<p>Would you consider the profession of a doctor as to be generally less respected than other professions in the US? </p>
<p>No.</p>
<p>"BDM,</p>
<p>Good quote. I just watched that ep. a few days ago"</p>
<p>Yes. I also like Bigredmed's</p>
<p>"It's been said, "the physician's job is to entertain the patient while nature cures the disease."
That's what I was getting at in post 17;</p>
<p>Shrinkrap,</p>
<p>A buddy of mine said that a doctor's best weapons are rest and Gatorade. Now that I look back at most of my visits to the UCLA clinic, I think it's pretty much true.</p>
<p>Unless it's a tick. Then I get devil throwup antibiotics. :rolleyes:</p>
<p>This thread has been extremely informative, thanks to your continuous contribution (BDM, Shrinkrap, BRM and many others...) In a few pages, I have been exposed to so much changing, so much "catharsis". </p>
<p>This thread has illustrated to me I need to become more involved on the "other" side of the consultation room, to learn more about this elusive profession of a physician, and to learn more about this attitude lying between aloofness and sympathy. This means more shadowing, more involvement and introspection.</p>
<p>I hope I will come have my own conclusion about doctors in the years to come. Meanwhile, I wish everyone the best of luck!!
Thanks! :)</p>
<p>Which Career Fields
Do People Respect? </p>
<p>By Wall Street Journal Staff Reporters
Want a job that will wow them at parties? Then study the sciences.</p>
<p>That's the message from the Harris Poll's annual survey of attitudes toward a cross section of occupations. Of 1,011 adults surveyed nationwide, 51% said scientist was a job with "very great prestige." Doctors were right behind with 50%, followed by military officers and teachers, each with 47%, and police officers, with 40%.</p>
<p>Of that top five, though, only the uniformed professions saw gains from the prior year. Military officers rose seven percentage points, while police climbed three points, moves that Harris attributed to the effects of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks and the war in Afghanistan.</p>
<p>Scientists fell two points from last year, while doctors dropped 11 percentage points. Teachers saw esteem for their positions fall seven percentage points, Harris said.</p>
<p>Amid the corporate accounting scandals, at the bottom of this year's list were accountants. Only 13% of those surveyed said they felt the profession carried "very great prestige," down two percentage points.</p>
<p>Here are more highlights from the latest survey.</p>
<p>VeryGreat Prestige Considerable Prestige Some Prestige Hardly Prestige ?/ Refused<br>
Scientist 51% 25% 20% 2% 3%<br>
Doctor 50 30 17 1 2<br>
Military Officer 47 27 21 3 2<br>
Teacher 47 23 20 7 2<br>
Police Officer** 40 32 20 7 1<br>
Priest/Clergyman 36 25 24 11 3<br>
Engineer 34 32 28 4 2<br>
Architect 27 34 31 4 4<br>
Member of Congress 27 30 29 11 3<br>
Athlete 21 24 37 15 3<br>
Entertainer 19 29 34 15 3<br>
Journalist 19 25 41 12 4<br>
Business Executive** 18 29 36 13 4<br>
Lawyer 15 25 38 20 2<br>
Banker 15 29 44 10 2<br>
Union Leader 14 22 37 23 5<br>
Accountant 13 23 42 17 4</p>
<p>Why do nurses call patients in from the waiting room?</p>
<p>Because they take care of some very specific, very important information that helps the doctor best utilize his or her time. To the untrained, you may think that taking vital signs (blood pressure, temperature, pulse rate and respiration rate) isn't that important, but trust me, that's information that can often go a really long way in telling you what's wrong with the patient. </p>
<p>Further, getting some very initial chief complaint things out of the way makes for a much easier interview. Believe me, I've gone in blind with very reticent patients who aren't giving much in the way of answers, it can be an absolute chore. Having some idea of where to direct the conversation is a huge help. Plus it allows doctors the opportunity to reallocate their time. If you know that you have a healthy person in room one who just needs a prescription refill, you can take care of that really quickly, leaving more time to deal with the patient in room 2 who you need to tell that they have diabetes. Making your patient with diabetes wait 8 minutes so that you can spend 22 minutes (instead of just 15) with them is good trade off. If physicians were calling or waiting for patients to come in, it would make these sorts of decisions impossible.</p>
<p>I'm not saying there's a lack of respect for the title physicians hold in the US. I'm saying that on a very basic human relationship level, some patients are just mean. Further, are you a bundle of sunshine when you're sick and have been up since 3AM last night vomiting your guts out? I don't care how nice you are when healthy, when you're ill, I'm expecting the worse from you.</p>
<p>"Every day, we see people on the worst day of their lives."</p>
<p>BDM, what film are you talking about. It seems like I could learn more about the life of a physician by seeing it that by shadowing.</p>
<p>Also, do you guys have any suggestions of shadowing experience that could give me the exact picture of the hectic life of a physician. For example, how could I see "see people on the worst day of their lives." in my shadowing experiences? I really want to know to see how much emotional aloofness I could exhibit, how much I could withstand. I am still looking forward to get a volunteering post at the local hospital, but do you have any advices so that I can have a better idea of the downside in the life of a physician.
Or where I could see patients being "mean" to physicians.
I really want to know how much I like medecine, and how much I dislike it.
Any advices are more than welcome!</p>
<p>What?</p>
<p>The quote in post #46 isn't medically related at all. It's from a CSI book which my uncle gave me. It's just that what BRM said reminded me of that.</p>
<p>Do you have an idea how I could learn more about the "culture" of the physician? (to me, it seems thousands of light years from the world I know)</p>
<p>Shadowing.</p>
<p>I can recall a local college trying to set up a "shadowing" experience at the HMO I worked at. They called it a "medical school", but somehow, I doubt it. Anyway, it was very inconvenient and distracting to try to work that in when you are trying to do things efficiently and get the most out of your interaction with a patient. Again, keep in mind I work in Psychiatry where rapport and confidentiality can make or bereak you. It seems to me emergency room or EMT work would give you a glimpse. My husband did EMT stuff in HS.</p>
<p>Ahh... *Shrink*rap...I get it.</p>
<p>You psychiatrists are so clever.</p>
<p>Shadow long enough and you'll see patients getting upset with physicians. </p>
<p>When I was in HS and shadowing an orthopedic surgeon, he showed me a letter from a patient we had seen the previous week which drug him through the mud b/c he didn't touch the patient at all while meeting with her and told her to lose weight (he was absolutely right, but I learned then that it's always a good idea to at least listen to a patient's heart and lungs or something before leaving them).</p>
<p>I witnessed a nurse (with the permission of my preceptor during my M1 year) "fire" a patient (who happened to be a nurse) for calling in her own prescription. That was a ridiculous argument that lasted all afternoon on the phone...</p>
<p>There's another observation about medical students, which may have actually come from a study (I don't remember exactly): when students start out as first years, they identify with the patients. By the time they have started their third year, and definitely by the time they graduate, they identify with the physicians. It's a paradigm shift, and something that probably explains why you feel that the culture of physicians is "light years" away from you.
As someone who is going through that paradigm shift, I can tell you, it happens. And it's just an all encompassing shift. Most people wouldn't spend a day in the hospital - even if not a patient - if you paid them to, and yet, I'm there from 8-12 hours a day. I also think it's a necessary one when you have to make that transition from being the injured to the healer.</p>
<p>Anyways, for the most "jarring" view of medicine as a layperson, I think your best bet is probably something like volunteering in the ER or on an Oncology service. Shadowing will give you interaction with a physician who might explain things to you, why things are going on, but for a true observational experience it'd probably be better to be in a less "immediate vicinity" setting. ( I realize that sounds paradoxical)</p>
<p>Just watched the ER stuff on the Health Channel (not the reacting one but the one where it is actually at that time). I wonder how well does it depict life in the ER. Is the Health Channel accurate (not in its re-acting stuff, of course)?</p>
<p>I kind of understood the distanciation process with the emergency medecine intern girl (third year) who made allusion to it. </p>
<p>How hard is it to distanciate yourself?
Is it heart wrenching sometimes as a doctor to actually repress your sympathy, or is it an automatic process that will occur instinctively as your progress through your medical eduction?
How lonely do you feel as doctors (no one to understand you, etc...)?</p>
<p>Is it bad if you actually start out med school with the attitude of the interns (lonely, cold, very professional etc)? If yes, why? Or is it a plus?</p>
<p>I kind of got what you meant with using jokes to bear all that stuff. Actually, interns are reknowned for morbid jokes.</p>
<p>For me I think I've noticed most that I'm able to focus in on a patient emotionally when I'm there one on one, but once I leave the room, it's somewhat out of sight, out of mind.</p>
<p>The notable exceptions have been for the people I've treated who are close to my age. Had one 23 year old come with a rare type of cervical cancer and another 25 year old for a Nissen fundoplication to control her GERD, and the operation had some complications requiring her to stay in the hospital a little longer. I wouldn't say that it was rough, but I thought about those patients alot more and found myself thinking about how I would feel if it was my girlfriend or one of my roommates or another close friend in those situations. </p>
<p>I'm not sure it's really a plus or minus sort of thing if your personality type is distant. That's just the way you are. What it most likely means is that certain specialties won't be high on your list. If you're really cold, it's not likely you're going to be heading for pediatrics. Likewise if you love developing relationships with your patients, you're not likely to become a radiologist. And all that's okay. That's one of the great things about medicine is that it requires all types.</p>
<p>Also, the quote from BDM most closely resembles a quote from the movie "Office Space"
...ever since I started working, every single day of my life has been worse than the day before it. So that means that every single day that you see me, that's on the worst day of my life.</p>
<p>Do med school actually try to diversify their applicants pool attitude (cold vs compassionate)? Or do they try to look only for the outgoing, social, extroverted and amusing kind of person?</p>
<p>Certainly all of my classmates are very... uh, amusing. Although it's usually not because they're outgoing, social, or extroverted... it's usually an unintentional kind of ironic amusing...</p>
<p>Right. Do you mean the morbid irony? If yes, then I kind of picture it.
Any one has an idea for my questions in post 54?</p>