<p>I'm going to side with slipper here.
I'm a graduate of a large public dominant in its state professionally, and have kids at or recently at smaller elites. The small elites win hands down.
I live in Chicago. I would rather be a Duke or Dartmouth graduate here than a Northwestern grad or Illinois grad. A Northwestern or Illinois grad is very unlikely to go out of her way for another NU or Illinois grad because every other person she knows professionally is a grad too. A quick smile and then a mental "so what". Just not a distinction.
For the fewer and more far between Dartmouth and Duke graduates, a fellow alum is more meaningful. And an alum is more apt to go out of her way for another swimming in waters far from home.
All IMO, of course.</p>
<p>danas, it depends. Some large schools will have weak alumni networks. However, some large universities, like Michigan, have alumni networks that are, on pound for pound basis, as effective, influential and cohesive as those of smaller private universities like Dartmouth. One does not have to sacrifice size to benefit from a very unified alumni network. I have lived and worked in London, Paris, Berlin and now Dubai. In each of those cities, the Michigan alumni club contained between 60 (Dubai) and 250 (Berlin, London and Paris) alums. We meet at least once monthly (more fortnightly), and there is generally a 50%-90% participation rate at those gatherings. We constantly send out group emails to help fellow Wolverines find jobs in new locations, and generally, within a matter of weeks, those alums find excellent jobs within our network.</p>
<p>I think you just agreed with my central point, Alexandre. Thanks for your examples!</p>
<p>I am not sure how I agreed with you Danas. I do not agree with you. I personally think that the most powerful and effective alumni networks belong to universities that have loyal, proud AND huge alumni netwokrs. A small alumni network, no matter how well-intentioned, will only have limited impact.</p>
<p>Private schools like Duke, Notre Dame, Dartmouth and the LAC'S-Holy Cross, Colgate, Williams also have strong sports traditions. ND football and Duke basketball unite their repective schools while Holy Cross and Colgate field Div1 teams in football, basketball, and hockey.</p>
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I am not sure how I agreed with you Danas.
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<p>You agreed with his point because the specific examples you gave about UMichigan was the alumni network in places like Paris, Berlin and Dubai, where any American would be a draw (nevermind one from your same school), as opposed to the relative helpfulness of UMichigan alumni networks in places like Detroit, Chicago, New York.</p>
<p>I would not include Chicago and NYC Gellino. I get job offers and invitations to major alum events in those two cities on a frequent basis. Surpisingly, I never heard much from Detroit alums.</p>
<p>What many people do not realize is that many of the schools in the Ivy League and Patriot League were the national sports powerhouses back in the first half of the twentieth century. The Yale football stadium was built in 1914 and seated 71,000 fans and was the biggest sports venue in the country at the time. Here is an interesting New York Times article on it. The</a> Yale Bowl: the Place Is Often the Draw - New York Times</p>
<p>^Even currently, 12 out of the all time 60 winningest programs are from the Ivy or Patriot League; not to mention Army and Navy, which at one point also played in the Patriot League.</p>
<p>Army and Navy are still in the Patriot League for all sports except for football where they are FBS (1A) whereas the Patriot League is FCS (1AA). Fordham and Georgetown take their spots for football only.</p>
<p>Alexandre. Michigan grads are leaving the state in droves, along with just about every other educated student. Talk about a brain drain.</p>
<p>The question is when and if population decline and economic calamity (I would not be surprised if General Motors, Ford and Chrysler all go bankrupt) will impact the University of Michigan's status as one of the premier universities in the world.
Off topic, for sure. I don't think such calamity would affect current alums much, or their network.</p>
<p>Simple dana, the answer is; you are correct. Such a calamity would not seriously impact the University. Of course, a university can never be completely removed from its environment. However, Michigan has not depended on the Big 3 (or the sate for that matter) in over two decade. There will be no major adverse impact on the university. Currently, the Big 3 contribute less than 5% of the University of Michigan's research funding from the private sector (they used to contribue 25% or so back in the 80s) and hire fewer than 5% of Michigan graduates. The Big 3 combined hired fewer than 15 (out of 350) Ross undergrads. Also, the state of Michigan contributes less than $350 million of the University's $5 billion operating budget. That's 7% of the total operating cost.</p>
<p>Thankfully, Michigan has recognized the trend early and has done a lot to reduce the impact of the state's deminished status. </p>
<p>In short, as one of the Nation's top 5 research universities (I am talking from a research output point of view), Michigan will not drop off the map simply because it is in an economically depressed state. There will always more federal and corporate donations and recruitment willing to flow through the university than the university can actually put to use.</p>
<p>who cares if yale was good like 100 years ago...they suck now and football does next to nothing to unite grads. on the other hand football at notre dame is really unlike anywhere else in the country. it's no duke basketball, but it's prolly the next best thing. alumni still attend games long after they graduate. GO IRISH!</p>
<p>MIT (lol), you're using the common criticism of Harvard and applying it to Yale-- not fair, because it's actually a good school.</p>
<p>
This couldn't be further from the truth. Sure, Wolverines are happy to see other Wolverines, but most would not go out of their way just to help other Michigan alumni out. UM has the largest amount of living alumni and that means that there are way too many alums for there to exist a powerful personal connection among these individuals. If you are a Wolverine applying for a job, chances are that there are many other Michigan grads applying for that job as well. So even if the guy hiring was a Michigan grad, he would give no special preference to any individual UMich applicant.</p>
<p>Duke and Dartmouth, on the other hand, are completely different. It's the old boys network. I know for a fact that grads of these school are extremely involved with their university's career offices EVEN AFTER GRADUATION. At the Duke and Dartmouth career fairs, ONLY DUKE AND DARTMOUTH grads from the participating companies come to recruit so they can help college seniors out with the job process because they love the school. Rarely will you see a Dartmouth or Duke grad who is not in a commanding position in the company that he/she works for. Most grads from schools like Michigan on the other hand are mid-level employees for the most part that don't have influence on company matters such as hiring decisions.</p>
<p>Generally, the networks at the top elites are small, intimate and powerful. This is much better than Alexandre's definition of a good network as being "loyal, proud and huge". Anyone who has spent any time in business knows its better to have 3 excellent contacts than 100 mediocre contacts.</p>
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Rarely will you see a Dartmouth or Duke grad who is not in a commanding position in the company that he/she works for.
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<p>It depends on the company and the location. The above quote is a very broad statement. My daughter interview with a grad from Dartmouth that works for a bunch of USC grads. In SoCal area, there are more USC people.</p>
<p>"At the Duke and Dartmouth career fairs, ONLY DUKE AND DARTMOUTH grads from the participating companies come to recruit so they can help college seniors out with the job process because they love the school. "</p>
<p>You're wrong. I've done recruiting for a major company (a Fortune Top 30) on college campuses.</p>
<p>Here's how it works: The dept selects target schools and asks for people to go recruit on those campuses. Typically, people who are grads ask to go back to "their" campus; but that's just because they're familiar with the surroundings, might enjoy a little bit of reminiscing, etc. However, sometimes those doing recruiting want to experience a change of pace and visit new schools too. For example, I was based in Chicago and recruited at my alma mater, NU; but because I could visit NU any time I liked, I also found it fun to expand my horizons and go recruit with my coworkers at "their" schools so I could see new and different college campuses. In any case, there was no guarantee that only Duke or Dartmouth students would do recruiting at Duke or Dartmouth (or any other college), and it doesn't reflect any superior sense of loyalty or bonding, it simply reflects that employees like company-sponsored trips back to their old stomping grounds (who wouldn't?).</p>
<p>"Rarely will you see a Dartmouth or Duke grad who is not in a commanding position in the company that he/she works for. Most grads from schools like Michigan on the other hand are mid-level employees for the most part that don't have influence on company matters such as hiring decisions."</p>
<p>Completely untrue. BTW, "even" Dartmouth and Duke grads have to start in entry level positions, just like everyone else (gasp). And there were tons of Michigan grads in very high positions at my company. Only people with a low level of sophistication don't give Michigan the credit it's due.</p>
<p>Does anyone know which UCs have strong alumni networks? I know UC Berkeley has a good one (or at least I think it does). But what about UCLA, UCSD, etc?</p>
<p>"At the Duke and Dartmouth career fairs, ONLY DUKE AND DARTMOUTH grads from the participating companies come to recruit so they can help college seniors out with the job process because they love the school. "</p>
<p>You're also wrong because if the Duke or Dartmouth grad isn't able to travel for some reason, they don't call off their recruiting visit - they just find someone else. You're making a huge deal out of the fact that as business trips go, going back to recruit on your old college campus (on your employer's tab) is a fun thing to do, and so people do it, as their schedules and responsibilities permit. There is nothing remarkable about Duke or Dartmouth in that regard compared to any other elite college.</p>