<p>I found this list very helpful. I have a truly average child not a CC average child. But, he is very hard working, loves class discussions, is involved and engaged both at school and in the community. When he first started thinking about colleges, his dream was my alma mater. Part of the allure was the location, the physical attractiveness of the campus, and the reputation. But, he also wanted the liberal arts education, the experience of having classmates from around the country, and living on a residential campus. However, it became very apparent that there was no hook that would make up for his stats, and that he would not be a candidate for that school. A friend suggested that we look at the CC web site for ideas about other options. So, after his sophomore year, we looked at several schools suggested by CC parents that I thought would give him the experience he wanted, but were not so selective. However, now he is a junior and more numbers are coming in. Many of the schools suggested here also seem too much of a reach. His guidance counselor at school gave us the same advise as Speedo: A Real Good Place For The B Student Is The Lower Level State College. My son was very discouraged looking at the lower level state colleges. He was concerned about small number of students on campus during the weekends and the even smaller numbers living in campus housing. I was very discouraged by the listed graduation rates, which, almost uniformly, were under 50%. But, this list gives him some more options to look at. Hopefully, he will find a school that not only fulfills his desires, but also wants him.</p>
<p>Hang in there cyclistsmom. There are lots of great schools out there.
Two books I highly recommend is Loren Pope's Colleges That Change Lives and Beyond the Ivy League. Both will get you started thinking about colleges that may not immediately leap to mind, but can be great places for kids like your son.</p>
<p>emeraldkity4: We have a friend whose son is at Evergreen. He went right after HS and loves it. Though it does appear to have less structure, it appears there is a good deal of faculty guidance and support. Just that another data point might be helpful.</p>
<p>Coming out of High School a few years ago I had a 3.3 (weighted, it was a 3.2 unweighted) GPA. Honestly I remember feeling like I had no options, since it seemed like I needed at least a 3.5 or better to really consider college. I ended up spending two years at a junior college, and just this past year made the jump into a university. What a lot of people don't realize is just how bleak it can look to the student with the lower GPA, regardless of if people tell you there are some places that might accept you.</p>
<p>I agree Allena. Especially in California, where the focus is almost exclusively on the UC's, as if no other college is worth considering. I have talked to many kids who simply aren't aware of the wide range of options available to them. It is really a shame.</p>
<p>I have to admit for my B+ daughter, we did concentrate on public U's in the mid-Atlantic. I know there were many other options, but realistically, we were not expecting merit money nor much from financial aid as we are a 2 income family. We looked basically at SUNY system as we are from NY and other publics including Towson-George Mason- Temple- West Chester and a few others. Now that it is coming closer to making a decision, my d is looking more carefully at the SUNY's. It does seem that a lot of OOS publics do empty out on the week-ends. My d was very interested in George Mason until we paid a visit over a week-end and it seemed pretty empty. For whatever reason, there is life on a SUNY campus on week-ends so my d is giving more consideration to Cortland, Oneonta and Albany. She actually has A LOT more choices than I thought she would have, it may be a combo of getting in most of her applications in before 11/1 and a last minute boost in her ACT score to a 23. (Lets not talk about SAT's) For us most private U would probably cost over $30,000 so we did concentrate on public U's for my d. And seeing some of the SUNY campuses, especially Cortland, Brockport and Oneonta, I was very pleasantly surprised at what I saw. I still do not know if she is going the SUNY route, but it's going to be a good decision if it does happen.</p>
<p>I had looked at a couple of the Cal State schools, but even there I got discouraged. I know many people with averages far exceeding mine that were apply to the Cal State schools, and I decided agaisnt that option as well. I had a 3.3, which I never found to be that terrible. I know it was far lower than many of the people (and kids of people) who post on this website, but still it did not brand me as being a complete moron. However that was enough to make me go to a Junior College for a couple of years to establish a better GPA for myself. It makes me wonder however how lost people must feel when they have GPA's under 3.0. Remember that a C is considered an average grade, so in theory 2.0-2.5 should be a farily common GPA.</p>
<p>Here in Pa, places like West Chester, Millersville, East Stroudsburg etc are competing for the better students - expanding honors programs, small scholarships, travel etc. If you can make it to a 1200 SAt and a B+ average you have a good shot. The kid next door to me, a 1290 urm, could have gone to a dozen privates, but took the money and the special dorm and pretty much goes to West Chester for free - even has a car. With PSU's rates being so high, the lower states have a great opportunity, and a great opp for kids who want to go to grad school, theyre coming out with relatively low debt and a good deal of personal attention.</p>
<p>In NY too, we're getting wonderful personalized letters from the SUNY's (especially Oneonta). Also reminding the kids that based on their accomplishments they too may be going to grad school and reminding them that they will have little debt with an undergraduate SUNY education. And allena, I'm clueless about the Calif. public u's, but I also discussed with my d if she wanted to do her first 2 years at a community college- taking the basic general ed. requirements, deciding on a major, and then finding the RIGHT school for her to complete her BA degree. I might have been more willing to "spend the big bucks" for the last 2 years of college when the first 2 were relatively inexpensive. She prefers to go to a 4 year college. But alot can be said for doing the first two at a comm. college. I am sure there are many Ca. kids graduating UCLA and Berkley who did their first 2 years at the local community college. My older D is at Cornell. Trust me, there are a number of kids at Cornell who started their college careers at a SUNY community college. People will only ask where you got your degree from- they're not going to ask where you spent your freshmen year. Good luck to you.</p>
<p>What marny1 is saying is quite true. I, for one did a year at a community college (then called junior college), then to a "lower" state U, and later ended up graduating from a top tier graduate school. The very best year in college was that first year at the community college. Great instructors, exciting and demanding work (once failed a paper because I directly addressed the reader), and a great exposure to a liberal education all for about $200 (at that time).</p>
<p>Allena and all, thanks for your posts. My son is feeling as you were. We have been telling him that a community college is not the end of the college dream, and many students have lots of choices when they are looking to transfer. In addition, as we looked at the USNews list, there were some schools we did not know about that may be excellent choices. As a parent, it is difficult to see him so discouraged even before the process starts.</p>
<p>Look at colleges similar to Concordia College in Moorhead MN. They would LOVE a kid like your son there. I'm sure there are many others. Another that comes to mind is Whitworth, I think, in Washington? Both of those have a religious affiliation, but if that is not something you could work with, there must be others similar, without the religious affiliation. Another school that comes to mind University of Puget Sound in Washington (oldest S was accepted there with a low GPA, though chose to go elsewhere). And remember, for some of these schools, being a boy is a "hook."</p>
<p>Cyclistsmom- Hi! If I may ask, what state are you from and what is your son's interests? Though some state U's are very hard for OOS applicants (UVA or UNC), others welcome them as so few OOS apply. SUNY falls into that category. A good OOS candidate may find it easier to get into SUNY Binghamton than a NY kid, as SUNY does try to get more OOS kids. So maybe if we know more about your son, we can give you some suggestions.</p>
<p>Cyclistsmom, stress to your son that a community college does not mean the end of going to college. While I think it is true that it can be easy to get stuck there (I knew people who had been in community college for 5+ years and were still nowhere near transferring), if your son makes the effort he will get out and move on. I went to my CC for two years (plus a summer) and am at UCLA now and am considering several Ivy League schools for law, so it is very possible to move on from a community college.</p>
<p>I have a friend whose daughter went to Diablo Valley CC and transferred to Yale.</p>
<p>Cyclistsmom - if you feel comfortable please share more about your son's search, expecially his thinking process.
My son is just a freshman, but school is not his thing, although he is a great kid. He will have solid academic courses, but no honors or AP to help his very so-so grades - who knows what SATs will be, his PSATs were not great, just a little above average for our private school - he might make 1200-1250 (old style).
I have issues with our in-state publics for this kid, unless he shows some radical growth and change over the next 2 years (I know guys, the kid is just 14, but trust me, if he was yours, you would want him in a residential setting, not an apartment with 3 of his high school buddies as a freshman!). So I am very interested in OOS publics, especially less selective ones, CTCL type privates, etc. Most of the kids at his school (99% to college) with his grades/ scores (the average kids) go to one of the flagship state unis, or to our local uni which is a 4 year commuter school.</p>
<p>Hearing what his choices and considerations are would be a great help - particularly if you are in a state that does not have obviously good second tier public choices.</p>
<p>cangel, not to go way off point, but wouldn't Montevallo be an in-state, public possibility for your son? It wasn't in CTCL, but Pope did speak highly of it in his Beyond The Ivy League book.</p>
<p>Thank you all for your kind thoughts and helpful advice. I don't want to give too much personal information, because he is also on these boards, and we are trying to be very optimistic with him hes discouraged enough for all of us. So keeping that in mind, we live in that vast area between the coasts. He has wanted to be a lawyer for a long time, but not necessarily in litigation. He likes trying to determine what is fair, who is responsible, and similar issues. He has enjoyed being a peer mediator, and from the input that I have gotten from the adults involved, he does a good job. He plays in the orchestra and wants to continue in college. Although he is a good player and section leader, he does not have the talent to compete with conservatory-type players. He has 2 main extra-curricular activities. He has been involved with them throughout high school and will continue with them during his senior year. For one of the activities he has held leadership positions the last 2 years, and has done the marketing materials that are used to recruit other students. The other is a sports team, where my son spends most of his time on the bench. He currently has a 3.2 gpa, and, sadly, low SATs. So, at this point, our state flagship university is out of his reach. He is going to do a prep class, and we are hopeful that he can raise that score. He is also going to try the ACT. We are going to do a couple trips this spring and summer -- one to some western Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, and Indiana schools, and another to some Illinois, Iowa, and Minnesota schools. He is socially liberal, but a I think he would do fine in religiously affiliated school as long as he doesnt have to attend services. Sorry for the long post .</p>
<p>cyclistsmom- Hi. It's very good that son will take the ACT. My own "untested theory" is that sports kids do better on the ACT. My d got about 930 on SAT. She also went for prepping through Kaplan. Didn't help- I think it made her hatred for the test even stronger. She would come out of practice tests- white as a ghost-"head Numb" and would be extremely quiet for about 20 minutes. It wasn't nerves, it was just that the test zapped all her energy. She was absolutely ok with the ACT it did not seem to affect her in the same manner. I have read alot of posts on these boards re: ACT vs. SAT- one of the kids made a comment that all the sports kids take the ACT- I thought it was a "silly" comment but as I read more and more posts, there seemed to be some truth to the statement. It seemed that SOME kids involved with sports did seem to did substantially better on the ACT. My d did an equivalent of about 140 points higher on the ACT than SAT. Anyway- my older d is studying Labor relations and is thinking law school and my sports d may major in sports management. If you need any info re those type of programs, just ask. Unfortunately I am more familiar with east coast schools than mid west schools.--Good luck.</p>
<p>lderochi, yes Montevallo is a possibility, he has an aunt that went there, who loved it, although today he tells me that he definitely wants to go out of state.
Interestingly, after I posted, I picked him up from school, and they did college searches on some website, ?Princeton Review, in English today. His designated best match was VMI!? 2nd was VCU. His father's only comment was "no" to VCU, and "does he have any clue what VMI is?"
Funny thing, his search turned up a long list of schools (that's encouraging) his buddy in the next desk only found 4 - Harvard, Yale, Duke, and some other "unknown" school, he looked over at my son's, and told their teacher "Ms. E, something's wrong with my search!?" My son, who is much savvier than his grades would indicate, said "I just rolled my eyes."</p>