Berkeley or Middlebury?

[RML]

<p>urbanslaughter:</p>

<p>I never attended Berkeley. I applied there back in my time but I wasn’t accepted. In that year, Berkeley accepted only about 6.8% of all the international applicants. It was one of the only 2 US schools (the other is MIT) that turned me down. I got into 4 Ivies, however, and a number of elite LACs, including Hurvey Mudd and Bowdoin. </p>

<p>I went to a university in England. And the only US school I’ve had the experience of attending was Stanford. I spent time there as an exchange student, and lived in campus almost the whole time. That said, that doesn’t make me ignorant about prestigious US schools. </p>

<p>

If it did, then Florida, Ohio State, Notre Dame and USC would be the most prestigious schools in the country. I think we can agree that’s not true.

</p>

<p>prestige = respectability + popularity </p>

<p>The schools in your examples are somewhat popular. But none of them is widely respected as an academic powerhouse.</p>

[farkula]

<p>

@RML

farkula, life sciences are not part of the engineering discipline. lol

Note that my earlier statement says “best ROI are the technology-science-oriented schools” and life science is science is it not?</p>

<p>

@RML

prestige = respectability + popularity

</p>

<p>Did you read what urbanslaughter said? LOL, most likely no cause I’m almost certain now that you are ■■■■■■■■. hahaha, thanks for making me feel and seem foolish for responding… :D</p>

[johnwesley]

<p>

prestige = respectability + popularity

</p>

<p>There’s nothing simple about prestige, especially, when comparing apples with oranges. Interestingly, RML, you are dividing your time almost equally between what, by your definition, should be two widely divergent forums, in terms of prestige. If they are so lopsided, why would you bother? Obviously, they are comparable in terms of audience:
[College</a> Confidential - Search Results](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/search.php?searchid=38683455]College”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/search.php?searchid=38683455)</p>

[arcadia]

<p>Have fun with that $16 billion shortfall. If you think that won’t negatively impact every UC campus in the coming years, you’re sorely mistaken.</p>

[RML]

<p>

Have fun with that $16 billion shortfall. If you think that won’t negatively impact every UC campus in the coming years, you’re sorely mistaken.

</p>

<p>Why would you say something like that to someone who isn’t going to Berkeley? lol</p>

<p>I think someone over at the Berkeley forum said that only about 15% - 20% of Berkeley’s budget comes from the State of California.</p>

[RML]

<p>

Note that my earlier statement says “best ROI are the technology-science-oriented schools” and life science is science is it not?

</p>

<p>Then you’re still wrong, for a career in life sciences wouldn’t yield the highest of salary rates. </p>

<p>Compare the two:</p>

<p>Molecular & Cell Biology
<a href=“https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/MCB.stm[/url]”>https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/MCB.stm&lt;/a&gt;
Average Salary - $39,985</p>

<p>Electrical Engineering and Computer Sciences
<a href=“https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/EECS.stm[/url]”>https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/EECS.stm&lt;/a&gt;
Average Salary - $80,774</p>

[RML]

<p>

Second, you invent this unquantifiable claim that Berkeley graduates are so much more employable than Midd graduates that Berkeley would “pawn Midd Big time”. Another delusional statement. I’m sure there is some study of employment rates 6 months after graduation (or the enrollment in grad school equivalent). With the unemployment rate in California being over 11% and the fact that there are more than 10 times as many students enrolled at Berkeley as there are at Middlebury, I suspect the opposite of your claim is actually true. And lets compare apples to apples here, I’m looking only at undergrad graduates.

</p>

<p>You suspect??? lol… </p>

<p>Like I said, if Midd grads are truly more employable than Berkeley grads are then prove it. Or, at least, destroy the payscale data by counter offering it with another survey of some sort that would contradict payscale’s results. Now, since you don’t have any proof that would support your claim about Midd grads making more than Berkeley grads do, I’d stick to what I have even though they’re not the best data. </p>

<p>

Also, you’re claim that we can’t compare rates of Midd students at top grad schools to rates of Berkeley students - only whole numbers is also so ridiculous I feel silly having to explain it to you.

</p>

<p>What do yo mean by this?</p>

<p>

By that standard, people in China are taller than people in any other country because their combined height is greater than any other country (boy I hope that helps clarify your absurdity)

</p>

<p>No; you didn’t get what I said. Please read my Americans vs Nigerians example on page 2 of this thread.</p>

[urbanslaughter]

<p>You didn’t go there??? Good God, Could I please have the last thirty minutes of my life back? At least we speak from experience. You’re relying on . . . well, nothing.</p>

[RML]

<p>^ lol…</p>

<p>So, you’ve had solid experience as a student at Cal too? lol</p>

[RML]

<p>

Third, you claim, “You need to be one of the best at Midd to get into any grad program at Berkeley grad school. Midd does not have easy access to Berkeley grad school. It does not.” I’m willing to concede that this may be a semantics argument. No one is claiming that Midd grads can simply walk into Berkeley as grad students.

</p>

<p>Really? Then what’s this? </p>

<p>

Then also, you could always go to UC Berkeley for grad school.*

<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/14358191-post9.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/14358191-post9.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

[johnwesley]

<p>

Like I said, if Midd grads are truly more employable than Berkeley grads are then prove it. Or, at least, destroy the payscale data by counter offering it with another survey of some sort that would contradict payscale’s results. Now, since you don’t have any proof that would support your claim about Midd grads making more than Berkeley grads do, I’d stick to what I have even though they’re not the best data.

</p>

<p>Wait, you’re using Payscale as a metric? LOL. Does Payscale take into consideration unemployed graduates? Good luck with trying to assert Berkeley has fewer of those than Midd.</p>

[arcadia]

<p>

Why would you say something like that to someone who isn’t going to Berkeley?

</p>

<p>Why would someone who has no affiliation with Berkeley care?</p>

[urbanslaughter]

<p>So, you’ve had solid experience as a student at Cal too? lol</p>

<p>Well, I attended Middlebury, so I have experience with Middlebury. Turns out we both have as much experience as each other with Berkeley. You have no experience with either school.</p>

[urbanslaughter]

<p>RML, I never made any claims about Midd grads making more than Berkeley grads. We were discussing your word, “employability”. I was just saying, and johnwesley appears to agree, that Midd grads are LIKELY employed at a higher rate than Cal grads. I don’t think that takes anything away from Cal, and I’m not wasting any more time searching for the data (Someone please find it for me, so we can shut down his claim).</p>

[johnwesley]

<p>

I was just saying, and johnwesley appears to agree, that Midd grads are LIKELY employed at a higher rate than Cal grads.

</p>

<p>After all, RML is the fellow who said:

Now, don’t ever say that we need to adjust that for size of the schools because that is wrong. I’d say we adjust that based on the number of applicants at Yale Law. And, while we do not have the numbers of applicants, I’m inclined to believe that Berkeley would perform better than Midd.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Assuming seniors apply for jobs at about the same rate (i.e., 100%) which school do you think is going to have the greatest number of unemployed? If RML is going to throw around numbers suggesting bigger schools get more people hired at Goldman Sachs and McKinsey, then let’s be consistent: bigger schools also have more unemployed graduates.</p>

[urbanslaughter]

<p>Lol
Touch</p>

[hopeful4college1]

<p>Ok so i saw this thread on the berkeley page, and even though Cal used to be one of my dream schools (and I’m not planning on applying to Midd because it’s waaaayyy above my league) the way the berkeley supporters presented their arguments really annoyed me so I’m going to contribute here too.</p>

<p>RML, when middlover said “you could always go to berkeley for grad school”, i believe he meant “because Midd doesn’t have a grad school, but berkeley does. so if you wanted to try both, you could go to midd for undergrad and berkeley for grad so you can be at both places eventually.” (Correct me if i’m wrong middlover)</p>

<p>But anyway, just as, i’m sure, the very bottom of the class wouldn’t be able to go to a grad school in berkeley from Midd, neither would the bottom of the class in berkeley undergrad.</p>

<p>I don’t think each OBVIOUS post trying to offer advice for a troubled OP needs to go “of course that’s if you graduate midd with over a 1.0, don’t get arrested too often, get decent recs…etcetcetc” come on. Why you gotta be so sensitive RML?</p>

<p>Unfortunately RML, “you are mistaken” (seems like your favorite phrase ahhaha), when you say that Midd isn’t in the same league as ivies. Midd is more selective than Cornell, and there are a decent number of applicants who choose Midd over all the ivies. Check parchment.com for these stats. I’m not saying the majority do, btw, but there is a decent percentage.</p>

<p>I don’t really get your America Africa Pakistan example. I think a better example for you is claiming that Americans are smarter than Kiwis (people from New Zealand) because there are more Americans who’ve gotten a noble prize. And then claiming that that’s a direct indication of higher intelligence (like you assumed that higher SATs=smarter), and saying that the fact that there are so many more Americans than Kiwis (idk the population numbers, but this is true, right?) doesn’t really matter. The only thing that matters is that there are more Americans who’ve won a noble prize. Then also neglecting the fact that there are so many more crimes/unemployments in the US than in New Zealand, and claiming that the USA is a nicer country because the GDP (not per capita) is higher in the USA than in New Zealand.</p>

<p>RML, for the sake of Berkeley, please don’t post anymore… You’re literally bringing the image of berkeley down. I’m still going to apply there, but seeing a sad old man who’s “educated” and married and stuff, argue for hours against teenagers…and then lose those arguments because you set yourself up by your really dumb arguments and your stats that really tell the opposite story or no story at all… It makes me think Berkeley creates pathetic people. So now, Berkeley’s no where near my “dream” school list. I’m still going to research more about the school which I used to really like, but I feel like these forums are a good indicator of personality than flowered and glorified college guides are.</p>

<p>Also, of course people are going to defend Middlebury on the middlebury page… That’s like going to Chicago and insulting the Black Hawks there.
And since you’re bashing a perfectly nice school on the berkeley page, obviously the midd people will see it and defend themselves. You really just seem like a slightly educated school yard bully, while the midd people (and some NORMAL berkeley supporters) are counselors trying to calm you down with facts.</p>

<p>btw, the reason someone said “I suspect” is because they acknowledge that their are making a not fully supported claim, which is so much better than what you’ve been doing. Blatantly spewing out pretenses and claiming that they’re supported by not-very-well-y manipulated “stats”.</p>

<p>Ugh please don’t bring me into this argument though. I’m just a high school kid from a private school in the midwest. (not even the east coast, okay?) and I’m not associated with Midd in anyway. I’m just here because I don’t like people bringing down the Berkeley image by spreading stupidity. RML, PLEASE STOP. what if other juniors see this and think the same? They might even decide to apply to Midd instead. And God forbid that happen, right?</p>

[hopeful4college1]

<p>…peace (:</p>

[coucollcou]

<p>Isn’t this supposed to be a Middlebury waitlist thread?</p>

<p>Any new news on that front?</p>

[arcadia]

<p>

Isn’t this supposed to be a Middlebury waitlist thread?</p>

<p>Any new news on that front?

</p>

<p>You’re better off here:</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/middlebury-college/1335148-waitlist-discussion-thread.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/middlebury-college/1335148-waitlist-discussion-thread.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;