Yes, I understand about expressions of interest (registered visits, contact with admissions, ED applications, etc…)
My son visited one college with his girlfriend – they stayed with GF’s sister, who was a senior there and who gave them an unofficial tour. When he later decided to apply, we went back for an “official” tour in order to “show interest.” (Although the tour we went on was after he had already submitted his application).
My concern is using the timing of application submission i* as a measure of interest.
Rolling admissions is a whole 'nother game – I am focused on schools that have a set deadline (for each round), and only announce admission decisions (for that round) well after that deadline.
My son contacted only 2 schools before decisions were made (we went to visit only because the climate was so different from ours and didn’t want him blind. Applications were in about a week early, refused to do early action/ED for anything, and he got in everywhere. He is an Eagle Scout, so that may have contributed to his high yield.
I sent my friends the info on rolling admissions and got a little more info. The one with decent grades only wanted to apply to UCs but in the face of other candidates didn’t measure up. Mom was not happy with his admissions approach, but decided to let him learn the hard way. And now he is open to non UCs. They are meeting with a college counselor next week. The other kid I know well is going to CC with full scholarship (yes, it’s cheap but the family can’t afford much) for the first year. He’s a kid who will do well and can live at home without too much problem.
@mom2twogirls - Go speak with the English teacher about this. I eventually needed to directly address a couple of Happykid’s teachers who were all “Oh you should apply to XYZ because it is the best for your major.” which was pretty true at the time, but utterly unaffordable for us.
“I find this really bothersome, if true. Any application submitted by the advertised deadline should be given due consideration.”
@colfac92 She also said the last minute application meant they did not have time to visit.
At colleges where “demonstrated interest” IS a factor in admissions decisions, which can be determined with research, last minute applications can appear to be just what they are- a last minute “what the H**l” submission by a student who was not really interested in going there in the first place.
As with so many of the discussions on cc, the experience is regional and the change depends on where you live. I suspect for people in the coastal New England area and CA, the admissions landscape is changing for the worse as things open up so that applicants from other regions are made aware of colleges and even sought after by the colleges. The kids from NY might be finding it less of a given to gain admission to schools in that area, but the kids in Mississippi might find their school is seeing a student admitted to an Ivy League college for the first time ever for example.
At my sons’ magnet school in FL, we didn’t see much of a change in the overall admissions rates to top 20 type colleges but we did see more students aware of and applying to schools that weren’t on the radar in the past like the smaller NE LACs, WashU, Case Western and some West Coast schools.
The one trend we saw - and this is probably true all over the US - is the strong trend towards early applications conferring an admissions advantage. While the overall numbers admitted to top 20 selectives looks similar to prior years, this year almost all those admissions were for students who applied SCEA, EA or ED. Very few admissions to the top 20 selectives in the RD rounds, which wasn’t the case as few as 3 years ago.
“My concern is using the timing of application submission”
One shouldn’t expect a college that factors in demonstrated interest to try to “parse out” the reason for a last minute application or ignore when it was submitted.
Its a “sellers market” out there, and there are lots of “buyers”.
I don’t know of anyone getting locked out completely. But having to go to State U because they didn’t get in anywhere else (all super-reaches) seems to be a thing at our high school. And lots of disappointment there. I know three boys that this happened to last year (MIT, Harvard, etc. were their targets) and it happened to a friend’s daughter this year. (The friend is a little concerned because the daughter is not at all happy about starting college.) I don’t know many parents of current seniors, so there could be more.
@overbearingmom, I’m curious about the schools he ended up choosing as better bets, since it sounds like I’m in a similar boat… looking for strong math/STEM that are TRUE “fits” and not overreaches. Thanks!
I think a near deadline app has no impact for a kid who has shown interest — at least been on the email/mailing list for some time, maybe signed in at a college fair booth. Of course a visit or attending an event near your home is interest, too. D1 visited a school, interviewed when they came to our city and offered the opportunity, and applied EA to her safety. They gave her admission EA and a fat merit scholarship - and she decided to attend. One of her best friends from the same HS had almost identical grades and test scores. She added them to her list late, showed no interest, and put in an app late in the RD cycle. Rejected.
D2’s put in her app on the last day to the college she attended. But she had visited, and put a lot of thought into her essays
Colleges aren’t stupid.
We saw a big jump in waitlists this year in our community group. High stats kids getting into more competitive schools but waitlisted at most if not all their matches.
My son knows a couple kids who didn’t get in “anywhere” but they only applied to reach schools.
@Westernkid My son is planning to double major in linguistics and math, and maybe linguistics as an interest was hook as well as the Eagle Scout, who knows. He got into UCSD, which is good in Math, UCSC, and UCSB and he chose to not apply to UCLA and Cal or the others. He also applied to University of Denver, RIT, CU Boulder, and CU Denver (which is strong in medicine). My son spent 3 weeks in Denver last summer and loved it, so I think he applied there because of comfort level. All OOS gave him Merit aid, making them within $1k of the UCs (to which we didn’t get a penny in aid). DU was $8k more, even with aid, but he eliminated it pretty early.
My husband went to an elite school and was crippled by stress, so I never had any interest in my son going to any of them (UCs I could live with). It gets you first job out the door, but I think, especially for my son, the experience of living life independent with training wheels is what is important in the college student. Unless you’ve heard bad things about the level of education, there are 1000s of great schools out there, and most kids only even know about a fraction of them.
@turtletime The son of one of my closest friends just experienced that. Into Princeton and Columbia…waitlisted at Harvard and Brown…rejected by Johns Hopkins and Northwestern. Extremely high stats kid; all state jazz; self motivated. Really an odd year.
Now that my youngest is 22, I know fewer people with kids applying, but a friend’s child who is a very strong student applied to only a handful of very competitive schools and ended up with rejections and one waitlist. Parent tried to get the child to apply to other schools but the child refused to. The plan this fall is cc.
For a child with high stats, a gap year is better than cc, because 1) they preserve their freshman status for scholarships (transfers get lousy aid) 2) getting a job teaches a lot of skills and values that an entitled child needs to learn through experience.
So, for kids who refuse to apply to matches and safeties I’d strongly advocate a minimum wage job gap year.
^ Not always. I the example I mentioned above, if the child does well at our local cc (which is a very good one), she stands an very good chance of transferring. The school does take kids who do just that.The school is a in state public which gives little merit (and a child who is WL wouldn’t get anyway), parents know they do not qualify for FA. So scholarships aren’t a factor.
This child has worked a minimum wage job for 2 years in HS. Not “entitled” at all.
One size does Not fit all.
I haven’t seen any kids who did not get in anywhere, but I’ve seen quite a few kids who only got to one or two schools which were thought to be their super safeties, and they never imagined that they’d end up there and applied just in case.
No. Almost Everyone applies to the state flagship and its a safety and for mid to high ranking kids. The counseling office has kids that don’t seem like theyd get in 100 percent for sure apply to other schools that are auto admits. No one aiming high here would dream of going to a CC. Once in a while a disappointed kid does a pricy gap year like Where There Be Dragons.
Several of my CC students have not been accepted anywhere for transfer. It is heartbreaking. Don’t quite know what to say to them… They will spend another year at CC and accumulate some good experiences and some useless credits and try again next year, I guess.
Part of the challenge is that your students may be trying to transfer after only spending one or two terms at the CC. While they may be doing great now, their high school record is still carrying more weight. They may need a little more distance between them and the good times they let roll in high school.
Some students would be better served, staying at the CC until they complete the associates. They would definitely have more options and minimally be guaranteed a seat at your 4-year state school.
Part of the issue for transfers is that many universities are less transparent in terms of transfer admission information than for frosh admission information, so assessing reach/match/likely/safety is more difficult for many universities.
UCs may be an exception with the nice table at https://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/infocenter/transfers-major , but how well known is this table among those who want to transfer to UCs?