<p>Title speaks for itself, just weighing the pros and cons. I know private schools have more money and scholarships to give but honors college at a state school is more exclusive which could also be good. Does anyone have any opinions on the pros and cons of each? I'm kind of stuck between the two</p>
Average student at a good private university or honors program/outstanding student at a state school
<p>True story - talked with a mom of D’s friend from HS over Thanksgiving. Her daughter, due to financial consideration , is going to an honors program at a OOS flagship, pretty well regarded, but nothing like Michigan or any of the UCs. She’s really bright, low 30s on her ACT, our HS is really competitive with 20+ APs, so she was really challenged in HS. Her daughter is bored silly even in the honors program and regards it as way easier than HS. She’s really hoping it gets better as they get further in, but one semester in, she’s sort of regretting it and reports that a lot of kids aren’t coming back for second semester.</p>
<p>YMMV depending on the individual student and the school, but anecdotally, there is a huge difference between what this flagship honors college offers vs a Top 20 National or LAC. There can be many reasons to go with the honors college, but be very careful which one you pick, they are sometimes not all that different from the regular school.</p>
<p>@MrMom62 thanks so much that actually helps a lot… I guess it’s that whole “an A in an honors course or a B in an AP course” thing all over again </p>
<p>It really depends on the school. There is a lot of variation across state schools, and their associated honors programs. Anecdotally, I know a top student from our school district who had a wonderful, challenging experience at an OOS honors program. She and most of her peers went to top grad schools. So, I think it’s difficult to make a blanket statement. </p>
<p>So much depends on the school. And some departments/majors at certain state schools are as challenging/highly-regarded as anything out there (and others definitely are not).</p>
<p>You really need to lay out the particular schools and find out info about them.</p>
<p>Honors programs can vary a lot. I would say, it depends on the college and the program. Consider whether you like the college as a whole, because in most cases, you will be with the students at that college in many situations: classes, clubs, activities. </p>
<p>Also, I would not consider being bored over the first semester to be an indicator of the overall level of academic demands in a college. A freshman intro class may indeed seem easy for an advanced student, but as one progresses in a major, the upper division classes are bound to be more challenging. </p>
<p>For honors level students, the choice between a private highly ranked college and an honors program is a common one, and something families decide both ways. It’s individual and one choice doesn’t fit all. </p>
<p>neh97: actually, studies show that Honors students do better in their honors classes… probably because the format is better suited to their learning style.</p>
<p>@MrMom62 </p>
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<p>True story? lol…you’re telling a 3rd-hand story…which has originated from a Fall frosh who likely is still smarting from having to choose a “lesser” school due to financial consideration and is hoping that parents will spring for a pricey transfer. “Lots of students aren’t coming back for second semester”…lol…“oh mom, everybody has a car except me!” Who falls for stuff like this from teens? </p>
<p>@nehc97 Take that story with a grain (actually an entire box) of salt. No one can claim it’s a “true story” when they’re hearing it from a parent who heard it from an 18 year old. </p>
<p>I don’t know what school that was, but if the student came in with a lot of APs and has a serious major, then unless it’s a lousy flagship like UNevada, then soon this student will be more than adequately challenged. </p>
<p>Actually, considering she always knew she had to go for the money, since she’s got a slew of siblings behind her, this is not a case of Spoiled Brat Syndrome. She never applied to any of the elite schools, as they knew they were never in the picture financially. There’s also the problem of this school having a bit (okay, a lot) of a party reputation, even in the Honors college, and that’s a problem for this girl - her peers aren’t exactly diligent students at this point and she is. Will that be true for everyone at every school? - no, of course not. But sometimes the cheaper option is not the better option IF you can afford it. And sometimes you just need to suck it up and take the free or cheaper ride. It still doesn’t make them equal schools.</p>
<p>I have the same story from another family as well, and she’s reporting the same thing at another (lower-ranked non-flagship) school, but that that’s probably a combo of SBS and the school not matching up yet. She, foolishly, as it was never affordable, did apply and get into some very elite schools, but was forced to take the rather prestigious full-ride, so I discount that story, but it doesn’t mean that academically, it’s not true.</p>
<p>On the other side of the equation, D is at a Top 20 LAC and finds it to be extremely challenging. Great fit, but that “Work hard, Play hard” slogan everyone uses - emphasis on the Work. Every class, regular exams, not finals, are three hours each, at night, after dinner. Numerous papers due every week. Huge amount of reading. No skipping classes either, as you’re not anonymous, they notice when you’re missing. That’s not for everyone either, and some students may prefer the slower pace of some of the Honors colleges. (Caveat - some students do manage to take an easier load, D is pre-med.)</p>
<p>All I’m saying is pick your Honors college carefully - some are more Honors than others. Fit (in all ways) is always an important, and sometimes overlooked, consideration.</p>
<p>Partying isn’t mutually exclusive with studying, btw. I, for one, was the work hard/play hard type in college. Since it’s not yet second semester, there’s no way she could know - a lot of the kids might swear up and down they will transfer out and then she’ll be sitting next to them in class January.</p>
<p>Still, I think the overall message is sound - honors programs vary widely from school to school. They’re not always a “liberal arts college within a large university,” as some schools like to tout them. Sometimes the classes are not very different from the classes everyone else takes, and sometimes the perks are not worth it. You have to investigate individual honors colleges/programs and see whether the format and students are competitive and well-suited for your own learning style.</p>
<p>Also, I feel like I say this a lot but don’t assume that you will be ‘average’ at a good private university but top/outstanding at an honors college. Hypothetically speaking, for example, you might find that your honors college peers at a top public like a Michigan or a UVa would be quite at home at Harvard or Yale, and that the competition is rough. Not only that, but if your coursework is significantly harder than the regular students’ coursework, you might end up in the middle of the class - remember there’s no added GPA points for harder classes in college. Conversely, many students rise to the occasion and are very motivated by competition with their peers at top schools regardless of funding source (public or private), so they do better there.</p>
<p>That said, though, nobody really cares about your place in the class in college. There’s Latin honors, but there’s no “top 10%” or anything, really. If you have a good GPA and good skills/experiences you’ll be fine even if you are just the middle of the pack.</p>
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<p>Many, many schools (even top schools) have partying issues… When you get 18-22 year olds together, you’re going to get a lot of parties and sex…unless it’s a bible school. </p>
<p>And, many, many Fall Frosh go CRAZY their first semester away from home. At a number of schools, including some top ones, that first semester can be filled with a lot of distractions: hanging out with friends or roomies til late hours, football games, love interests, etc. Often, once fall grades come out, there is a big wake-up call to those who let the distractions get the best of them…either parents refusing to pay for another semester, or parents insisting that the GPA must go up or kid comes home. </p>
<p>Spring semester often brings some sanity back. </p>
<p>Again, if this student has selected a serious major and she’s come in with a good number of APs, then she will quickly be in upper-division classes and will be challenged. She’ll also more likely find more students with similar interests. </p>
<p>My oldest started off in the honors program at his university, saw no benefit, and dropped it. He was majoring in chemE and he felt the additional honors seminars were distracting.</p>
<p>Our youngest ds is part of a university’s research honors program. He absolutely loves it. It is part of what is making his experience at that university such a good fit.</p>
<p>I guess my point is that it is going to depend on how the honors program functions and the type of student involved. </p>