<p>Bay and PP I am sure that they don’t want or need your pity. The point is as the kids in the article have conveyed, it is truly awkward to be the poor kid among the full freight payers. I am sure that these very adaptable kids will find their way eventually, it’s just an interesting social study, the juxtaposition of being thrown into the executive washroom feeling when you’ve always been the bathroom attendant so to speak.</p>
<p>Bay - I am glad for your admission, and appreciate it. It is entirely understandable, given your social and economic position, and would take a great effort for you to feel otherwise. I have talked with some of my classmates over the past 40 years, and they were just as blind as I was. They had no experience that would have led them (at that point in their young lives) to have other feelings or understandings, and they certainly were not aided by their school administration, who, after all, had admitted students like me essentially for their benefit.</p>
<p>I am very grateful to my alma mater to have given me an extraordinary opportunity. I just wish that they had (and other institutions today would have) thought it through a little better.</p>
<p>Hmm… I never thought about it that way, Bay. Admittedly, I’ve only been to one of America’s “richest” colleges and I honestly didn’t really even notice the amenities!</p>
<p>Mini, what would you have them do? </p>
<p>Being poor is not pleasant in school or out. And, I imagine it would be just as bad for a middle class kid who is every bit as unfamiliar with designer clothes and handbags and a steady supply of 5-dollar coffee drinks as any truly poor student. Your opportunity was amazing.</p>
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<p>A million studies in the past have proven that. As you put it in the very next sentence, no one that I’m aware of has proven causation. </p>
<p>I’m having trouble gleaning any actual new knowledge from it. It seems to say that poor kid are poor and can’t spend money on crap that rich kids spend money on. Does that about sum it up? If so, I hope one day I can be published in Forbes for telling people something they already know. </p>
<p>And what is this crap about paying for transportation to interviews? I’ve never heard of a company that expects you to pay for transportation to an interview unless the company is local. If a company is doing that, don’t interview there. That bit is pure garbage. </p>
<p>For books, most of them can be downloaded as PDFs now. And if not, at least at my school, they’re in the library. No sympathy for anyone complaining about not being able to afford books (and this is public, so I can’t imagine it wouldn’t be the case at a private school). It’s pretty easy to afford free. </p>
<p>And let me be clear before someone misattributes something to me. I’m not denigrating the students here at all. I’m denigrating the article (and by association the author herself I guess) because this is a really bad article. It’s garbage designed drum up sympathy with no actual valuable content.</p>
<p>I’m just not fond of these types of articles because I don’t think there is a problem. If you take the deal you take the deal. Institutions offer the deal, as I said before, because it is their initiative. If a student takes the deal then so be it. I will concede that both the colleges and the students accepting the deal need to be clear about the terms and again setting those terms (does it cover healthcare, is there a stipend for sundries, etc.) is part of the deal and it’s only clear that everyone involved understands what that means in real time. But I really don’t “care” what those colleges do, I don’t see it as an imperative in need of a solution in any general national arena. I’d rather focus my energy on public education both K-12 and universities accessibility and quality.</p>
<p>Well, Proud Patriot, these low income kids DO work. They do work study during school and work their hineys off in the summer to scratch up enough money to pay for books, food, clothes, all those kinds of things. The ones I know who are full ride are very appreciative of what the college has provided them and certainly “deserve” every penny of financial aid they are given.</p>
<p>Why would the poor want to attend the richest colleges?</p>
<p>I know its obvious. But it’s a choice that people make so why is anyone concerned about the impact of other peoples choices?</p>
<p>The poor are probably under-represented at yacht clubs, polo tournaments and country clubs but I wouldn’t care about their plight should they choose to spend every penny being a member of one. I think that’s why there are a diversity of schools so that everyone doesn’t have to go through an expensive and elite program to get a good college education.</p>
<p>It’s not that easy for a first-year student to find a job on campus. At my D’s school, work-study students are not guaranteed a job on campus and must scramble to find one. Many wind up working off campus.</p>
<p>And Mini is absolutely right about the class cluelessness of most college students. Whether they are wealthy, middle class or poor, they only know the world they know at least until they’ve lived a little longer and experienced more of the world.</p>
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<p>Well do you think that lower middle class kids, whose parents are paying some tuition for them have that money laying around? Do you think they get the money beforehand? Do you think their parents are paying the student contribution? No-they get jobs over the summer and they save the money they need for those things. Then they get jobs when they are at school. Their parents are so strapped PAYING for college that there is frequently no money left for books, going out, or other luxuries. </p>
<p>It is hard for me to feel sorry for kids who are being given the opportunity to attend school at very little cost. I don’t want their money taken away but I am tired of hearing how hard it is for them.</p>
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<p>Nobody said they didn’t deserve the money. I’m just tired of hearing how hard it is for them to get by.</p>
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<p>I don’t pity these students. I think it’s great that they have the opportunity to obtain a first class education. I am just tired of hearing how awful it is for them because they have to work.</p>
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<p>As someone who has worked on college campuses for years, let me try to explain . . .</p>
<p>The reason SW jobs sometimes (not always) pay more is that university departments need students to help out (cuts down on employment costs AND helps students out). Each department has its own budget and figures out what it can spend on student help and most departments pay minimum wage or close to it because that’s all they can afford. SW money is financial aid money so university departments can apply (to the financial aid office) to be part of the university’s SW program and get Student Workers (as opposed to “regular” students who are looking for a job). Because the SW program is financial aid, salaries are set by the financial aid office (and probably some federal and state regulations), rather than by the hiring department, and is part of the student’s entire financial aid package, those jobs sometimes pay more than regular campus jobs. </p>
<p>As for FA students getting free study abroad . . . maybe your kid’s school has some special program to do this, but that’s unusual. (I’ve never heard of any blanket “all kids on FA get to go abroad free program”.) There are scholarships to send Pell Grant students abroad (the Gilman is the best known) which are very competitive to receive - it’s not an “all Pell Grant kids get free money to study abroad” program. I’m guessing that what your daughter thinks is the case at her university is more myth than fact - which isn’t unusual on a college campus. I hear whoppers from students on my campus all the time . . . the rumor mill is alive and well!</p>
<p>I am sure that lower middle class kids who get significant FA have a very similar set of challenges. I’m not sure why PP is acting as though they are somehow the polar opposite of the kids whose parents pay nothing. Or why he thinks the very poor don’t have jobs. </p>
<p>I was a lower middle class kid. My parents paid a very small amount for my private college. I know which of my friends had financial aid (at least in some cases). But I don’t even know if any of them had full rides. Maybe some did. It never would have occurred to me to resent them. They all had work study jobs and Loans, just as I did.</p>
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<p>I don’t resent them if that’s what you think. I just don’t want to hear them whine.</p>
<p>PP, I do not think that anyone, including those kids, feels anything but privileged by being able to attend the school they are at. The article is showing the differences between classmates and that they are different and what those differences are. </p>
<p>Romani, great, great, post. You said it so much better than I could. Mini, thank you also. For pointing out how it is different. Lol at being the ghetto expert!</p>
<p>One thing that is different is that the poor have no safety net. Everything is great as long as nothing changes. It is so hard to describe to those who have never experienced it what life is like to have no safety net. </p>
<p>I have college aged relatives who are very privileged that say that they wouldn’t mind being poor for awhile (meaning pursuing a job which will pay much less than what they grew up with). I laugh and say, being poor doesn’t mean not being able to go to a Caribbean island for spring break. It means having your car break down and no money to fix it. It means being sick and being in the hospital, getting fired from your job and not being able to pay the bill. Contrary to popular belief, people want to pay and don’t want to ruin their credit. My relatives will not know what it is like to be poor because they have parents that will pick up the bill when push comes to shove. </p>
<p>It is very hard to post on here when people begrudge the low income kids at the tier 1 schools on FA. It is so hard to explain and how hard it is for those kids to break that cycle of poverty. And how few kids get that opportunity.</p>
<p>The arrogance on here astounds me.</p>
<p>Let me rephrase that: the lack of compassion on here is astounding.</p>
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<p>I assume you are talking to me. I don’t begrudge low income kids anything. I am not sure how you jumped to that conclusion. Getting a free, high class education is a opportunity that students should appreciate. They should not be whining that they don’t fit in with the rich kids.</p>
<p>However, complaining that you have to eat in the dining hall when other kids are going out to eat is just whining. Complaining that you can’t afford to attend on campus events is just whining. Complaining that you can’t afford $200 dresses is whining.</p>
<p>No one said that being poor isn’t difficult in real life. But being poor at Americas richest colleges is not real life. All meals, as much as you can eat: included. Health care: included. Free transportation around town: included (no broken down car issues). High paying campus jobs: included. Exercise facilities and free sporting events: included. Parties and entertainment in the dorms: included. Plus more. </p>
<p>The amenities offered to every student at these rich colleges are astounding.</p>
<p>One can whine about how hard life is on full financial aid and one can whine about those who whine. It’s all whiners, all the time if that’s what you are into. Having been one of those on full FA I am nothing but grateful at the opportunities I’ve had – it totally worked the way it was supposed to for me although others in my family probably suffered. It worked so well, my kids probably won’t qualify for work study and though I’m a little sad about that, I can hardly complain. They’ve had so many advantages already. In fact, they take their privilege for granted. Co-op programs may be the best thing for them.</p>