Berkeley Or UCLA Philosophy

Transfer Students UC Transfers
1

<p>I am not transferring until fall 2010 but i am beginning to think where i would like to go. I am from the Los Angeles area so staying close would be ideal which gives UCLA an advantage, but i heard that Berkeley has a really good environment to study philosophy and gives you more options. I currently have a 3.5 so its unclear if ill even be accepted to either, but i just want to find out as much information as i can.</p>

<p>Share your knowledge on the two different programs and a recommendation please.</p>

<p>PS: Good luck to all of you waiting on ucla and ucb</p>

2

<p>it might be more prudent to ask this question again in 8 days, when all of this selfish anxiety subsides and people start to care again.</p>

3

<p>3.5 I say you don’t have a shot on berkeley, but LA, besides, berkeley don’t have nice looking ladies.</p>

4

<p>A 3.5 GPA will give this person a shot at Berkeley, no doubt. Don’t chime in with a misinformed opinion.</p>

<p>Eshug1-
Both schools have great philosophy programs, and I’d say they’re pretty comparable, but Berkeley is overall better known to more people, and often times will jump off the page at someone, be it an employer reading your resume, or an admissions officer reading your grad/law school application.</p>

<p>Here is a helpful thread on the subject:
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/other-college-majors/105141-best-philosophy-programs.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/other-college-majors/105141-best-philosophy-programs.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

5

<p>I am a philosophy major, I think I can help.</p>

<p>Berkeley is the number 4 ranked philosophy school in the NATION. UCLA is not even on the LIST.</p>

<p>Both schools are ANALYTIC in fashion, however, Berkeley will be shoving atheistic views down your throat, so if you are a Christian, like me, go there with the realization that they will be ignorant to the truths of such arguments as the Kalam Cosmological Argument and will probably throw out there some counter argument, such as HUME or something, trying to say that the multiverse hypothesis proves that there could have been an infinite number of universes etc. </p>

<p>The problem with this, however, is in two part.</p>

<p>The first is that, mathematically, Hilbert’s Hotel proves that an actually infinite number of things CANNOT exist in reality, something HUME could not have known in 1729 when he wrote the Treatise of Human Nature.</p>

<p>Secondly, the multiverse hypothesis leads to an Infinite Regress of ideas, thus Philosophically it is abandoned. </p>

<p>Thirdly, just for kicks, it goes against everything we know about modern cosmology, namely, that It does not explain the Big Bang Theory having come “Out of Nothing, By Nothing.” </p>

<p>So, if you can put up with Atheists all day making nonsense claims just because they are ignorant to Alvin Plantinga of the University of Notre Dame, Stephen Hawking, William Lane Craig, etc. Then go to Berkeley,…OBVIOUSLY its the better school, look at the rankings…#4.</p>

6

<p>“Berkeley is the number 4 ranked philosophy school in the NATION. UCLA is not even on the LIST.” </p>

<p>Every ranking I’ve scene has UCLA ranked right with Berkeley, or even ahead of it…</p>

7

<p>Lol, are you crazy??</p>

<p>Every philosophical ranking has UCLA either ahead or tied with Berkeley.</p>

<p>And yes good schools of philosophy keep those damn theists out of the picture =p</p>

<p>(Existentialist Nihilism FTW!)</p>

<p>If you’re interested in going to a good school of philosophy with a theist emphasis, then go to a private school.</p>

8

<p>Or you can double up in Religious Studies. That’d be a good synthesis.</p>

9

<p>Someone please show me these “philosophical rankings”…</p>

10

<p>[The</a> Philosophical Gourmet Report 2009 :: Overall Rankings](<a href=“http://www.philosophicalgourmet.com/overall.asp]The”>http://www.philosophicalgourmet.com/overall.asp)</p>

<p>Rankings of Faculties in the United States</p>

<p>1.) New York University
2.) Rutgers University
3.) Princeton University
4.) Pittsburgh University
5.) University of Michigan
6.) Harvard University
7.) MIT
8.) Yale
9.) Stanford
10.) University of California–Berkeley
10.) University of California–Los Angeles</p>

<p>There you have it…</p>

11

<p>[Ranking</a> Philosophy Programs gonepublic: philosophy, politics, & public life](<a href=“http://gonepublic.■■■■■■■■■■■■■/2007/03/18/ranking-philosophy-programs/]Ranking”>Ranking Philosophy Programs – gonepublic by Noëlle McAfee)</p>

<ol>
<li>New York University</li>
<li>Rutgers</li>
<li>Princeton University</li>
<li>University of Michigan-Ann Arbor</li>
<li>University of Pittsburgh</li>
<li>Stanford University</li>
<li>Harvard University</li>
<li>MIT</li>
<li>UCLA</li>
<li>Columbia University</li>
<li>Univ. of North Carolina-–Chapel Hill</li>
</ol>

12

<p>bassplrflea, what is your source? </p>

<p>Do you go to Berkeley?</p>

13

<p>

</p>

<p>And as someone with a philosophy degree from UCLA, let me respond to this one real quick. Philosophy requires you to objectively evaluate all sorts of arguments and ideas. If your religious views are such that you cannot reasonably evaluate arguments both for and against the existence of a god because you don’t want to admit that the arguments for can be wrong or whatever, then perhaps religious studies is a better use of your time.</p>

<p>And secondly… the truths of the Kalam argument? Seriously? Where is the logical connection for the idea that the cause of the argument is what you define as “god”? As for Alvin Plantinga - he’s the guy that argues that faith in god is justifiable as rational because it is a “basic belief” or something like that right? Not exactly the strongest argument, you have to admit. </p>

<p>My point here is not to start a religious debate, but rather to point out that if you want to use philosophy to find an argument to justify your belief in a god, you won’t. All arguments for the existence of god fail miserably. Arguments against the existence of god tend to be much more defensible but ultimately fail almost as spectacularly.</p>

<p>Religious studies will stroke your theism all day long. Philosophy (if you are honest with yourself) will likely crush it.</p>

14

<p>predicthisflick thats pretty interesting - didn’t know such rankings were made anywhere but in people’s minds haha. UCLA does have a very strong faculty in the philosophy department, with the likes of Tyler Burge and David Kaplan. If we could do a “best hits” of UCLA philosophy, we could add Hans Reichenbach, Rudolf Carnap, and Betrand Russell to the list :D</p>

15

<p>I’d say it doesn’t matter where you go…both are great schools, just get into them first.</p>

<p>When you are accepted, go check out the Phil departments take a look at the upperdiv course load, the class sizes (probably similar), professors, ect (if it matters to you). Go to whichever department, campus, city, people, blah blah blah you like more.</p>

<p>best of luck, get 4.0’s</p>

16

<p>^ Exactly right - all the crap I’m on about really only matters for the PhD students, so unless you’re planning on getting a graduate degree in philosophy, don’t pay any attention to those rankings.</p>

17

<p>I will be in the same boat as you if I get into both this year. </p>

<p>I applied to Berkeley as a Philosophy major and as an art history major at UCLA(but will most likely switch to philosophy or double major if I attend).</p>

<p>I live about 10 miles from UCLA’s campus. And unfortunately my EFC is not 0. Parents will have to pay 6-8 thousand of the total estimated costs which should mean that my tuition and fees to ucla will be waived with grants(assuming they give me the same amount UCI did). My choice will be made based on money, because I don’t think I could justify paying more than 15K for two years to attend Berkeley(including housing costs) when I have the next best thing for next to nothing(considering I’ll be living at home).</p>

<p>From the way I understand UCLA vs UCB for philosophy is that UCLA is more analytical than Berkeley. Berkeley tends to be more broad and conver more subjects and philosophers. This is based on the opinions of professors and students I’ve talked to including what I’ve read hear on CC.</p>

18

<p>Here is a link to one of the discussions on CC about UCLA’s philosophy. <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/university-california-los-angeles/113998-how-philosophy-major-ucla.html?highlight=philosophy[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/university-california-los-angeles/113998-how-philosophy-major-ucla.html?highlight=philosophy&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

19

<p>And the opinion/info provided by a student, as seen in the link above.
"UCLA philosophy classes are probably nothing like anything you’ve ever taken in high school, community college, or a California State college – they’re much more rigorous, especially the upper division courses.</p>

<p>It’s an ‘analytic’ department, so if you’re looking to study Nietzsche, Sartre, Foucault, Diderot, Heidegger, etc., as an undergrad, then it’s not the place for you. This is not to say that this isn’t the place for you if you like those philosophers. Did that sound inconsistent? Well, let me explain why it’s not.</p>

<p>UCLA will train you to be meticulous thinkers. Period. You will notice differences where before, in your judgment, none existed. You will be expected to clearly explain a difficult concept, position, or argument. Trust me, clarity is harder than you think. You will learn the tools of the trade that philosophers use, so you can implement them in your thought processes and recognize them when reading philosophy – all for the betterment of your understanding. In a nutshell, UCLA will prepare you to be a rigorous thinker, which will prepare you to understand Nietzsche, Sartre, etc., all the better.</p>

<p>UCLA has lower division courses and upper division courses, but the lower division courses and the upper division courses come in two kinds. Let me break it down for you below.</p>

<p>Lower Division: Survey and Non-Survey.</p>

<p>The Survey Courses usually have between 150-250 students and usually cover a lot of material – hence “survey”. (Psst, I know I put the period outside the comma. It’s common practice in philosophy to put punctuation outside quotation marks). There are three required survey courses, and the grading system depends on the professor. Some like to give in-class midterms and finals, consisting of short answers to multiple questions; others prefer take-home midterms and finals, consisting, typically, of two 3-5 page responses to two question you’re given about a week ahead of time.</p>

<p>The Non-Survey Courses are also jammed packed, but the reading is much more manageable. You’ll probably be surprised with just how few readings you’ll have in a typical philosophy course, but that’s because you’re going to have to read everything at least three to five times before you understand even 70% of it. The grading in these courses is of the latter variety mentioned above.</p>

<p>Ironically, these lower division courses generally tend to be more difficult – at least that was my experience and that of my fellow philosophy buddies – than the upper division courses. Our theory is that they’re trying to weed out the non-hackers. (Pun intended).</p>

<p>Upper Division Courses: Regular and Seminar.</p>

<p>The (Regular) Upper Division Courses are limited to 40 students. Usually you’ll start with 40 but finish with 30, because many will drop or withdraw. These courses will focus on a very narrow topic in philosophy. The grading will consist of questions that are even more narrow than the course topic, and it’ll be take-home. So, you won’t write on everything covered in the class.</p>

<p>The Seminar Courses usually have 8-12 students enrolled, focus on a narrow philosophical topic, but more is required from the student – usually a more cummulative and in-depth understanding, which translates into just a single (8-12 page) final paper. So your whole grade will depend on this final paper. Yeah, it puts a little pressure on you.</p>

<p>BE WARNED AND BE READY: UCLA cannot give everyone an ‘A’. Only about 10% of you will get A’s, which means only two, possibly three, of you will get an A in a class consisting of 40 students. Here’s a ROUGH breakdown of how the grading goes in a 40 student course.</p>

<p>Grade Number of Students</p>

<p>A+ 0 - 1 (usu. 0)
A 2
A- 2
B+ 3
B 5
B- 4
C+ 6
Who Cares The Rest</p>

<p>Frankly, if you’re getting a C+ in a class, you’re not understanding.</p>

<p>Lower division classes have lecture and discussion sections. Lecture is where you go listen to your professor lecture. You can ask questions during lecture, but it’s at the discretion of the professor to call on you. Don’t be a time hog. Disccusion section is run by a graduate student, your TA, and consists of a smaller portion of your class, usu. 30 students. It really matters if you have a good or bad TA. Discussion section isn’t supposed to be a regurgitation of the lecture but something to augment the lecture, and it’s more acceptable to ask more questions in this section.</p>

<p>Professors and TA’s also have office hours. Take heed shy ones: go to office hours! Office hours are held in a little office which can usually accommodate up to 8 students. Rarely do 8 show up. Be one of those 8! But let me give you some advice: come prepared. In other words, your questions in office hours shouldn’t be about the lecture or discussion you missed, the reading you didn’t do, or the material which you haven’t pondered about. Office hours are for questions which remain after you’ve spent some considerable time contemplating. Anything short of that is self-centered and highly inconsiderate.</p>

<p>This goes somewhat for questions in class. Don’t ask questions in class if those questions would have been answered had you done the readings. Trust me, people will challenge your opinions and sometimes your behavior in a philosophy class. Everything you say is open to public scrutiny, so be smart and considerate. "</p>

20

<p>liek, how can you consider living at home?!</p>

<ul>
<li>what’s a difference of 10 - 15 k in the long run? that isn’t crap compared to what you should be making after college. </li>
</ul>

<p>i live 15 miles from UCLA, and i’m flying the F0CK out of my house as soon as possible.</p>