Indeed, but there’s a misconception that programs are either/or. As you know, they aren’t.
This! This is the thing that most people forget.
If you are capable of getting into Berkeley, or Cal Tech, or MIT, or Cornell, you’re probably the kind of student who will on the whole be ultimately JUST as successful as a student that chooses to go to Rutgers or Binghamton or UNCC. In fact, I’ve personally seen that studently in the top 5% of one of those less prestigious programs get the plum research gigs with the best profs, the best internships, and the best opportunities post-grad, because it’s based on the drive of the student.
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He did this last year and hopes to do it again this year.
Great! Think you can apply and get a small college scholarship also… At Ace… It’s a great program as you know.
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Great points. We are in the RDU area, which is booming as is the CLT area. So, NCSU and UNCC are basically 1-2 for my son. I am not sure if he will get into NCSU because he is not a very high stat kid. UNCC is a definite match. My concern is what happens after 4 years? We are looking at schools in TX but financially, they do not make a lot of sense. I mean is Tx Tech any better than UNCC? Or, is A&M better than NCSU?
We are exploring private schools after my initial reluctance, but once again, the value of extra $$ has to be justifiable.
Some of us have kids that are mere mortals. Lol.
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For civil engineering, there is also NC A&T as well as NCSU and UNCC among public universities in North Carolina. The only other school in the state with civil engineering is Duke. See https://amspub.abet.org/aps/category-search?disciplines=15&countries=US&states=NC .
Be aware that NCSU has competitive secondary admission to major after entering as engineering-first-year.
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What about UTK or U of SC? They offer a wider level of merit with a slightly lower threshold for admissions; it’s worth running the NPCs.
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Ncsu has really become much harder to get into these last 6 years. It’s a really good school but being instate you really have the advantage. Look at the metrics for his school of what is needed to get in so at least you know how realistic it is.
If your willing to share his unweighted GPA and any stats and what math /science he will end in senior year that might be helpful. But of course you don’t have to.
If you look further though many other options at good schools like Iowa and Iowa State University.
Kettering and Michigan Tech.
Illinois Institute of technology.
I am sure others will list their favorites but all will get you good jobs. The last one will net you work locally at some of the largest firms worldwide…
In answer to the original question: Obviously not. Not if you are expecting a clear-cut set of requirements from ABET itself. A visit to the website reads like a police department press conference briefing:
- ABET accredits programs not institutions.
- It’s up to the institution to define what the program’s goals are.
- The institution must provide evidence that those goals are being met (including post-graduate career results.)
- The curriculum must include a minimum of 30 semester credit hours of math.
- The curriculum must include a minimum of 45 semester credit hours of “engineering topics”.
That’s basically it. There are over 800 accredited programs in the U.S. and worldwide.
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That is not “basically it.” The documentation on the criteria is 44 pages. It’s not like programs just say I want it and it’s granted. Agree with it or not, it’s an arduous, robust process.
ME is the most popular engineering program. You can use it as a reasonable proxy for the total number of schools with ABET accredited programs in the US. It’s not exact, because a handful of schools offer only General Engineering. Most schools won’t offer the more esoteric majors like MatE, Nuclear or even ChemE if they don’t have ME. There are 344 ABET accredited ME programs in the US.
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I know the general requirements and GPA/SAT for NCSU. I do not know if it is easier or harder for CivE. Anyway, son will end up with 3.5-ish uw and 4.1-4.2 w. SAT right now is 1400 with limited/little prep 730M. Will probably retake in Aug. I will have a better idea once AP scores come out. I am hoping a strong SAT will overcome low GPA.
Yes. We are well aware. One needs 3.5 GPA to apply after completing the 6 prereqs. The CODA stats are available. What that means is 4 in Calc BC will likely doom an applicant. See my comment related to AP. If he gets a 5 then we might be ok. If not, then UNCC will be his likely destination or some other school.
ME is the most popular engineering program. You can use it as a reasonable proxy for the total number of schools with ABET accredited programs in the US.
There are 344 ABET accredited ME programs in the US.
That leaves about 500+ programs that are either more stringent or less stringent than the “gold standard”. It’s still an argument for the OP doing their own DD.
https://www.engr.ncsu.edu/academics/undergrad/coda/ indicates that the minimum GPA for EFY students to apply to a major (CODA) is 2.0. However, admission to majors is competitive, and it looks like there is no current information about what GPA levels have been needed to be admitted to each major.
Looks like the CODA GPA effect of AP calculus scores is listed at https://www.engr.ncsu.edu/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/EngineeringNewStudentOrientation_Math_Spring2022.pdf . It does look like some of the assumed grades from the AP score can be replaced by higher grades in subsequent courses.
There is nothing wrong with his stats /GPA… There are schools for everyone out there. Engineering in college is about perseverance and in my mind the willing to get help. Many, many 4.0 GPA unweighted, 33 Act kids don’t make it past the first quiz or midterm. Check out the one’s I posted to give you an idea. All with excellent outcomes.
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For most schools, GPA is the first litmus test.
I’m not following how you’re deriving that and what it means. I know the OP is looking at Civil, but if there are 500+ “more stringent” ME programs than those that are ABET accredited, maybe you can list 10 of them.
ABET is not the be all, end all. It is bureaucratic and restrictive. It’s also not particularly germane to CS, unless you want to work in certain sectors. That said, the few who opt out are the bluest of blue blood names, and they generally cite good reasons. Having a non-ABET accredited degree from Caltech isn’t the same as one from Podunk U.
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But Cal tech is a huge outlier right?
I think there are many,. Many great engineering schools for his son. Seems to me the dad is being realistic in his quest which personally is refreshing to see.
On here too many get hung up with brand name. But the real question to me is do you want to be an engineer? If so, pick the best school that will help you make that happen and then be involved in that school once on campus.
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Ha! Fair enough and it sound more elitist than I meant!
I’m actually quite against the level of Toxic Elitism we see here on CC – that’s not my phrase by the way; it’s stolen from @aquapt (who I actually know in real life) but it fits so well that I love using it! My point is that as long as a program is good enough – and I believe most ABET-accredited programs are – that kids can work hard, do well, and make their own opportunities wherever they go to school. Not everybody wants to work at a start-up (I’ve done it and the hours are grueling and only a small number make it big), and not everybody wants to work at a Facebook, Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Apple etc (the FAANG gang), but there’s a lot of great paying engineering jobs with lots of growth opportunity everywhere. NJIT or Rutgers will get you a great job too.
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No, no. I was referring to the total number of ABET approved programs (~850 and that’s from theirwebsite) minus the number you say are strictly ME (“the proxy for U.S. programs”.) That leaves ~500 non-ME programs that nevertheless meet ABET approval in the USA and around the world. That’s all I’m saying.