<p>The same thing is happening here. The variables are changing, literally every day, and what seemed like a ‘done deal’ one day is not the next, because a new offer or piece of information comes it. My son is down to two schools, very different from one another. In school #1, the dean of admissions called and asked him what it would take to get him to come to his school. The dean of chemistry e-mailed him with an additional scholarship opportunity. In school #2, the dean of admissons doesn’t even know he exists. Guess which school he’s leaning towards? It’s KILLING me!</p>
<p>Weaver, ask him which school will more likely let him into a full class that he really wants… The one in which the dean of Chemistry contacted him or the one that treated him like a number.</p>
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<p>Exactly. Or between, say, NIU and Northwestern, or Yale and UConn, or Stanford and San Diego State. They’re all good choices.</p>
<p>If your child waits until May 1st,which looks like what I will end up with, how do you send in your deposit? Registered mail? Or do the colleges expect the deposit to arrive later than May 1st?</p>
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<p>The first quote is from me. The second is from annasdad, responding to me.</p>
<p>I think annasdad is extending what I intended to say much further than what I had in mind. The choices I mentioned (which were actually being considered by the offspring of people on this thread) were choices between schools that are in many ways equivalent.</p>
<p>The choices annasdad is citing are not quite the same. He’s right that they are all good choices, but perhaps they’re not good choices for the same student.</p>
<p>A student who would thrive at Columbia would almost certainly thrive at Duke or Harvard. I’m not sure that the same is true for Stanford and San Diego State. It seems to me that a student for whom one of these schools would be an excellent fit would be out of place at the other. The schools are just too different.</p>
<p>gojo - many colleges allow you to pay the deposit online with a credit card.</p>
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<p>Mine too:</p>
<ol>
<li>The schools in each pair are located in the same state.</li>
<li>Each school offers accredited four-year bachelors’ degrees.</li>
<li>Each school offers opportunities for a motivated student to get a first-class education.</li>
<li>Each school can cite exactly the same amount of objective evidence (as in “none”) that it offers a better education than its paired school.</li>
</ol>
<p>Of course, I will admit that there are significant differences between the schools in each pair:</p>
<ol>
<li>One is significantly harder to get into.</li>
<li>One is significantly more expensive, at least in terms of sticker price.</li>
<li>One without doubt will spark significantly more “wows” when its name appears on a decal on the real window of the parent’s vehicle.</li>
</ol>
<p>You didn’t mention one difference that I consider important, annasdad. </p>
<p>With the exception of the Yale/UConn comparison, one of the schools in each pair offers a highly qualified student ample opportunity to associate with intellectual peers; the other doesn’t.</p>
<p>There are intellectual peers of Stanford, Yale, or Northwestern students at state universities, but they almost always enroll at flagship state universities (or in large states, at one of the several top schools in the state system). Thus, you’ll find some at UConn (although there may not be many), because UConn is a flagship state university. It is unquestionably the top school in the Connecticut state system. But you’re not likely to find very highly qualified students at San Diego State. More likely, those who attend a state university will enroll in universities in the University of California system, especially Berkeley or UCLA. </p>
<p>I think a student of the caliber to be admitted to Stanford, Yale, or Northwestern loses something on a campus where he/she cannot find intellectual peers. I’m not saying that all of the students on campus need to be peers – just that there should be a reasonable number of them. </p>
<p>I’m not a private-is-better-than-state snob. One of my kids graduated from a state university and was very pleased with the caliber of the education he received there. But it was our flagship state university, not a lesser school in the state system. And that is an important difference, in my opinion.</p>
<p>^ And one in each pair, but not the other, tends to offer:</p>
<ul>
<li>better facilities (larger libraries, more state-of-the-art labs, nicer dorms & dining halls)</li>
<li>much better financial aid</li>
<li>more national and international drawing power (so that a student is more likely to share classes and dorm rooms with students from other states and possibly much different backgrounds)</li>
<li>smaller classes</li>
<li>probably a less passive, more engaging classroom experience on average (with heavier reading assignments, more writing assignments, fewer multiple choice tests, and more discussion supported by smaller classes and more selective admissions)</li>
<li>probably a greater variety of high-quality extracurricular activities (with more students performing at a high level in theater, music, sports, etc., due to selective & holistic “class crafting” in admissions, more institutional wealth, a higher percentage of residential v. commuter students, etc.)</li>
</ul>
<p>Do any of the above advantages translate to a better education? Not necessarily. Not without individual effort and initiative. Not every Yalie will benefit directly from the Beinecke rare books library, perform with the Wiffenpoofs, or room with a future senator. All these schools offer pretty similar course content. Arguably, the rest is more sizzle than steak; it may not be worth paying much more for that.</p>
<p>Go Badgers ! Proud Dad of two UW daughters who graduated from UW! From Boston!</p>
<p>I’ve really appreciated the discussion in this thread. </p>
<p>D and I made a final road trip last weekend. First to Ann Arbor. No guided tours or intenerary. Walked by Honors study area, walked campus and shops restaurants, had coffee and “student watched”. Left for Chicago feeling 100% maize and blue. It has everything, they are good at everything. It is a happy place full of school spirit and fat squirrels. Drove through torrential rain to hotel Chicago. Atended Day 2 of admitted student day. She was just wowed by the academics and the focus on learning, The tour of the bio department did it. Loved the profs, made a friend in her tour She decided Chicago. We got in the car to head home and call dad and she observed “this is me but I always like the last place I visited best”. You bet, we drove back to Ann Arbor. Having breakfast at a great little place famous for deep fried cinnamon raisin French toast she said if I could live anywhere it would be somewhere like this but I really want the UChicago education. </p>
<p>We are done. For those of you not there yet, it feels SO GOOD. She is talking about prom and tennis and graduation and feeling HAPPY.</p>
<p>There was no wrong choice. She just had to get there herself.</p>
<p>Full disclosure, dad and I are both Michigan grads…really needed her to articulate why Chicago was worth more $ (both were out of state). We had the best education and FUN at Michigan! D is more after the rigorous education, loves that all students are there for that, a different kind of fun…it does fit her…LOL where did we go wrong!!!</p>
<p>Good luck to everyone! May 1 is fast approaching. Our kids are going to be great wherever they go because they have such caring parents!</p>
<p>It it crazy to think that parents should have no say in which college their child chooses! I agree with a few others whose motto is “If I’m payin’, I’m sayin”. I don’t believe in this economy (or ever for that matter) it is wise to allow your child to take on substantial student loans, and parents should certainly avoid taking parent loans, unless paying the high cost of attending private colleges will have no impact on your lifestyle and your comfortable retirement. That is not the case with most average American families. Many recent college grads are drowning in student loan debt, and it is impacting their ability to move forward with their lives, i.e. moving out of their parents’ home, buying a new car, buying a home, getting married, having children. Some financial forecasters predict that student loan debt, and parent loan debt, will be the next large “financial crisis” in our country, second only to the recent housing/mortgage crisis. And can parents really afford to personally finance their children’s private colleges with loans, when they are only 10-15 years away from retirement? My husband and I advised our two teens (2 years apart) that we will pay for whatever is the cost of our public state university(including room and board), so they can still go away to college. Therefore, they had to apply to several state colleges. They were still allowed to apply to private and out of state colleges, but with the understanding that they could only attend these if they were awarded enough merit scholarship to bring the cost about equal to our in-state university. We do not qualify for any financial aid. This is what we could comfortably afford to pay for them, without taking any student or parent loans. If they can attend a good school, at a much lower cost, and get a great education, why go into debt for years? We think one of the best gifts we will give our children is a good, financialy healthy, debt-free start in their adult lives. They may not see it now, but they will probably thank us later. The mindset of college as the “best years of their lives” at whatever cost, has to change. Those 4 years will be over in the blink of an eye, while the debt will stay with them for decades. There are no high paying job guarantees for graduates from even the most elite schools; this is a myth that the private schools will have parents and teens buy into, literally! Instead, it is the student’s own drive, determination and ambition that will determine his/her ultimate success. A dedicated student can make any college work for them. Bottom line is, cost should be at the forefront of deciding which college to attend, and parents most definitely need to step in and teach their kids the realities of the higher education world. If not now, they will learn it the painful way later. My advice is that parents (and students) read the numerous articles on this subject before they blindly let their children make their own college choice.</p>
<p>Well said, Golub61.</p>
<p>Thanks everyone for all your input. She committed to Harvard yesterday. She is very happy with her decision. I guess it is time to say–
Go Crimson!</p>