Berkeley VS USC... HELP!

College Search & Selection
81

<p>From The Princeton Review</p>

<p>University Of California - Berkeley</p>

<p>Academics:</p>

<p>"“Tough and competitive” University of California—Berkeley “is the epitome of cultural, political, and intellectual diversity,” both in its diverse student body (both in background and interests) and its substantial academic offerings. With “many departments ranked in the top five in their field,” UCB has the “stunning ability to accommodate nearly every interest and demand of students.” One student explains, “The freedom is incredible; there are a great array of majors and minors that all boast excellence in their departments. I feel like no matter what I choose to do at Cal, I will get the best of everything.” It won’t be handed to you, however; “UCB is a buffet. The opportunities are plentiful and the education is great, but you have to serve yourself.” The many standout departments (featuring “many professors who are Nobel laureates and award winners”) include the “top-tier science departments,” the “very strong business and engineering departments,” “the main humanities (history, English, political science),” mathematics, computer science, and music. No matter what you study here, there’s a good chance your professors will “have done great things in their fields.” “My organic chemistry professor helped name molecules at an international convention,” says one student. “My other organic chemistry professor just won an award for finding a drug to help with cancer research. These are real people with amazing lives and I get to learn the tricks of the trade from them.” Ambitious students can get in on the groundbreaking work, as the school “provides optimal research experience for students unlike any other university and constantly seeks students that can bring fresh ideas and new perspectives to the table.”</p>

<p>Student Body:</p>

<p>"“The only real common factor among most Berkeley students is that they are studious and/or hard workers,” as undergrads here “come from all different socioeconomic and cultural backgrounds….It is such a big school that you are always likely to be able to find someone else like you.” The mix includes “a lot of emo grad students, Asian premeds, a handful of jocks, and frat scenesters,” “nerds who never leave the library, environmental activists, ground-breaking scientists, party animals,” and “New Age hippies,” among many others. In short, “Everyone here is unique, from the run-of-the-mill preppy kids to the neo-hippie and goth crowd, to the guy wearing a kilt in your 8 A.M. Japanese class.” Asian students “make up a plurality of the student body, and there are loads of Asian cultural groups on campus. Other ethnic groups—such as African Americans and Hispanics—can be seen on campus” but are not as well represented. The Berkeley area “is quite liberal,” and many students here fit in well with the surrounding community."</p>

<p>Campus Life:</p>

<p>"For many, “Life is mostly centered around academic-related activities, if not classes and studying, then internships or jobs, or something of that sort.” More than a few, in fact, live in a near-perpetual state of academic immersion; they “get too sucked in to their work” and “don’t take full advantage of their surroundings,” but “if you can get your head out of the books for long enough, there’s always a movie to catch, or a good game of Frisbee going on, or a party in one of the co-ops or fraternities.” The city of Berkeley is “amazing.” “There are so many great restaurants and bookstores and interesting people and just so much stuff to experience and to explore.” Better still, San Francisco is “a 30-minute BART ride away,” and is “always exciting” with tons of “shopping, eating, concerts, theater, and all the culture of the big city.” Around campus, “Many students participate in sports or clubs for fun. Football games are probably the main reason students have school spirit, and they bring the students together for memorable experiences.” The university community provides “a lot of opportunities for everyone: clubs, sports, jobs, internships, sororities, fraternities, dance, art, journalism, etc. There are so many opportunities to meet people and have fun inside the Berkeley campus and out of it,” as well as an “endless numbers of events going on any given day. Art shows, benefits, plays, operas, live bands (local and touring), there are volunteer events and free classes. There is not enough time to do everything.”</p>

<p>University Of Southern California:</p>

<p>Academics:</p>

<p>"The University of Southern California boasts “a dynamic and culturally diverse campus located in a world-class city which is equally dynamic and culturally diverse.” Everything related to cinema is “top notch.” Among the other 150 or so majors here, programs in journalism, business, engineering, and architecture are particularly notable. The honors programs are “very good,” too. One of the best perks about USC is its “large and enthusiastic alumni network.” Becoming “part of the Trojan Family” is a great way to jumpstart your career because USC graduates love to hire other USC graduates. “Almost everyone talks about getting job offers based solely on going to USC.” “The school seems to run very smoothly, with few administrative issues ever being problematic enough to reach the awareness of the USC student community,” says an international relations major. The top brass “is a bit mysterious and heavy handed,” though. Also, “they milk every dime they can get from you.” Academically, some students call the general education courses “a complete waste of time.” There are a few “real narcissists” on the faculty as well as some professors “who seem to just be there because they want to do research.” Overall, though, students report that professors “make the subject matter come alive” and make themselves “very available” outside the classroom. “My academic experience at USC is fabulous,” gushes an aerospace engineering major. “I would not choose any other school.”</p>

<p>Student Body:</p>

<p>"The one thing that unites everyone here is “tons of Trojan pride.” USC students are also “intensely ambitious” and, while there are some “complete slackers,” many students hit the books “harder then they let on.” Otherwise, students insist that, “contrary to popular belief, USC has immense diversity.” “The stereotypical USC student is a surfer fraternity bro or a tan, trendy sorority girl from the O.C.” You’ll find plenty of those. Many students are also “extremely good looking.” Ethnic minorities and a high number of international students make up sizeable contingents of the undergraduate population as well. If you’re gay, you shouldn’t have any problems. “No one cares what your gender orientation is,” says a first-year student. “The only important question is whether or not you can be hooked up with.” There are “prissy L.A. types” and “spoiled” kids. In some circles, “family income and the brands of clothes you wear definitely matter.” However, “though there are quite a few who come from mega wealth, there are also many who are here on a great deal of financial aid.” There are “lots of nerds,” too, and a smattering of “band geeks and film freaks.” Most students don’t stray too far from the mainstream, though. “You have to go out of your way to find funky people,” advises a sophomore." </p>

<p>Campus Life:</p>

<p>"Students at USC complain quite a bit about their “smelly, ugly” housing. Recreation facilities aren’t much, either. “For such an athletic school, the student gym is embarrassing.” Also, students stress the fact that the area around USC is “impoverished” and “notoriously unsafe.” “People get mugged all the time.” On campus, though, life is “vibrant.” There are more than 600 student organizations. Theatrical and musical productions are “excellent.” School spirit is “extreme” and “infectious.” “Football games are huge.” “There is absolutely nothing that can top watching our unbelievable football team throttle the competition,” says a merciless sophomore. “Drinking is a big part of the social scene” as well. “We definitely have some of the sickest parties ever,” claims an impressed freshman. “Greek life is very big” and, on the weekends, a strong contingent of students “religiously” visits “The Row, the street lined with all the fraternity and sorority houses.” Students also have “the sprawling city of Los Angeles as their playground.” It’s an “eclectic place with both high and low culture and some of the best shopping in the world.” “Hollywood clubs and downtown bars” are popular destinations. Art exhibits, concerts, and “hip restaurants” are everywhere. However, “you need a car.” L.A. traffic may be “a buzz kill” but students report that it’s considerably preferable to the “absolutely terrible” public transportation system."</p>

82

<p>
[quote]
^ SATs almost similar, but for GPA, Cal has higher.
But you also take into account that if you're not in the top 10% in your graduating class in high school, you have very slim chance of getting into Cal. At USC, you maybe be admitted even if you're in the top half as long as your SAT scores are decent.</p>

<p>However, it's not easy to be in the top 10% in your whole high school life.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>UCB draws mostly CA students so top 10% of mostly CA schools which is considered the 2nd worst high school system in the US.
USC draws only 50% CA students and USC does take into account of the rigor of each high school while considering GPA. This is why USC also look at SAT scores.</p>

<p>
[quote]

4) Poor quality peers. This is subjective but most of the people you meet will be not smart and many times will slow down the class by asking dumb questions. They are the "cream" of the crop of the 2nd worst high school system in the US, where 1/3 of all students drop out, and it really shows many times.

[/quote]
</p>

<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/university-california-berkeley/145438-top-8-reasons-not-go-berkeley.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/university-california-berkeley/145438-top-8-reasons-not-go-berkeley.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

83

<p>There are certain things that do not reflect very well on statistics. For example, based purely on stats, it would suggest that it's just as hard to get into WUSL than into Stanford. But is that really true? How about Stanford vs Dartmouth? Is it really harder to get into Dartmouth than Stanford? Well, if you will base it on their stats, it would suggest that Dartmouth is harder to get into that is Stanford.</p>

84

<p>what the hell. cal has better academics than usc. end of story.</p>

<p>obviously usc has a better social scene and is less competitive.</p>

85

<p>Well, for 3 years I went to one of the the best Public schools in the US (in California). Most people who went to Berkeley or Cal from my HS were brilliant. </p>

<p>However, my senior year, I moved to another school and in a really bad area and classes there were a joke. The people who went to Berkeley from my new school were not that bright, and the funny thing was, no one from my new school got into USC, but a bunch got into Berkeley.</p>

<p>I don't know if my judgment is flawed, but it seems like the reason most people say Cal is so difficult is because they never took such rigorous courses at high school. Therefore, Cal seems overwhelming. And I've heard USC is way easier than Berkeley.</p>

86

<p>To be honest, I've always thought that USC is several leagues below Berkeley's. I cannot consider it an elite school yet despite its impressive recent developments. It's a very good university, but certainly not yet in the very elite group. It's in a league way below Berkeley's. I have the feeling that many OOS students attend there because it's in LA. In other words, it's location is more of its draw-in or come-on factor than its academics. On the other hand, elite students attend Berkeley because they think it's a powerhouse in academics. It's the same reasn why elite students choose MIT, Stanford, Harvard or Princeton. Berkeley also has a worldwide appeal, something that USC severely lacks at the moment, and I don't think it's growing or improving in that area like some other elite privates are.</p>

87

<p>USC has a reputation of being for being extremely arrogant. People don't like to hang around people from USC, but they never get this and continue to talk down to everyone. <------especially in los angeles. People outside of LA think that USC is the talk of the town, but in reality it is only spoken of because Trojans have such unwarrented pride.</p>

<p>I would advise to avoid it at all costs</p>

88

<p>From the Princeton Review summaries above:</p>

<p>Berkeley: "With “many departments ranked in the top five in their field,” UCB has the “stunning ability to accommodate nearly every interest and demand of students.” </p>

<p>USC: Everything related to cinema is “top notch.” </p>

<p>Many departments >>> cinema (which isn't even considered academic).</p>

89

<p>USC will be much easier academically... you're likely to graduate with a much higher gpa... which actually can be said for pretty much any elite public vs. elite private. I believe the current spread is .2 (a fifth of a grade) higher at privates.</p>

90

<p>I found a link that begins to unravel this grading disparity, that despite posting here regularly and reading lots of threads for over a year, has not really been a subject that I focused on before. But the implications are relevant as regards managing a gpa for future grad school (assuming adcoms do not dd .2 to public university alumni, or subtract .2 for private school alumni, as appropriate to normalize the achievements of their applicant pools.</p>

<p>recenttrendsindschools2.gif</a> (image)</p>

<p>All I can say is that Brown (and Stanford which is not on this chart) seem pretty friendly compared to a lot of places :), and I don't think I'd want to be at Princeton right now :(. Cornell, which seems to have had a well deserved grade deflation reputation (for an elite private) seems to have responded to the criticisms and jumped the most of any college between 1990 and present... it is hard to see because it merges with the Harvey Mudd line which both end quite high on the chart at 3.4</p>