My daughter is considering BC or Carnegie Mellon as a premed after being accepted for class of 2023 RD. She will major in biology at BC or the Mellon College of Science at CMU. Which school do you recommend for a premed? Is it harder to get a good GPA at one school over the other? What is the medical school acceptance rate?
I don’t know anything about CMUs program other than the general super high reputation in math, physics and engineering. And a fantastic school for theatre etc. I love Pittsburgh and it’s close to Pitt and upmc medical complex and med school.
My experience with BC the pre health track has been awesome for my d. Super supportive and also lots of opportunities for research and activities aligned with the track. And the service culture that passes to the students is for real and was attractive to us as a family. We aren’t religious and my daughter is not at all. Hasn’t been an issue.
For us the another benefit for our student was to have on campus access to college sports and cultural attractions in Boston too. Not extremely social and studying being so intense, we wanted fun and easy options to get involved with right on campus and BC has been a home run in this category. Even with a tough first semester from a friend perspective she had things to do and people to go with, now even the early friend group drama has worked out wonderfully.
Neither will be easier than the other. I do know BC has very high placement rates if you are approved by the committee. And they will support you even after you graduate for admissions purposes. How many don’t make it to commited approval level I don’t know.
Interesting side bar. D’s we’ll known Chem professor has a serious cancer diagnosis. His wife set up a blog for students to follow. The spouse posted that the professor x had an important meeting at mass general last week. The dr introduced himself and told prof x. You probably don’t remember me but I had you for chem at bc 15 years ago. Choked me up.
Either way best of luck!!
@privatebanker That must be my son’s first semester professor. Hope for good health and recovery. We went to his presentation at Accepted student day last summer. @hdkhdkhdk My son is not pre-med but has bio and chem classes.
Must be. All the students signed a huge card for him. It was quite touching I’ve been told. But isn’t that a great full circle of life story. I hope he gets well. They say he’s tough but amazing.
If you want to go pre-med then think about:
- The cheapest reasonable college so you/your parents can use the money for med school
- The college needs to prepare you for MCATs but still allow you to get a good GPA
- Access to volunteering opportunities (e.g., near a hospital)
- Success in graduates getting into med school
- Options if you don’t go to med school. Oh you are convince you will now, but probably less than 20% freshman pre-meds actually apply to med school, much less make it in.
Thank you all. I’m still trying to get information on medical school acceptance rates for BC and CMU. I heard that BC may be better to get a good GPA since CMU does not grade on a curve and you are competing in classes with the geniuses in the engineering and hard sciences majors.
There is a premed conversation on the BC threads. A junior premed just responded. 80 percent who apply to committee are approved and they are incredibly helpful. But classes are very hard and most students have self selected by then was her bottom line.
I’m sure it’s the same at CMU.
Thanks - I need to confirm what the med school acceptance rate is for CMU and how hard it is to get a good GPA there.
Be careful about medical school admission rates. Some colleges have a pre-med committee which will advise the student and write a committee letter of recommendation that is included in medical school applications. This almost certainly means that the pre-med committee will inform pre-meds with no realistic chance of admission of that fact, discouraging them from applying. At some schools, they may refuse to write committee letters for pre-meds who do not have a high chance of admission. Whether a pre-med committee does just the first or does both, it effectively removes the pre-meds who are most likely to be unsuccessful from its medical school applicant pool, resulting in higher medical school admission rates. If it does the second, how high a chance of admission is needed to get a committee letter also affects the college’s medical school admission rates.
Note that the pre-med committee process does have some advantages for the pre-med, in that those who will not be successful will be “weeded out” before going through the expensive and stressful process of applying to medical schools, and can proceed with alternate plans earlier.
I am concerned that premed students at CMU, due to its highly competitive and cutthroat environment, will get Cs and self select out of med school applications. I have no idea what its like being premed at CMU and how hard it is.
Thinking about this, I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, I think your concerns about the difficulty of maintaining a high GPA at CMU and obtaining superior grades in the prerequisite classes are legitimate given the high stats of its student body. CMU is absolutely stacked with high achieving STEM students. Per the 2018-2019 Common Data Set for CMU, the 25th percentile in math was 750 and the 75th percentile was 800. This means the average CMU student (in that reported class) is walking around with a 775 SAT math score! That is incredibly high! Compare that to the average math score of a BC student of 709 per BC’s 2018-2019 Fact Book -which is very good but not at that kind of level. Which group would you rather your daughter compete for an A in organic chemistry or in other prerequisite classes? I acknowledge high math scores do not necessarily equate to corresponding ability in other science classes but I would expect a high correlation. Many of the kids that in the stratosphere in terms of math scores are also top performers in science. Assuming your daughter has the average stats of a CMU freshman, while nothing is guaranteed I would bet on her performing in the top quarter of BC students before being average or below average. I would not take that same bet with CMU. Advantage to attending BC when looked at through this lense.
On the other hand, the statistic that only a small percentage of pre-meds actually matriculate to medical school should be paid attention to. If your daughter for any reason does not pursue medical school but pivots to another STEM related interest I would argue she would be better off at CMU due to the obvious strengths and focus of school.
It goes without saying, none if this matters if fit has not been factored in. No kid is going to well in the long term where they are not happy or if they feel they did not get enough input in the final selection. The demographics are also markedly different at both schools. Again, this could influence fit depending on the background of the student.
I hope none of the advice in the first paragraph is construed as a back handed slap at BC or is any insinuation that it is an easy school. It is not. I hold the school in very high regard. I have a brother who attended BC and went on to attend an Ivy league medical school from there. His journey was not a cake walk. If you do well there you can go anywhere from BC. Good luck to your daughter in whatever choice she makes!
Thank you Shiprock1976. Your advice is sound. We will just have to go visit these two schools and reassess. I will report back our feedback.
you are wasting your time searching for this number. Not that schools don’t track it per se, but the do make it hard to get. But more importantly, what does that number actually mean. Do you the parent, you are looking for the numerator and denominator for apps to allopathic med schools in the US. However, many colleges track any med school anywhere, so they include osteopathic med schools, med schools in the Caribbean, Mexico, and any where else. They, how does one count alums who apply a year or two after graduation, as such students might want to strengthen their applications with health care/med research, or take a little more time to study for the mcat?
And finally, how restrictive is teh school with “Committee Letters.” For example, Holy Cross likes to tout their ~80% acceptance rate to med schools, but that is really only 80% of those ‘approved’ by the HC Committee to actually apply. In other words, HC only actively supports its top students to apply to med school; by definition, those students will be successful in admissions. HC’s strong, but more average student will not receive the Committee recommendation to med schools, which is the kiss of death to the applicant.
fwiw: BC does have a Committee to advise in the process, but they help all students, even those with a really low chance of admission to med school.
My advice is to visit each and see which she likes better, what college she could call ‘home’ for four years. That will be the place that she is likely to do better.
Any financial considerations?
Boston College has much better campus life, school spirit is contagious there. CMU is a more depressing undergraduate environment, but U of Pitt is close by and the hospitals in Pittsburgh close by.
BC is located west of Boston, but on the T Green line to get in, very convenient public transportation.
Your quality of life matters. If you burn out in the four years at CMU, how can you really do the heavy lifting that
Medical school requires?
Also realize that many students today attend for profit medical schools of osteopathy. Lower MCAT scores required for that. Same exact residencies, which irks the MD crowd, but well we need more doctors in the USA.
Also some medical programs come with scholarships. This will not be the ones you already know.
There are now many paths to becoming a doctor in the USA, explore that when you have time.
My daughter and I attended both BC and CMU this past weekend for the admitted student weekend, half of each actually due to both being held over the same weekend.
BC’s event was very well organized and stressed the importance of making a whole person with the core curriculum and a well rounded education in a liberal arts setting. The premed program seemed impressive in the advising and support they provide, with a 75% acceptance rate for anyone who applies (no committee requirement for a GPA). There are about 100 students who apply to med schools each year. The demographics seemed heavily rich white kids but diverse enough to include about 30% AHANA. School is in a suburban setting, with close proximity to Boston, which cannot be beat. However, I worry whether the party scene is dominant during weekends and whether there is pressure to party/drink etc., and what happens to those that do not choose to party.
CMU’s event was not as well organized and the school had a disheveled feel, very techy, professionally driven, predominately asian, and we only saw students study all the time from morning to night. It was surprising to hear that only 35 students apply to med schools each year, with about 60-80% acceptance rate (with no GPA requirement for committee rec). Comparing the two schools, the perception is that it is harder to get the same 3.7 GPA at CMU vs BC, but this is unsubstantiated.
After the visits, we are now even more confused what would be the better school to attend. So we are back to the question, BC or CMU?
Of course, a pre-med who gets a realistic assessment of low admission chances from the pre-med committee may choose not to apply, even if the committee is willing to write a letter (which may not be as strong as that written for stronger pre-meds).
If the committee says that you are basically throwing away thousands of dollars and a lot of effort on almost certainly futile applications, would you apply?
small nit: Technically, the lower half of main campus is within the Boston City limits. But yes, green, leafy campus with suburban feel.
Plenty of parties around for those that wish to partake, but many do not, particularly premeds*. Non-partiers head into the City for dinner and a movie, or go to a night hockey game to cheer, workout, and the like.
If she liked them both, choose BC. The Core will benefit her greatly in whichever field she chooses.
Check out the new Neuro major. (My D had to make up her own a few years back.)
*Getting A’s in lab courses requires commitment at every college, so social life for premeds is just not the same as it is for say, a marketing major. 
Really appreciate the opportunities available at both superb schools.
FYI. Wife from Pittsburgh and mil adjuncts at cmu. Fil tenured at Pitt. We know the area for sure.
D is at BC as a first year. Pre health track bio chem. Partying is not a big deal. For most it’s the lack of parties that are a concern for some. But there is enough to keep you socially involved for sure. Lol. @bluebayou ‘a advice is spot on.
Cmu has the upmc medical school and complex just up the street at Pitt And it’s just an awesome school.
But for us, the combo of superb academics, access to Boston for fun and research hospitals— along with the school spirit stuff like football was pretty compelling.
It was for my d at least. She’s really happy but first semester was tough. The school work for bio chem started out fast and hard. Expect your fist “B”. FWIW.
Re: committee. If you get committee support at BC it is really strong. And they allow you access to the prehealth advisory resources even after you graduate. We appreciated that they seem to favor med school applications after a year or two of post grad lab work or peace corps etc. Advising is generic until year two. Or at least it is for our d. She gets someone different next year. So be prepared to reach out and be proactive regarding freshman year classes. And they choose during new student orientation. Avoid the desire to be a hero is fall semester.
My daughter has decided on CMU for its campus vibe, demographics, and her personal fit of being a little off mainstream, geeky, and independent. She knows what she’s getting herself into, a.k.a, into the fire of high stress. She will come out stronger she hopes. Hope we made the right decision!
Congrats to her.
And if she has time, it would be classy to notify BC of the declination so they can start running numbers for any wait listees.