Are Princeton's Financial Aid Offers the Real Deal?

<p>Byerly--You continually "bash" Princeton. You do this by disparaging it when others make positive posts about it. You criticize its eating clubs, its study abroad policies and its transfer policies (using the example of one football player who decided to repeat freshman year as some sort of heinous hypocrisy on the part of Princeton). You do this by posting, whenever a talented student decides to attend Princeton, that he or she did not get into Harvard. You have criticized its town and its admissions director and its sports teams.</p>

<p>I don't know why you feel the need to get indignant every now and then and claim that you are not bashing Princeton. You do it constantly and I wish you would stop.</p>

<p>*When did I criticize its sports teams? Princeton recruits great athletes in great number for a school of its size. </p>

<p>*Princeton NJ is a tidy, upscale suburban community, which, while not too exciting, would be a nice place to retire to.</p>

<ul>
<li><p>There is nothing "wrong" with its study abroad program; no school is required to have one. I merely point out that an expanded study abroad program could facilitate a more liberal transfer program - extending it to non-athletes.</p></li>
<li><p>I am a big fan of its Admissions Director - Ms. Rapelye - and think she has changed Princeton for the better as compared to her predecessor. Princeton has accepted a lower yield rate in order to pursue top students rather than the "Princeton Type" favored by her predecessor.</p></li>
<li><p>Similarly, Princeton deserves credit for efforts to become more diverse - (1) pursuing what its President calls "the green-haired people" - ie, artsy types who tended to avoid Princeton in the past, and (2) changing housing arrangements in order to marginalize the "eating clubs."</p></li>
</ul>

<p>These are all GOOD THINGS ABOUT PRINCETON!</p>

<p>Looks like I'm not the only one who feels this way Byerly...</p>

<p>Buck up, "Timberlake." Princeton is a fine school. Keep your chin up. If you succeed in getting in, you should be proud of yourself.</p>

<p>I don't really care about whether Byerly's posts qualify as bashing or not. There used to be a lot of trolls on this board in past years, so I assume the worst whenever I take the time to come back.</p>

<p>I will admit that there are many problematic aspects of the Princeton campus. Byerly is right in pointing out that Princeton does have its flaws. But as an applicant and now a student at Princeton, I think the problem with these boards is that they overdramatize the problems.</p>

<p>Let's take the eating clubs as an example. Rumor has it that the eating clubs are elitist and worsen the experience for poor students who can't afford to join. People cite newspaper articles from the Daily Prince on the eating club financial aid initiative to prove their point.</p>

<p>Certainly, the elitist image of the eating clubs is not entirely false. Yet the problem is overblown outside of campus -- rarely do I meet students who share such negative sentiments of the entire system. I myself am not a fan of them due to their financial cost, yet not joining a club has not restricted my social life to any particular degree. I have good friends in many clubs who will easily get me passes to get in to the selective bicker clubs. The non-selective clubs are always open on the weekends for students to party at. Yes, certain clubs may draw more of a certain type, but most people don't confine themselves to one club. Since they're all located along one street, students will often club-hop throughout a night.</p>

<p>The social scene I just described is not what is written about on these boards. Instead, what I read is about financial restrictions, elitism, and class conflict as "major problems" of Princeton. The system is indeed flawed and could be improved, but keep in mind that the clubs are only part of a student's experience. The papers don't publish on the mundane, everyday experience of students - it only writes about problems, changes, and flaws that certain individuals will point out. And in publicizing such flaws, we forget about the positive aspects of the college experience that overwhelm any negative things we notice.</p>

<p>Finally, I think it's idiotic to constantly post about Harvard's high yield. Harvard's high yield is less a result of it providing a better "experience" than its commanding lead in reputation, nationally and internationally. Kids will have fun at whichever college they choose, be it Princeton, Harvard, or even a (gasp!) less selective school. USNews is heavily at fault for this, too; by distilling a school's essence into mere numbers, it attempts to say something about an experience at that school. Unless the stats discrepancy is huge, you really can't say one school is better than the other is this or that aspect. </p>

<p>If admitted students are forced to make their choice on numbers and a short visit, their choice is not entirely informed because they simply have no conception of what college is like, and only after the complete four years will students gain a true understanding. What they need to understand is that each person's experience is individual and unique. Both Princeton and Harvard offer the resources and the environment to help students have fun and acheive their dreams. These resources are there, but it is ultimately the student who must shape his or her experience. The posters here, from my past experiences, end up debating the smallest points of each school and seem to forget that important lesson.</p>

<p>So, why debate stats? We should be encouraging kids to visit. We should have informed current students talking about their experiences here.</p>

<p>Well, Byerly, among other posts, there was the following about a Ms. Saiontz, a top Princeton tennis recruit (managing to disparage both her and the team in the same post--way to go Byerly):</p>

<p>Obviously a "strategic" ED application, attracted by that 29% ED admission rate!</p>

<p>And it looks like the mediocre Princeton ladies tennis squad can use all the help it can get!</p>

<p>As to its study abroad program, you charmingly noted the following:</p>

<p>Yoyu are entitled to your opinion, but I am merely saying that claiming "our students love it here so much they don't want to leave" is a total crock ... a standard rationalization by those who haven't bestirred themselves to make a program work - either summer or term-time.</p>

<p>I don't really think that I need to prove to anyone that you bash Princeton--you obviously do. The only question I have is why you continue to deny it.</p>

<p>MZhang--that was a wonderful post. Thank you for your thoughtful and wise comments</p>

<p>I have a little trouble following most of your posts, mom. But if you think I don't have enormous regard for Princeton ... well, rest easy: I do. And despite what an earlier poster - mzhang23 - implies, I think Princeton, as Harvard, enjoys a "commanding reputation."</p>

<p>And I endorse 100% the sentiment that any kid admitted to more than one school should visit before deciding.</p>

<p>I similarly agree - and have stated many, many times - that most kids will be prefectly happy no matter <em>where</em> they end up at college. For this reason, I think the whole concept of "fit" is much overdone; college students tend to "fit" pretty well wherever they end up matriculating.</p>

<p>It is true that Princeton is very generous with financial aid !!! The girl i know got money-showered :D</p>

<p>Princeton was far and away the best package we got, thank goodness! </p>

<p>As for study abroad ... now that I'm going to Princeton, I doubt I'll want to be gone for one of my precious eight semesters! If I'd gone to ND, where I've lived my whole life, perhaps I would study abroad ... but why spend a semester at Princeton traveling when you have your whole life to travel and four years at that fine institution?</p>

<p>For people like us who will depend on financial aid to send kids to college, they would definitely benefit with the financial aid data information. Thus, it is so important for us to choose schools based on the financial aid data.</p>

<p>Hooray for midatlmom!!</p>

<p>The bickering only starts when Byerly intrudes with his tirades.</p>

<p>Back to the real issue of this thread - Yes, tokenadult, the fin aid at Princeton is wonderful and real and has enabled D to attend and receive and ivy education when we otherwise couldn't have afforded it. It was above and beyond our expectations!! As far as we are concerned, Princeton is the most generous and warm and welcoming institution in the world.</p>