<p>Well, for all of the problems of Berkeley, I don't know that the other UC's are any better. You would only transfer to another school if it is significantly better than what you had before. I am not particularly convinced that this is the case with the other UC's. One might be able to argue that perhaps UCLA is equivalent to Berkeley (although even that is questionable to me). But better? I don't know about that.</p>
<p>well even if the other UC's not any better than berkeley, transferring to.., lets say, UCSB or UCI will greatly increase one's chance of getting an A and eventually better gpa given that person works relatively hard.
From what I've heard (from my friends etc.) its MUCH easier to get an A in UCI or even UCSD then in Berkeley.</p>
<p>well, i don't think transferring to a easier school to get good grades would look so good in the future job/grad application but maybe that's better for you if you are on the verge of flunking out???</p>
<p>I don't think that it's even debatable that it's easier to get As at the other UCs. I think the poster was frustrated that it's so difficult to get a high GPA at Berkeley, hence why he wanted to transfer out. I don't think academic reputation has anything to do with it (other than that's the reason he/she probably entered Cal in the first place).</p>
<p>Youre right its not debatable...Berkeley is by FAR the hardest UC to maintain a high GPA. Even in the case of UCLA, its not close to as hard as Cal. I have talked about this to 2 of my friends who transferred from UCLA to Cal. They both said Cal is significantly harder.</p>
<p>Allright, I'll take this one on. I don't know that Berkeley is "by far" the hardest UC to maintain a high GPA, or that such a a notion is 'not even debateable'. That's very unclear to me. </p>
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lets say, UCSB or UCI will greatly increase one's chance of getting an A and eventually better gpa given that person works relatively hard.
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</p>
<p>First off, I would say that that final phrase gives away part of the problem right there. The truth is, for pure sociological reasons, if you go to an easier school, you will probably not work as hard. Simply put, when people around you are lazy, you also tend to become lazy. It's quite difficult to decide to work hard when others around you are not working hard. </p>
<p>And that of course presumes that the other UC's are indeed easier (read:grade inflated) relative to Berkeley. Of that, I'm not so sure. </p>
<p><a href="http://www.gradeinflation.com/berkeley.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.gradeinflation.com/berkeley.html</a>
<a href="http://www.gradeinflation.com/santabarbara.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.gradeinflation.com/santabarbara.html</a>
<a href="http://www.gradeinflation.com/riverside.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.gradeinflation.com/riverside.html</a>
<a href="http://www.gradeinflation.com/irvine.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.gradeinflation.com/irvine.html</a></p>
<p>Look, the truth is, Berkeley is indeed a grade-inflated school. Not as much as the top private schools (i.e. HYPS), but it still is a grade-inflated school. </p>
<p>"In the late 1950's, the average cumulative GPA for Berkeley undergraduates was 2.50 and has increased to approximately 3.25 [in 2004]...</p>
<p>Of 79,791 undergraduate course grades given at UC Berkeley fall 2003, almost 50% were A's, approximately 35% were B's, and less than 5% were D's or F's."</p>
<p>The * real* issue is that the grade inflation is * unevenly distributed*. Certain classes, and indeed certain entire majors are far more inflated than others. There are indeed classes at Berkeley where you can get a very good grade for doing very little work and knowing very little of what is happening. On the other spectrum, there are other classes where you can work like an absolute dog, and STILL end up with a terrible grade. </p>
<p>"the humanities and social sciences in many classes had all but given up on grades below a B, and in many courses below an A-, and the biological sciences had no consistent pattern"</p>
<p>In fact, I seem to recall an argument made by slicmlic2001 that Berkeley is actually a * great * school in which you can "protect" your GPA via judicious use of the drop policy and cherry-picking your way through the easiest possible classes you can find. In particular, so the argument goes, if done right, Berkeley may actually be an * easier * school to get a top GPA than UCLA is (and presumably the other UC's also) - in fact, so much so, that this could be considered a strong reason for cross-admits to prefer Berkeley over UCLA. Naturally, this argument seems to me to be highly major-specific - i.e., I highly doubt that such a strategy would work well in, say, engineering. But I think there are indeed many students at Berkeley who are in majors in which such a strategy could work out quit well. </p>
<p>I don't want to this this thread into an exhibit of hearsay, so if you want more details, you should probably contact slicmlic2001 directly. But he did seem to have the idea worked out.</p>
<p>I have to go soon, so I'll make it quick - we have to consider that the other UCs are much, much easier than Berkeley (let's be honest, the people who go to Riverside and the people who go to Cal are completely different types students). For example, consider a low-quality inner city high school where people aren't as motivated and a top suburban one where people are all striving to get As. The inner city school might have a lower average, and the suburban one would probably have a higher one, but clearly if you compared the difficulty the suburban one would clearly be harder. The same argument holds true for the UCs, albeit to a lesser extent.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I have to go soon, so I'll make it quick - we have to consider that the other UCs are much, much easier than Berkeley (let's be honest, the people who go to Riverside and the people who go to Cal are completely different types students). For example, consider a low-quality inner city high school where people aren't as motivated and a top suburban one where people are all striving to get As. The inner city school might have a lower average, and the suburban one would probably have a higher one, but clearly if you compared the difficulty the suburban one would clearly be harder. The same argument holds true for the UCs, albeit to a lesser extent.
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<p>Yes, the student bodies are different. But I wouldn't say the difference is as extreme as you are implying. After all, to even be UC-eligible at all, you have to be in the top x% of your class. UCRiverside is a far from terrible school. </p>
<p>
[quote]
I have to go soon, so I'll make it quick - we have to consider that the other UCs are much, much easier than Berkeley (let's be honest, the people who go to Riverside and the people who go to Cal are completely different types students). For example, consider a low-quality inner city high school where people aren't as motivated and a top suburban one where people are all striving to get As. The inner city school might have a lower average, and the suburban one would probably have a higher one, but clearly if you compared the difficulty the suburban one would clearly be harder. The same argument holds true for the UCs, albeit to a lesser extent.
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<p>And like I said before, we also have to consider the sociological effects. If we were to go to an inner-city high school, we would probably become less motivated ourselves. Similarly, if you were to go to Riverside rather than Berkeley, you might also become less motivated to the point that you might end up with * worse * grades at Riverside than at Berkeley. </p>
<p>The point is, it's actually somewhat unclear to me whether somebody would end up with better grades by going to a lesser UC. You are presuming a lot of things, not least of which is presuming that your level of motivation would remain the same, when it probably won't.</p>
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UC-eligible at all, you have to be in the top x% of your class.
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<p>Untrue. You can apply with any class standing (you just have to meet their GPA/SAT cutoff).</p>
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you just have to meet their GPA/SAT cutoff).
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<p>That's what I'm talking about when I say x% of your class. The x% is calculated as a holistic figure.</p>
<p>seems like such a tough place to be pre-med</p>
<p>I work in the film industry and they DO care if you graduate from Cal (any degree, any GPA and they will not ask your GPA anyway!) and in this industry they DON’T care if you graduated from UCSD with a 4.0. sure it is a high ranking school, but Cal has the brand name. also, 95 percent of the transfer students graduate successfully from Cal, and 90 percent of the freshman students graduate. </p>
<p>GPA has just about nothing to do with the real world—in some fields companies pull kids out of college and hire them with high GPAs. but in most fields, just graduating from Cal is a big deal and the school is known worldwide and getting any degree with any gpa from Cal will help you in so many ways. if you get accepted to Cal, don’t blow it and drop out because of something like worrying about GPA. GPA is totally bogus anyway. it helps with scholarships and grad school. end of story. good luck dudes!</p>
<p>you guys do know that this is a five-year old thread that you are commenting on…</p>
<p>northbeach, I understand your industry doesn’t necessarily require a very high GPA, but there are many other majors where potential employers use GPA to determine whether or not you get an interview, like Business and Engineering. </p>
<p>And then there’s all the students planning to go to Grad, Law, Medical school. Sometimes it’s just best to not go here if your GPA will be severely impacted and you could pull off a 3.8+ at a state school.</p>
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<p>Unfortunately, it is the formerly mentioned “some fields” - e.g. engineering, consulting, finance, law, medicine - that are deemed to be the most desirable jobs, as determined by college graduates. Sure, I agree that many (probably most) fields don’t really care about GPA…but those fields don’t tend to offer the types of careers and opportunities that college students tend to want. </p>
<p>Besides, just consider the situation from a motivational standpoint. Most Berkeley students studied very hard to be admitted in the first place, and then worked hard to successfully graduate. Do you really think, after all of that, many of them would be willing to settle for a career that other college graduates with low GPA’s from no-name, low-ranked schools are able to obtain? Seems to me that Berkeley graduates would like to be rewarded for their hard work, and rightfully so. Why work hard if you’re not going to be rewarded?</p>
<p>^You guys should ask Professor Dorian Liepmann who is a professor of Mechanical Engineering and Bioengineering here at Berkeley about his scholastic and professional adult life and he’ll tell you how he struggled to maintain above a 3.0 in his undergrad years. Obviously this doesn’t apply to most of us here on this forum and very few people in his state will achieve as much as he has, but it just goes to show that there isn’t any exact formula. </p>
<p>I feel when you guys emphasize grades like this so much, you really discourage many of the other engineering students here into thinking that they have absolutely no future which is a little cold and not entirely true. It will be harder for them yes but not impossible. In fact I posted this in response to a Sakky response a while back but I’ll repost it here (the person in this quote is me btw):</p>
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<p>Look, the reality is that, whether we like it or not, GPA does matter. You will be judged by grad schools and the most desirable employers by your GPA. </p>
<p>Now, does that mean that your career is over if you have a low GPA? Clearly not. There are ways to recover. There are some (usually less desirable) employers who care little for GPA. </p>
<p>Nevertheless, having a low GPA does close certain doors. You’re not going to get into med-school or a top law school with a poor GPA. {You might get into a low-ranked law school, but doing so probably won’t land you the best law associate jobs afterwards.} </p>
<p>I wish I could agree with northbeach that everybody who graduates from Berkeley (or any other name-brand school) has a great job waiting for them afterwards. Sadly, I cannot. Not everybody is going to have a great job. I wish they did.</p>
<p>I agree that just being able to graduate doesn’t entitle one to a good job. Some employers will use GPA as a filtering mechanism when screening applicants. Other, less desirable employers, may not care what your GPA is. The one thing all employers care about is your ability to do the job. If having a degree from Berkeley can land you an interview it still won’t get you the job if you come across as arrogant or entitled because you graduated from Berkeley.</p>