Barnard vs. Chicago

<p>Thanks all 3 of you for your comments.
Lol, poppins, are you just saying that to get me not to go to Barnard?
chiaro, yes we are in the same pickle, definitely. And you don't really consider options objectively and in reality until it hits you. I wasn't expecting much from Chicago, so never really had to deal with a dilemma like this.
Having said that, I truly, genuinely, want to go to Barnard (like zeusviolin said) and I know Chicago is a great school. But my natural love/affinity for Chicago is significantly less (ie. gut feeling).
But I can't give up Chicago, so I'm going to visit. I'm gonna try real hard to fit Barnard in but it's almost impossible.
I know whatever choice I make, it'll be good.</p>

<p>Barnard has a huge edge over Chicago because of NYC + the perks of being there, and I absolutely adore NYC.
My main concern for Chicago, is the rumoured "all fun dies there" atmosphere... And I worry that my happiness is at stake here (of an overall amazing experience at college).
I know that I'll be able to cope academically at both schools, but have heard so much sh1t about Chicago being incredibly stressful etc.. don't know how exaggerated it is.. but I definitely don't want to kill myself studying in college, you know what I mean?</p>

<p>Essentially I think I have to look at it like this, even in a metaphorical sense.
Looking at the bigger picture, and looking at what I want out of my undergrad experience... </p>

<p>Yesterday, Chicago sent me a nice cardboard box (lol) with the Chicago Life guide and the Course catalogue and acceptance package. In the broader sense, Chicago is a good, prestigious name, with stellar academics, and excellent job prospects, and you feel as though you're set for your future.
Barnard, also sent me something yesterday. They sent me a tiny little hand-written postcard, saying hello and that they hope I go there. In the larger sense, Barnard is going to have a more supportive, intimate, caring atmosphere.. they say it has a 'motherly' feel to it. So I feel as though that one postcard summed up what Barnard is, and the beautiful cardboard box from Chicago sums up what Chicago is.. for me..
I personally do thrive in a rigorous academic atmosphere and love intellectual challenges, and that is why I chose to apply to Chicago, and I was accepted. And I do love independence. But having said that, I love Barnard's intimacy and support network..
As you can see, I'm still torn...
And I've now decided that visiting is not feasible. Mom checked out the flights and it's just too tight to leave S'pore on Thursday and try get back by Sunday. Plus it's very expensive and may not even help... instead just confuse me more.
And I want to visit both Barnard and Chicago, or neither.
I have a question: Can I place the deposits for both schools? Then once my IBs finish at the end of May, I can go visit both more relaxed and then make a decision, and withdraw from one school (I know I won't get the deposit back)</p>

<p>Usually there is fine print on the form that you return with your deposit, said fine print indicating that you're not sending in a deposit anywhere else or words to that effect. It's done. I also think it's of dubious ethics, like getting engaged to two people and trying to stall the wedding.</p>

<p>Yeh my rents said I couldn't do this.
I hope I'll be able to choose...</p>

<p>We rents are <em>so</em> unreasonable. Heartless. Cruel. Clueless. Etc.&lt;/p>

<p>Part of your problem, as I think has surfaced in subtext of at least one thread in the Parents Forum (not yours), is that U/Chicago is one of the most LAC-like universities.</p>

<p>Lol :)</p>

<p>Yeh.. that adds to the dilemma definitely! At Chicago I know you get an amazzzing education..and it's another places I've wanted to go to... and I'll come out of there sooo well-rounded and I know I won't regret making the decision of going there.
But Barnard.... <em>sniffles</em> is where my heart is.
And I guess if I have to follow my heart .. then I'd go to Barnard....
I just want to give Chicago a full chance though..</p>

<p>Just thought I'd warn you, from seeing another thread, that I just spent most of this beautiful day and the day before reading on the lawn with friends. While we do do other things, this is certainly something we consider fun and social.</p>

<p>I just posted more info on another thread in this forum about our recent visit to Barnard (and I am obviously a biased source since my D will attend there in the fall AND I know little or nothing about U Chicago), but</p>

<p>-My d also applied ED to Columbia and was rejected...the BEST thing that could have happend to her (in retrospect). Barnard is TRULY the best of both worlds (see my other post for more detail). If she had applied (and been accepted) RD to both schools, I am absolutely sure she would chose to attend as a Barnard student;</p>

<p>-consideration of Barnard's being in NYC is not just a frivolous thing: NYC has innumerable benefits to offer as an extended classroom as well as the fact that it is an amazing environment that may be too expensive to live in as anything other than a college student!</p>

<p>-the women's college situation at Barnard is very unique (VERY Unique?? What a silly thing to say!). Almost all of your classes will contain males (except Freshman seminar and Senior thesis). But the nurturing caring environment there is absolutely AMAZING!!! (see again my other post...even the most curmudgeonly of Columbia's proffs agree!)</p>

<p>Good luck in making your decision....Best to you. And, again, know that my info is strictly one-sided and biased. But heartfelt, just the same!</p>

<p>Thank you churchmom :) Your post was absolutely delightful.. thanks again!!</p>

<p>Just out of curiosity... does your daughter visit this site too?</p>

<p>Not usually, unless I show her some posts. She was, I think, to stressed out with the admissions process to deal with all of the info here (so I just "stressed" for her!!!). She does, however, post on the Barnard 2009 LJ community. I will send your her screen name privately....hope you two get to meet soon!!!!</p>

<p>Lol, what an awesome mother you are :)</p>

<p>LOL, it's the opp. in our fam - I show my rents a few posts from CC now and then, and certainly email it to them.. lol however, they stress too much as it is, I don't think this added info would be any good for their mental health lol!!
CC is soo helpful though.. I'm so glad I found it!!!</p>

<p>Thanks for the PM!</p>

<p>I’m a Barnard alum whose d is entering BC this fall. I’m joining this forum to weigh in on silver wavez college decision. </p>

<p>As an Asian woman, I find much to identify with in your dilemma. I grew up with the importance of prestige, status, recognition, notoriety, etc hammered into me. It’s not just Asians, but may I say, especially Asians who are prone to this addiction. This addiction to prestige runs all through our culture, and it motivates much of this forum.</p>

<p>I’ve worked all my adult life to overcome this narrow set of priorities and the definition of success it connotes. I know it still affects me on a subtle level but I work to be ever more conscious of it and not let it control my decisions. </p>

<p>Choosing a college is an opportunity to individuate and begin expressing your own values and priorities, aside from what is given to us by our parents and the dominant culture. It sounds like, based on what I’ve read so far in the threads, that you (silverw) are attracted to U of C primarily because it’s more well known than BC and that your parents feel more comfortable with it due to its reputation. I agree with others who’ve piped in: forget prestige! Academically they’re both stellar and they’re both in great cities. But you were totally settled and happy with BC--what made you turn your head?</p>

<p>When I went to BC in the early 80s, everyone except those in academics and the exceptionally cool, were, like, “who? where? ber-NARD?” But I still knew it was the best place for me to be, and over the course of the years, what I gained in my college years continues to resonate. I’m still in touch with a couple of profs, I encounter alum and faculty connections all the time, for god’s sake, even my internship connections still come up frequently. And of course NYC will always feel like a home to me.</p>

<p>But the intangible gains are much more significant. BC is where I really learned the importance of QUESTIONING EVERYTHING, of the necessity of inquiry, where I really learned how to look under and through and around things. I didn’t appreciate it until after I left, but it makes a huge difference to have 65% women faculty, and all the leadership positions filled by women. You get out into the big world and you recognize sexism everywhere bc you realize you’ve been largely spared for 4 years.</p>

<p>I deliberately laid low as my d was considering BC, but she felt a strong resonance as soon as she started looking around. Even tho she is brilliant and talented (of course I am biased) she was turned off by the Ivies and wouldn’t even tour Columbia, where her dad went. She only applied to small LACs, and BC was her 1st choice by far. </p>

<p>Our choices reinforce the part of us we choose to strengthen. Barnard women are feisty and independent thinkers. My alum friends are all doing really cool things, ranging from principal at an urban school, running non-profits, writing, to full-time mothering. (It so happened I didn’t hang out with the premeds and prelaws but they’re all succeeding in their fields as well, I’m sure.)</p>

<p>As for the difference between BC and CC, I have 2 words: wedding pictures. In our household we get both alum mags. I was dismayed some years ago when I noticed someone’s wedding photo in the CC mag. First of all I’m not a big fan of ostentatious formal expensive anything. Second, being someone’s wife is only one of many hats I wear, and not nearly my dominant identity. I don’t think a Barnard woman would send in her wedding photo to her college--it never once crossed my mind when I got married--and the editor wouldn’t choose to publish it. But every issue of CC alum mag contains not just one but several photos of weddings, usually sent by the CC grad bride.</p>

<p>To me, this phenomenon represents a certain attitude of traditionalism. The woman who prefers BC to CC might be a little more willing to go off the beaten track, to find her own way, to question things more. Maybe it’s expressed in the difference between the core curriculum and the 9 ways. Barnard women are here to MAKE culture, not to capitulate to what already is in place. On a minor but symbolic level, most of my alum friends are now married, but virtually all of us kept our names, wanting to retain our individuality in the world. BC women are bold about living our feminism, having been nurtured in the woman-centered culture for 4 formative years. On a humorous note, a friend of my mother’s said she wanted her daughter to go to Barnard. My mother, a very strong woman in her own way, warned her, “don’t send her there--she’ll come back a feminist!”</p>

<p>Chistina.. Hey.. I decided to go to Chicago over Wellesly because it's
really where my heart is and feel like that's the best place for me(based on my feeling..) And it has always been my ultimate first choice. But it seems to me that your heart says Barnard rather than the U of C. If I were you, I would go to Barnard because it's where you really really really want to go...(if you do) You can't go wrong with those options because both schools have great academic standards and the prestige(hey, you get a Columbia degree at Barnard and are part of the Ivies). Esp. Barnard isn't a traditional all women's school since it's practically(not technically) an undergraduate college of the Columbia University. Some of my friends are very happy at Barnard and are treated just like CC students within the CU...! You have the most wonderful city in the U.S.(in my opinion)(chicago is a city, too, but is different from NYC), and I feel like you would thrive well in Barnard..</p>

<p>It's ultimately your call, but I just wanted to offer my insight...</p>

<p>GO WITH YOUR HEART...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</p>

<p>What a great post from Ahimsa...a first post, too. Welcome to the board, Ahimsa. I hope we see more of your wisdom around here.</p>

<p>Let me just say WOW.... WOWWWWW... WOWWWWWWW :) I'm just soo impressed... THANK YOU AHIMSA.
Thank you.
First Barnard alumna I have "spoken" to.... and WOWWW - it makes me want to be a "strong, beautiful Barnard woman".</p>

<p>And I feel so honoured that you made your first post dedicated to me.. how did you find my posts on CC.. were you a "luker" before actually subscribing? (not that this is relevant).</p>

<p>Your comment on the BC, CC difference = wedding photos .. was VERY amusing :) made me chuckle!</p>

<p>Is you D going there this autumn?</p>

<p>I just want to say thank you again for your very insightful post.. and you definitely took a new spin on things.. and shone the light on things I would have never thought about at my age :)
Like you say.. ultimately our Asian backgrounds and the societies we're from make it inevitable for us to be caught up with things like 'prestige'...And why it's difficult for me to dismiss U of C casually. (+ the fact that I'm really attracted to the intellectual intensity and the courses offered by the English & history depts. there; I wish Barnard would send me a course catalogue too!!!)
But again and again I keep on feeling that I should follow my heart for this decision.... If I don't, then I'd be going against what I believe in and live by...</p>

<p>Very "tentatively" I've chosen Barnard.. but I just met this awesssome sorority girl from U of C today (and it's the first U of C "click" I've had.. so I want to give it another chance)... so yes... the dilemma continues... till May 1st.</p>

<p>Ahimsa... your post was truly awesome.. thank you!</p>

<p>And Husky Sky - wasn't Barnard also on your list.. of your trilemma?
On a side note, I would choose U of C over Wellesley too (any day!! hahaha - but that's cus the thought of a TRADITIONAL women's college freaks me out)</p>

<p>Ahimsa, you sound so cool. One of those alumnae I'm proud to be affiliated with. :)</p>

<p>PrimeFactor, are you going to be on campus for the April 17/18 festivities? D and mom will be there.</p>

<p>Yep, sure am, though the 17th, I'll be frantically putting the finishing touches on my thesis, due the 18th! I'm hosting a student, too. Is your daughter staying with a student or with mom in a hotel?</p>

<p>Ahhh I wanna go to admitted students weekend tooo :( pooooopp...</p>

<p>Believe me, there are thousands more of us outspoken Barnard alums out there, eager to be useful in any way possible! I'm glad you weren't taken aback by my long, rambling, highly opinionated post.</p>

<p>I've been lurking in and out of this forum since last year, then dropped out as my d moved on, but now looking forward to fall, peeked in again. Eager to meet members of 2009 when I visit my d. It sounds like BC is livelier than ever and overflowing with young women of great promise.</p>