symptoms but not the underlying emotional reactivity disorder… (getting BPD’s to comply w meds consistently though can be difficult…)
If you at all think she could be suffering from BPD it will save you years of drama to get her seen by a DBT specialist rather than a regular “counselor”…
I think it’s ok to let go of this dream. She tried, and tried again, and tried again, and you tried, and tried again, and tried again.
I would not pay anymore toward any kind of college. The most I would do is to help her pay off her loans after she GRADUATES and finds a stable job.
You can still be a fantastic parent to her without contributing to this difficult cycle.
Our D was making progress junior and senior year of HS with her therapist. It took us time to find someone skilled. We paid out of pocket for weekly sessions. Totally worth it. The summer post-graduation of HS, she seemed happier, and more stable than we’d seen her a long time.
As college approached, I was under the impression D would be transitioning to a new therapist in the city where her university is located. No, she was planning to Skype with her current therapist, weekly. $$$
That was okay for the first couple months, then we expressed our desire for her to transition to a more affordable option. (Story edited for brevity).
The unintended consequence was she abruptly dropped her Skype sessions with her therapist and when questioned, announced she had no intention of seeking out another therapist. Call me naive, but this turn of events took me by surprise. It didn’t occur to me she might decide to drop out of treatment.
We have observed over Columbus Day weekend, Thanksgiving, and Xmas break, that she is not as happy or as stable as before. She refuses to be “interrogated”. She is barreling towards independence, but I do wish she’d allow us to pay for the copays for a therapist covered under her insurance. I wish we could have a “normal” conversation, but clearly she is fighting tooth and nail for her privacy.
I’m not even sure if she is compliant with her meds. She signed releases, but the doctor will not say so as not to breech confidentiality.
We do not know what she is using for money. As far as we know, she doesn’t have a job on campus. Is her BF giving her money? Was she approved for a credit card? No idea.
There is so much that is out of our control, and yes, they have to take responsibility for their own lives. Hard to watch.
Our D made the most progress when she switched to a skilled DBT therapist, who in turn, recommended a psychiatrist.
Ours made the most strides when she switched to a psychiatrist who specializes in this age group. It wasn’t the nature of the therapy but the savvy and commitment of the practitioner. It can vary, for each person.
@Midwest67 I am so sorry you are going through this as well – What you are saying sounds like the exact same story line as my daughter with the therapist and the medicine. My daughter lied to me about it but being as I could see claims online for my insurance and that I needed to actually fill it for her and mail it I knew she wasn’t. (She tells me a lot of lies but is not at all adept at it).
I wish I could get her to do anything as far as therapy and meds-- I am not sure if she will even keep going to this therapist. Her father made it a condition of living there and now she is moving out. It is heartbreaking to watch them crash and burn. Hugs to you,
I went to a NAMI family support meeting last night and someone there highly recommended the book “I Am Not Sick, I Don’t Need Help!”.
https://www.amazon.com/Someone-Mental-Illness-Treatment-Anniversary/dp/0967718937
Although the tagline of the book is “How to Help Someone With Mental Illness Accept Treatment”, the person who recommended it wasn’t selling it as a step-by-step method to achieve that goal, but rather as a way to get tips on different language we can use with our loved one, and tips on avoiding power struggles.
I saw it’s available at Audible, so I’ve downloaded it to my phone.
Another tip someone gave at the meeting was to use the phrase “You may be right” to de-escalate conversations where there is a tendency to get into a disagreement.
Hugs to you too. You are not alone!
I gather she’s a horse person. Any chance that she could get a job at a stable of some kind? Maybe grooming and exercising horses and mucking out stalls would help her attain some equanimity. Partially through the sheer physicality of the work. Rather than trying to take classes.