<p>So, some want it, some think it’s ridiculous.<br>
Some think the value to them, personally, makes it worth it. Some think the general public, same kids who can’t figure out a school address or deadline now, can’t digest their loan info-- will not benefit by it’s mere existence.
Deadlock.</p>
<p>Let US News fund it, pursue it and make their few dollars on it. There’s an irony in suggesting they can vet this best.</p>
<p>Btw, anyone hear about how med schools like English majors? Why would that be? Maybe something else they picked up in the 4 years. The ability to read, analyze, research and communicate.</p>
<p>What is all this “get a job in your field” stuff? Hardly any liberal arts majors have corresponding jobs for bachelor’s degree holders. Physics BAs and BSs do not get jobs as “physicists”, unless they are doing scutwork in a lab garnering favor for some future graduate school application. Very few French Literature majors write French literature. Some may teach it, but that’s not exactly the standard for success. The only liberal arts major I can think of that has an interesting “field” for undergraduates is Computer Science.</p>
<p>So what? Liberal arts majors have been going on to have careers for the last four or five centuries, at least.</p>
<p>If BSE graduates at some college can’t get jobs as engineers (and aren’t being hired by hedge funds and private equity firms instead), I might worry. But it doesn’t even occur to me to ask whether sociology BAs are working in their field. Of course they aren’t. And it doesn’t mean anything other than they are normal liberal arts grads.</p>
<p>Anyway – that Berkeley data is really insufficient for sociology majors. There were three who said what they were doing.</p>
<p>I think if done right, it’s a great idea. Now more than ever, students are getting screwed over - paying more and getting less. More transparency is a good thing that schools should be doing on their own anyways - and many do collect this information but don’t report it because it’s so bad. </p>
<p>“Seriously, ALL of this information is available on the internet already. If someone going off to college can’t find it, maybe college isn’t the best idea for them.”</p>
<p>Nope, stop lying. Not all colleges post their employment/earnings information for their graduates per major. And this would be incredibly useful information to find out. My own career center couldn’t even help me find this information when I was an undergrad. </p>
<p>“Then, if a student majors in say “accounting”, doesn’t work very hard, doesn’t bother to take the CPA exam, decides working at Starbucks is a better idea then being an accountant–how is that any reflection on the college that student attended?”</p>
<p>You’ll likely have some of these at every school. No one said this information will be perfect (after all, all self reported data tends to lean towards the positive). But it will be better than students thinking “accounting” is a great major at their school only for only 15% of graduates to get jobs that pay over $30K.</p>
<p>Yes and no. It all depends on how central the department is to the mission of the university as a whole, the reputation of the department itself, etc. </p>
<p>You can search the web to see how universities close departments when money gets tight. Foreign languages are often the first to go.</p>
<p>You’d be surprised at the number of graduates for certain majors; physics, for example, has a hard time attracting students at the undergraduate level. Yet there is less pressure on a physics department than, say, a French department, to increase enrollment, given that often physics is seen as more ‘central’ to the mission overall.</p>
<p>The number of EE majors at Stanford? Around 50. For chemistry–around 12. For Human Biology, 186. Do you think that Stanford EE professors need to ‘market’ their degree more to attract more ‘customers’ to justify their existence? Or should we simply stop having chem departments because their aren’t enough ‘customers’?</p>
<p>However, physics departments could still remain even without bachelor’s degree programs since other popular majors (e.g. biology) have physics course requirements.</p>
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<p>Even if no one at Stanford majors in chemistry, the chemistry department must remain to service all of those biology majors.</p>
<p>Departments like less common foreign languages may feel more pressure since their courses are less likely to be needed by students in other majors.</p>
<p>^^^Sure, not that there is no pressure, just less. Even in my own institution, foreign languages have been cut before physics. But my physics colleagues still worry.</p>
<p>They really aren’t getting less. Nice new dorms and athletic centers. D1 football teams. WiFi internet access, smart classrooms, etc. Study abroad programs, internship programs, undergraduate research programs, etc. Writing centers and math centers. DSS for those student who need it. Honors colleges and special programs. etc. More academic advisors. First year programs to help with the transition to college. Pre-orientation programs at some places for those who want them, etc., etc., etc.</p>
<p>Perhaps you should consider the possibility that many, if not most, people with degrees in sociology DO NOT INTEND to become “sociologists.” I know precisely one person who majored in that subject. She took a job in sales where familiarity with statistics and the ways in which data about people is collected and used was helpful. She was making over $125K per year by age 25 in the early/mid 90s.</p>
<p>The psych majors I knew well included precisely one person who became a clinical psychologist. The others went on to very successful careers in advertising, law, etc.</p>
<p>The anthro major went into a training program at a major bank and became a banker.</p>
<p>This is a constant problem with evaluations of degrees in non-vocational areas. People just don’t get it. These people were not “settling” for other jobs: they enjoyed studying the subject, but had no intention of becoming scholars or researchers.</p>
<p>Cross posted with various people. BTW, our local campus of the state university–the second biggest in the state–eliminated its physics major a few years ago, if I am not mistaken. As well as some others. Not many physics majors at directional state U.</p>
<p>Even if the department remains, it is probably a lot less interesting for a physics professor to teach “physics for biology majors and pre-meds” than to teach physics majors and recruit them into research projects.</p>
<p>I think tons of college kids take a class in a subject like sociology, like the class, get a good grade, and figure that maybe they should major in it because they liked the class and are good at it. They will worry about their job prospects manana… they just figure if they good grades, somehow they will get a job in it. That is not, by the way, specific to this generation of college students – it has been going on for at least the last 40 years, probably longer. And some people won’t look at the data, because some people never look at data or don’t care to use actual data to make decisions. But some people will, and right now the colleges obfuscate unless they have something to brag about.</p>
<p>I think sociology would be a bad choice for a major if you didn’t like looking at “data.” :D</p>
<p>I don’t care if they publish this stuff or they don’t. But, it’s never a bad excercise for an organization to look at where they are succeeding and where they need work. I don’t think the “income” part is relevent, but the graduation rate per major might be instructive for the universities.</p>
<p>if they find one spot where they are not graduating many? They would know they needed to do some work there. YMMV</p>
<p>I guess I’m just wondering here, how many have used 4 and 6 year graduation rates to make a decision about where to have their children attend? How many used this information to make a decision? This information has been around for a bit, is on a government website. And I would think it important…</p>
<p>I used it to determine where my kid, who wanted big state U, could apply, since I think anywhere they apply, they have to be allowed to attend if accepted. So, yes, I did have a cut off range of grad rates.</p>
<p>Now, it would have been instructive to see the CS grad rates.</p>
<p>So, does a college student that graduates from Kansas State and gets a job in rural Kansas making 40K/year make more or less than the another student graduating from a NY State College getting a job in NYC making $45,000/year? I remember some kids from my graduating class in college getting all excited about their “high paying” jobs in major cities only to find they couldn’t make ends meet because of the high cost of living. Does that make K State a worse school then NY State School?</p>
<p>I think the data may be useful to some people. I really don’t think ALL kids understand what the job prospects are for the major they have chosen. How many of us have talked to for example the local pizza delivery guy/girl(no offense meant to those currently working as a pizza delivery person) in their late 20’s that graduated with a degree and couldn’t find a job in their chosen field? It’s not all that uncommon! Kids go to college to learn about what they are interested in. That’s ok , but they need to consider the future. </p>
<p>I’d like to see it required that they have the data on their job prospects with their major in the student loan contract.:)</p>
<p>But the point is, for many, many students their major does not necessarily relate directly to what they are interested in. The SKILLS they learn, communication, interpersonal, research, writing and some basic information about an industry they might want to pursue through an internship will get them in the door. Most industries are organized around functional areas and they are broad - finance, operations, communications, and then manufacturing or clinical (healthcare), research etc. I told my kids to target an industry and keep that in mind as they selected classes. </p>
<p>And no, I didn’t pay attention to graduation rates. My oldest graduated at a college with a horrible graduation rate on time. It was absolutely a great place for him. And frankly no one will ever convince me that the kids will end up much differently financially or doing what they are doing had they chosen a different college or university. </p>
<p>NACE collects this very data you are discussing, but there is a fee to access it. By major, by college, by industry from 2,000 of our colleges in conjunction with industry recruiters. If an organization can do it so can USNWR or someone else. I don’t think the “government” “needs” to do this.</p>
<p>Here is a high level executive summary that is “free”. The data is collected from the employers and other data repositories regarding new college graduates (BA, BS, Master’s etc.), not the students.</p>