<p>How difficult is it to be a pre-med Bio major in CALS? How rigorous is the curriculum? What clases need to be taken? Are the profs good? Is it hard to do well? I have heard getting the mean is an achievement, but isn't it bad in terms of being competitive for med school?</p>
<p>Bio's about as easy as it gets as far as science majors go. If you hit the means in every class you'll end up with around a 3.3 GPA because most classes are curved to a B+. So, get above the mean in a few of the bio courses and get A's in all of the non-science courses and you should be good to go.</p>
<p>I assume it is very difficult to even get the mean, but even with that, is it enough to still get into a decent med school. I don't mean to be senile, but I think that a strong applicant needs to get well above the mean in most of his classes, considering that I want to get into an MD/PhD program, where grades are like the #1 category for evaluation.</p>
<p>I have a connection to the admissions committee at a medical school I really want to attend...and she said they don't look down upon a B+ (3.3) from Cornell.</p>
<p>I've also heard from a few sources that some medical schools are starting to place importance on your performance in biochem. According to this source (who has spoken with many deans of admission at med schools), they would rather see you do very well in biochem than get an A in orgo.</p>
<p>Also...for MD/PhD...it will be very important for you to show achievement in research (ex. a publication).</p>
<p>Is that supposed to mean that we should take biochem before we apply and not wait until senior yr to take it.</p>
<p>Yes...most people around here take biochem their junior year. You also have 2 options..you can take autotutorial biochem which covers 2 semesters of biochem in 1. Or, you can take the 331+332 sequence. I found that most people take 332 in the spring of sophomore year and 331 in the fall of junior year since 331 is not a pre-req for for 332 and vice versa. </p>
<p>However...there are some who postpone 332 until senior year (like myself) b/c they plan to take a year off before applying.</p>
<p>I don't think it's very hard to get the mean in most bio courses.</p>
<p>What advice to do you guys have for someone who is thinking about transferring because I was already accepted as a GT for this fall? Can you describe the CALS curriculum in greater depth? How many bio labs does one need to graduate? Is animal physiology track difficult, compared to biochem or gen bio track?</p>
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I don't think it's very hard to get the mean in most bio courses.
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<p>exactly....if I can make the mean...anyone can do it...lol</p>
<p>As for CALS bio curriculum...I can't help you much there since I wasn't a Bio major.</p>
<p>CALS bio is exactly the same as CAS bio which is why biological sciences has its own section in the coursebook and is not listed under CALS or CAS.</p>
<p>These are the requirements for the bio major:</p>
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1. Introductory biology for majors (one year): BIO G 101 and 103 plus 102 and 104, or 105–106. BIO G 107–108, offered during the eight-week Cornell summer session for 8 credits, also satisfies the introductory biology requirement for majors.
2. General chemistry: CHEM 207–208 or 215. Students who, via advanced placement, take only CHEM 208 or only 215 should be aware that some professional and graduate schools require 8 credits of general chemistry. These students may wish to take both CHEM 215 and 208 or 215 and 216. Students may wish to consult with their faculty advisor or advisors in the Office of Undergraduate Biology for further clarification.
3. College mathematics (one year): one semester of calculus (MATH 106, 111, 191, or their equivalent) plus one semester selected from the following:
a. a second semester of calculus (MATH 112, 192, or their equivalents).
b. a course in finite mathematics (MATH 105).
c. a course in statistics (BTRY 301, MATH 171, AEM 210, ILR 212, PSYCH 350, PAM 210, ECON 319, ECON 321, SOC 301).
4. Organic chemistry: CHEM 257 and 251, or 357–358 and 251, or 357–358 and 301, or 359–360 and 251, or 359–360 and 301.
5. Physics: PHYS 101–102, 207–208,* or 112–213.* Those who take PHYS 112–213 are advised to complete PHYS 214 as well.
6. Genetics: BIOGD 281.
7. Biochemistry: BIOBM 330, or 331 and 332, or 333.
8. Evolutionary biology: BIOEE 278 or BIOPL 448. Note: BIOPL 241 Botany is a prerequisite course to BIOPL 448.
9. A program of study selected from the outline below.
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<p>The only place where different bio majors differ is in #9, the specific requirements for the different concentrations whether it be biochem, molecular bio, animal physiology, neurobio, etc. Usually each concentration only involves 4-6 extra courses so it's not a big deal. I would just take whatever concentration you're interested in. The only one I might find slightly challenging would be the biochem track because you have to take p-chem. That's why I ended up a molecular bio concentration, almost exactly the same requirements, minus p-chem. And don't take the general bio track. It makes no sense to COCENTRATE in GENERAL bio. That has to be a paradox.</p>
<p>Gotcha. Now what was your avg schedule like though. Did you take biochem and like genetics simultanously? Sorry to be a pest but I find you to be one of the wisest on the board norcal in both Cornell matters and pre-med, so your advice actually means a lot to me. I was thinking of doin molecular bio also, what other classes did you personally take? Thanks.</p>
<p>I took 3 sciences/semester each of my first 4 semesters to get my prereq's out of the way so that I could take the MCAT at the end of my sophomore year. The last two years were just cake. 2 bio courses/semester and 2 humanities courses/semester. Fairly stress-free, especially the last two years.</p>
<p>For molec. bio, I took BioBM440 Biochem lab (very useful course for future researchers), BioBM432 Survey of Cell bio, BioAP 316 Cellular Physiology (easy A; I got an A+ despite skipping most of the classes), BioAP 413 Histology (first year med course), and BioBM632 Proteins (graduate biophysics course; another easy A since most graduate courses are pretty easy). That's it. That's all I took in addition to the general bio requirements (biochem, evol. bio, genetics, gen bio). There's a lot of flexibility so that you don't have to take those same courses if you want to do molec. bio but I personally liked most of the courses I took. I didn't like BioBM 432 so much because it was so early in the morning but that's the one course you must take if you want to do cell/molecular bio since it's the core cell bio course.</p>
<p>After two years here, I still just don't understand why all these hundreds of pre-meds at Cornell don't just go to a SUNY school, get great grades, get into good med schools and have a better time while they're at it.</p>
<p>I second lianri's opinion... being premed here sucks hardcore. Classes are curved very low initially, and premed kids are very competitive. Honestly, you would be better off just taking the required premed courses and majoring in something easy like AEM, history, or econ to bring your GPA up. But, something like 86% of kids with a 3.4 who apply to med school get in.</p>
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After two years here, I still just don't understand why all these hundreds of pre-meds at Cornell don't just go to a SUNY school, get great grades, get into good med schools and have a better time while they're at it.
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<p>umm...because you can come to Cornell, get a world-class education, get good grades, get into good med schools, and have a great time while you're at it?</p>
<p>You can make this argument about any top college. Why in the world do people still go to schools like Harvard or Cornell when they can go to their state schools and coast through 4 years? And yet top med schools are still chocked full of Ivy grads.</p>
<p>The OP is interested in Columbia Med. Despite being a NY school, do you know how many SUNY premeds matriculated at Columbia last year? TWO. DOS. 2. All of the SUNY's combined. # of Cornellians listed in their handbook as the Class of 2011? 9. I'll take my chances with Cornell.</p>
<p>Honestly, you would be better off just taking the required premed courses and majoring in something easy like AEM, history, or econ to bring your GPA up.</p>
<p>I thought the introductory classes (the required premed courses) were the difficult, weed-out classes. So wouldn't it not really make a difference if you choose to major in something other than biology?</p>
<p>What Norcalguy said. The resources per student at Cornell are quite simply, better. I'm not suggesting that you can't get a very good education at a place like UB, Geneseo, or Binghamton, but you will have more resources at Cornell.</p>
<p>That said, I do wish all of the pre-med types would stop being so blindingly pre-med. I took BIONB422 and had to write a paper with a student who was pre-med. I never saw a person stress out over a paper so much before. Perhaps he was a bit nervous because I was an ILRie and we don't have the best reputation around biology circles, but we did a fantastic job on the paper and both earned an A in the course.</p>
<p>Besides, do any of the SUNY schools even have a Division I hockey program?</p>
<p>I think not.</p>
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I thought the introductory classes (the required premed courses) were the difficult, weed-out classes. So wouldn't it not really make a difference if you choose to major in something other than biology?
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<p>The poster forgot that people tend to do better in subjects they're actually interested in. I love humanities courses and took many of them as a premed but I can't imagine myself majoring in anything but bio.</p>
<p>And you are correct that your science GPA is just as important as your overall GPA (maybe even slightly more so). Majoring in AEM or history won't improve your science GPA.</p>
<p>Norcal, do you have the stats websites for MD/PhD programs overall? That comment that you made about Columbia really brought chills down my spin. To think out of close to 10k SUNY students, only 2 got into Columbia. That is really sad. However, was that just Columbia med and not the MD/PhD program, but I assume that stat incorporates MD/PhD also. And I assume you understand why I want a big name school (for the PhD aspect of the degree). However, I have to ask, if classes are so difficult, how do you make time for ECs? After reading Cornell's stats for med school acceptance (don't get me wrong here), I get the impression that it is extremely difficult to get into a good med school if your not in like the top 2%. Now how do you manage to stand out from the pack? I mean isn't everyone enarly the same w/ high GPA and nearly similar courseload? Did you take any summer classes?</p>
<p>I didn't say only 2 got into Columbia. I said only 2 matriculated. It is very possible more got into Columbia but chose not to go. Of course, you can make the same argument for Cornell as well since 9 is the number that MATRICULATED. </p>
<p>There was also a breakdown of the MD/PhD students at Columbia but since the total number per graduating class is so small, I don't think any statistical inferences can be drawn. But, for the Class of 2011, there were no SUNY undergrads and around 2 Cornellians out of the MSTP students. Not surprisingly, most of the MSTP students (along with most of Columbia's other students) came from Top 20 colleges. In fact, 70% of Columbia's matriculating student body last year attended a US News Top 20 college.</p>
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However, I have to ask, if classes are so difficult, how do you make time for ECs?
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<p>It's not that difficult. My senior year, I worked 3 part-time jobs and tutored disadvantaged Ithaca HS kids and still earned a 4.2+ my first semester and a 3.98 my second semester. Your first couple of semesters at Cornell will be the toughest academically but once you adjust, it's cake.</p>
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After reading Cornell's stats for med school acceptance (don't get me wrong here), I get the impression that it is extremely difficult to get into a good med school if your not in like the top 2%.
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<p>I don't know how you came up with that conclusion. Columbia may be an extreme example since it is a NY school but let's assume that there are 4 Cornellians matriculating at every Top 20 med school each year. That's 80 students. Cornell produces 450 applicants a year so you have to be in the top 1/6 at Cornell to get into a top 20 school. Since acceptance rates to top 20 schools are in the 4% range and median GPA/MCAT is at 3.8/37, I don't think being in the top 1/6th of your class is too much to ask. Straight out of the HCEC handbook: 80% of Cornellians applying with 3.8+ GPA's get into at least one Top 20 medical school. This doesn't even control for MCAT scores. </p>
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Now how do you manage to stand out from the pack? I mean isn't everyone enarly the same w/ high GPA and nearly similar courseload? Did you take any summer classes?
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<p>Outside of my MCAT/GPA, I don't really stand out from the pack. That could be why I interviewed at a lot of top schools but didn't get many acceptances to them (in other words, I'm in the top 15% that they interview but not the top 4% that they accept). Still, I will be going to a top 20 med school next year anyway. I'm by no means the cream of the crop as far as Cornell applicants go. </p>
<p>No, I never took summer classes. I never had to take summer classes. I used my summers for internships, studying for the MCAT, working, volunteering, more useful things.</p>