<p>I wonder if any of you have experience with a child auditioning for a conservatory on two instruments? My son is equally passionate about bassoon (classical, obviously) and tenor sax (jazz), and he's hoping to be able to continue with both in college. He's currently a h.s. junior. We've started visiting schools, and I'm getting the sense that most schools would discourage a double major of this kind. Any advice would be most appreciated! I wonder if he should do both auditions, and just see what happens, and I also wonder if certain schools might be more supportive of continuing with both. Thanks!</p>
<p>I know of people who auditioned on both instruments at the same school but the school insisted that the student ultimately select one to concentrate on for college. That was for BM programs, though - I wonder if a BA program might be more open to doubling up.</p>
<p>We’ve thought of that, stradmom, but he really wants the immersive musical experience that a BM would provide.</p>
<p>Hi musicmom3000. Our children seem to be in a similar situation. My daughter is in 10th grade, but graduating a year early. She plays all of the woodwinds, but takes private lessons on both oboe and alto sax. She wants to study both oboe and sax (classical) at conservatory.</p>
<p>We have found the same problem with colleges. Conservatories and music schools want students to pick one and major on only one. My daughter prefers playing the sax, but as I’m sure you know, there is no sax in an orchestra. We have found sax players and teachers quite open to a double instrument major, but oboe teachers quite perplexed by the idea that she would want to play two instruments.</p>
<p>Our plan for now is to have her audition on both instruments, BM program, and see what she gets offered. She plans to major on one instrument, and take private lessons on the other one. There are some schools that would allow her to major on both, but they seem to be ones where she doesn’t want to study, she only wants to study one of her instruments there but not the other. I just don’t see an advantage to getting a double performance degree. She’d be better off getting a BM on one, and a MM on the other.</p>
<p>Some of the schools where you can study both include Peabody, McGill and Indiana</p>
<p>Although some knowledge and skills are transferable between instruments, the proficiency expected at conservatory level would not allow performance with two distinctly different instruments. It is common for proficient musicians to play additional instruments for fun but not when playing for serious performance. How many members of major orchestras do you think are able to pinch hit on different instruments? I would guess pretty close to ZERO.</p>
<p>Thanks, woodwinds – it’s interesting to hear from someone in just about the same situation. We’ll take a closer look at the schools you mentioned. And thanks for the good point you make, edad. I completely understand. I guess the difficulty right now is that he is equally interested in and proficient with both instruments (top all-state scores on both), so he’s not at a point where he can choose easily. Maybe he’ll just let the audition process guide him: if he gets better responses on one over the other, that will say a lot. Does anyone have experience with a child doing both classical and jazz college auditions?</p>
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<p>Off the top of my head, Davyd Booth of the Philadelphia Orchestra plays both violin and piano as a professional, and yes, with the Philly Orchestra. I know a woman who double-majored in piano and cello at Curtis. Many violinists pinch-hit on viola, and vice-versa. If you give me time, I can think of more. I think piano and strings are a more extreme example than two kinds of woodwinds. Anyway, it might be most practical to major in one and study the other with supplemental secondary lessons. </p>
<p>Not to sway the argument either way-- I don’t have an opinion as to whether this double major is possible. But I do want to say that, as and supportive as CC has been over the past years, sometimes the collective wisdom can be unintentionally discouraging. Explore all your options and keep thinking outside the proverbial box (as i am sure you will!) I have seen quite a few “can’t be done” things happen, for my own kids and for others.</p>
<p>I have to agree with Glass Harmonica on that. There have been people who have double majored and for example, it might be easier with Piano and another instrument then it might be with strings and a woodwind and I suspect whether it is possible to do it or not depends on the proficiency, it could be very well that kids told to choose and instrument are told so because they are not at the level on the instruments required to play at the conservatory level. </p>
<p>When it comes to things like that, I would recommend shooting an e-mail to music schools that might interest you, or you know about, etc, and ask them if someone ever double majors and so forth. If the student seems to be achieving high levels on both instruments, where they aren’t sacrificing quality for quantity (i.e where they might play a single instrument much better then the level of playing 2), then why not give it a shot? Put it this way, if a music school sees a kid coming in that has achieved high level proficiency on two instruments, who they would jump to have them on either one, they might be willing to make an exception even if they generally discourage it. There is a girl I have seen play who plays both cello and piano at an incredible level and from what I have been told her teachers have encouraged her to play both at conservatory, and they both are on the faculty of top level music schools…worse comes to worse, the kid majors on one instrument and finds a way to take lessons on the other.</p>
<p>glassharmonica, excellent points. Musicians have and can study and perform at very high levels on more than one instrument. As you pointed out, the difference between woodwinds is not all that different, particularly if the student began both at a young age. Bassoon and jazz tenor sax both require fairly loose embouchures. Oboe and alto sax both require fairly tight embouchures.</p>
<p>In years past, musicians often studied more than more instrument at conservatories. One famous sax player (classical) studied oboe at Curtis and classical sax. I saw a recital program from Northwestern in 1950, where the musician performed on all five woodwinds, He played pieces including a bassoon concerto by von Weber, clarinet Mozart concerto, Strauss oboe concerto–pieces one would need to be very proficient on to play well. So the top conservatories accepted the playing of multiple instruments in the past. Why the change? I think it’s due to financial reasons. Budgets are tight, tuition is going up, and they don’t want the same student taking lessons from more than one of their top, highly-paid instructors.</p>
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I know the girl of whom musicprnt speaks, and she is truly phenomenal. Listening to her reminds me how boundless are the possibilities of human achievement. She is an extraordinary example; it is hard to fathom how someone could become accomplished at this high a level on two instruments, but it happens. A further-along example is the German violinist/pianist Julia Fischer. </p>
<p>[Julia</a> Fischer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_Fischer]Julia”>Julia Fischer - Wikipedia)</p>
<p>What a fascinating discussion! I’m heartened by the idea that there may not be one right way to pursue music (that is, studying a single instrument at a conservatory). These days, when musicians are encouraged to consider themselves entrepreneurs and to forge unique careers (many will not land a full-time orchestra position, after all), maybe it wouldn’t be too bad to have a varied skill set. On the other hand, I want to be realistic about how difficult it will be to pursue two instruments in two different performing areas (classical and jazz). Does anyone have experience with this kind of dual college audition process?</p>
<p>Search for past posts by Allmusic. Her son is about to graduate with two performance degrees from a top music school. She has been on CC a long time and the entire process of applying and deciding, as well as his last four years experience is chronicled on CC through her posts. One thread where you’ll find a post by her, and then can search on her name for past posts is this: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/1167107-double-music-major.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/1167107-double-music-major.html</a></p>
<p>Hi, I already sent Musicmom3000 a PM, but wanted to just add that yes, four years later my son is graduating with a double performance degree in two quite different instruments. It’s great that a few more people on the board are being encouraging of MM3000, because five years ago, in her shoes, people told ME that it was impossible to do what her son (and mine) wanted to do. As I have reported over the past four years, it is not easy, but is certainly ‘possible’ !</p>
<p>The other thing that my son has found, is that contrary to the idea that pursuing a double performance degree will limit both practice time and opportunities, he has discovered the exact opposite. He is called for gigs and teaching on both, and the fact that he can jump in on either instrument has worked to his benefit. He is doing quite nicely financially, and doesn’t even have the degrees in hand yet!</p>
<p>Again, this is not the path for everyone, but for the right student, with the right music school, it is definitely possible!</p>
<p>Just to add another example, a little closer to earth than Julia Fischer, and a little farther along than the young cellist mentioned, there is Melvyn Chen, still very amazing, with double MMs in performance from Juilliard on both violin and piano and a Ph.D. from Harvard in Biochemistry; he double majored as an undergrad in Physics and Chemistry at Yale, while pursuing violin and piano very actively. (Legend has it he managed this by alternating practice days for each instrument). He is now on faculty at Bard Conservatory.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.bard.edu/academics/faculty/faculty.php?action=details&id=1212[/url]”>http://www.bard.edu/academics/faculty/faculty.php?action=details&id=1212</a></p>
<p>Having watched him coach masterclasses over the past few years, I noted what seemed to be an emerging preference for piano and that seems to be the path he has taken now. </p>
<p>It can be very difficult to have multiple passions, but it is possible to find the way to continue to be a polymath throughout the course of formal studies and beyond, as others have said above Best wishes to you!</p>
<p>Using examples of the one tenth of one percent of individuals who can accomplish the truly exceptional does not change my opinion. If you are the parent of such an individual then just get out of the way and dont worry about the direction they take.</p>
<p>In the end, of course, it is up to my son, and I will indeed get out of his way as he decides how to proceed. But the points raised in this discussion will help us both in thinking through the situation. I’d hate for him to feel he has to make a choice between the instruments at this tender age, so I will encourage him at least to consider programs that would allow the pursuit of both.</p>
<p>Woodwinds, you said that your child was going to major in one instrument and take private lessons in the other: Was your child planning on taking these private lessons through the college? Is that allowed, to take college offered private lessons for an instrument you aren’t majoring in?</p>
<p>One thing I just want to mention - not all conservatories teach classical saxophone. Juilliard is one that doesn’t - they only teach orchestral instruments (except for jazz) - so watch out for that and don’t apply at any of those schools if you want to do classical saxophone!</p>
<p>BassoonPiano522–let me clarify. My daughter intends to audition at a number of conservatories. Some of them will allow her to study performance on both instruments, meaning she can take lessons with the top teacher on both instruments and get a double degree. At other schools where no classical sax is taught, such as Juilliard, she will audition on oboe, and if she goes to a school like this plans to to continue studying sax with a teacher of her choice, outside of school. I’ve been advised that at Manhattan and possibly Mannes, she could request to double major and study with a different sax teacher than offered at the school, getting a double major. At Eastman, a student can major in one instrument, but get lessons on another with the major teacher at no (extra) cost. These are all things we will look into, and of course getting offered admittance and scholarships will determine where she goes.</p>
<p>My son auditioned on two very different intruments at a couple of colleges, he got scholarship offers for trumpet at every school he auditioned, but nada for piano (which he had only been playing a couple of years). One of the schools did send him a letter inviting him to take applied performance lessons in piano in addition to trumpet although it was a nogo on scholarship money for piano.</p>