Boarding School & College Matriculation

I concur with @ChoatieMom and reinforce that no college will have an issue that a BS offers few/no APs.

I will also say that I have been very vocal on this site and others that the College Board has done a disservice to the students with some of the recent AP additions/changes. e.g. AP Physics 1, which does not prepare students for the SAT Subject Test; AP Research/Seminar, which is a blatant rip-off of the IB TOK/EE, and rarely gets AP credit.

Everyone is probably tired of my long posts, but I donā€™t get on here much now and the words just have stored up when I finally do. I posted the following elsewhere but it DEFINITELY applies here too. BTW, I canā€™t speak for St. Markā€™s first hand, but do know a few alum who are terrific people:

Our family has a long history of boarding school attendees on both sides, attending many institutions that are not just great but that also are heartily approved of by snobs and strivers. My kids are not clones of course, and as it turns out, ended up at different schools. They had stellar educations and experiences that will last a lifetime. My youngest will leave Kent and head off to a school that meets muster in the snoot rankings on here, as will many in his graduating class. I have no doubt, more importantly, that the students who have landed in the lower portions of the ā€œclass rankā€ (happens at EVERY school b/c thatā€™s just how percentiles work) will be off to wonderful institutions that they are excited to go to and pursue their variety of interests.

Kent students can challenge themselves and take risks and courses that are as hard as anywhere and be with a group of peers at any level. Refreshingly, they are not expected to enter as fully formed people. For example, my son had no idea that he had a strong aptitude in one area at the ripe old age age of 13 - but by 18, he is just crazy for it and brilliant at it. He had no idea he could sing well either when he was in 8th grade and sounding like Bobby Brady in the ā€œTime to Changeā€ episodeā€¦ be heā€™s got wonderful pitch and sound and is able to get on a stage and belt his heart out now. He discovered these things about himself in a high school that allowed him to do so. Isnā€™t that what secondary education is supposed to be for as opposed to just another hoop to somewhere?! At Kent, if you are topping out in a course, there is always a higher level, harder version of that course waiting for you. The teachers and staff will make sure of it. The same goes for a student meeting too much of a challenge and needing to back off a bit. Your peers will be right behind you and beside you as well, offering support along the way rather than trying to trample you in a selfish rush to edge you out.

After all the posts I have read about ā€œcachetā€ and ā€œprestigeā€ validation and on and on we goā€¦ I suggest a simple solution: Just get hold of a ranking list that you believe in and apply straight down the line until you hit a ranking number where the clout factor is not there anymore for you. Mission accomplished if you get accepted to one of them. As for others who are looking at boarding school as something more than just a way to impress and an Ivyā€™esque end, please proceed as usual, ask away, tour, do your due diligence and In wish you best of luck!

@GreenIndian @Publisher: I truly empathize with your plight. Looking back 4 years ago, I was much in the same boat as you. If I was planning to spend a quarter of a million dollars on my kid, then I want to know what Iā€™m buying. Our family was in the enviable position of several top-notch schools to send our son. I thought that rankings mattered.

But take it from me, listen to @ChoatieMom and @skieurope. The rankings donā€™t matter much at all. The schools at the top of the rankings are VERY VERY good at selecting a class that will do good in college admissions. They have their pick of olympians, math whizzes, virtuosos, and well-heeled development kids. Because of these pre-existing connections, many of the students from these schools do quite well in college admissions. These kids would have done well regardless of where they went to high school.

So because of this, the college matriculation lists are largely meaningless. They donā€™t tell you that a huge % of the kids who matriculate at the top schools have a massive hook. What you really want is to know is the % of un-hooked kids who matriculate at top colleges. This information is a closely guarded secret and the college counseling offices donā€™t like to talk about it.

Donā€™t fuss with the rankings. Instead focus on finding a school that is a good fit for your child. Everything else will fall into place. However obsessing over sending your kid to the best ranked school, even though its a poor fit, will surely result in disaster. Even kids at the top of their class at a lower ranked BS do quite well in college admissions.

Boarding school does have other advantages, which are not to be underestimated: smaller class size, more personalized attention, living independently, etc. But donā€™t choose a school purely based on college matriculation alone.

@sgopal: Thank you for your thoughts.

Boarding school is long behind us so I understand the proper weight to be given to rankings of various types.

I trust others to use information responsibly & in their best interests. I respect, but often disagree with, the opinions of other posters based on our somewhat substantial experience.

You wrote: ā€œBut donā€™t choose a school based on college matriculation alone.ā€ No where have I suggested that. Please read more carefully as I find that insinuation to be a bit insultingā€“although you did not intend it to be so.

@sgopal2: Thank you so much for chiming in.

Consumers are entitled to information. College matriculation information is very important to many, probably most, consumers of boarding school educations.

To suggest that I or other parents are blind to other considerations is a bit foolish. I trust parents who are in a position to entrust their children to others & those who are in a position to invest substantial sums of money for a high school education to make decisions based on the information which they, not you or other anonymous internet posters, deem relevant.

One of the lines I heard more than once from boarding school AOs and at revisit days was something like: ā€œIf the primary reason you are considering our school is an ivy admission please stop considering usā€. So far DD, who attended the local public school, has had better college admissions results that DS1 who attended one of the acronym boarding schools. (Granted there are two weeks to go so that could change).

Agree. But if a primary reason is for an education that will prepare you for elite schoolsā€™ rigor, and you are targeting elite colleges & universities, then you are in the right place.

Wow, thereā€™s a lot of vitriol out there. First, people are entitled to collect data in the way which they see fit. Some may be sending their kids to BS to escape a poor public school. Others may have five generations of family who went to BS. Perspectives may be different. When I read a post that screams at me, I draw back. Yes, you may have had 20 children who attended BS and you may have met your spouse there as well. That does not give you the right to screech at folks and tell them what criteria should be important to them.
Someone mentioned spending 250K, thatā€™s a real consideration.Not all the research is perfect but we end up with more information than we had. Did I look at matriculation lists, you betcha. Some matched our PS, so thatā€™s a no for me. Some were really strong. Is matriculation the only consideration of course not. NO ONE stated that.
People who have been on this board for years, I think we all appreciate your perspective and clarity on issues. That does not mean that you can speak in such a mean tone to others who may be applying/helping their children apply for the first time.
I donā€™t think there is anyone on this board who does not recognize the benefits of BS ( small classes, in depth learning, access to better ECs, individualized attention etc.) That does not mean that your opinion and rants should dominate the discussion. If you donā€™t like a discussion please move on or comment in a civil manner. Thank you from a first time BS parent.

@Happytimes2001: God bless you !!!

Most of us or, at least many, have at least one graduate degree & are accustomed to gathering & refining information.

Agree, that there is no reason to make assumptions about othersā€™ capabilities in handling various forms of data & information.

Knock yourself out. :wink:

Hmm. Weā€™re thinking of investing in boarding school as a great preparation for LIFE, not just success in college classes :wink:

Well, I have two graduate degrees with one being in a quantitative field, so I guess I can look at numbers and make some inferences?

I think the matriculation data is useful, but is subject to huge caveats, as many have mentioned.

I also find the average SAT and ACT scores, as well as any available admissions scoring data, very useful. Especially in conjunction with any disclosure of grade distributions in the college profiles the schools create. Itā€™s fine to talk about the rigor of boarding school courses, but this is going to be highly dependent on the level of intelligence of the typical students at a school.

I hear people about boarding school being great preparation for college and for life. OK. Maybe. But only a vanishingly small percentage of people ever go to boarding school and an enormously larger percentage do just fine in college and in life. For instance, two of my best and most accomplished friends (one salutatorian at Harvard, and the other summa at Yale, graduating with a simultaneous bachelorā€™s and masters at age 20) had never heard of boarding school growing up - LPS was good enough for them!

I definitely agree itā€™s mostly about the individual, not the school.

What are you all so afraid of ???

Who is screeching and screaming? Did something get cleaned up because I see no evidence of such?!

If someone wants to produce some kind of matriculation ranking here, fine, but whereā€™s the criteria and methodology? Surely all those degrees have made clear that transparency of methodology is important otherwise how can one decide if it is worth considering much less discussing without more information?

The gangā€™s all here ! :slight_smile:

Iā€™m trying to understand what all this hoopla is about. I donā€™t have a graduate degreeā€¦ perhaps thatā€™s why Iā€™m baffledā€¦ :wink:
But, I am curiousā€¦ for those of you who have given serious consideration to these matriculation lists, what did you deduce from them? How did they inform your familyā€™s decision when it came time for your kid to choose the best school for him/her/them? (note: yes, I said your kidā€™s choice, not yoursā€¦ thatā€™s a whole 'nother thread, no doubt)!

If you donā€™t want the info., then just ignore it. No need to try to censor or impose your priorities on others.

@cameo43 That was a discussion somewhere in the Feb-Apr time period of 2016, I think. I remember something about it but canā€™t seem to find the thread.

WHAT info? Thatā€™s the point. You list some schools and you put a random number next to them with no basis provided on what you looked at, how and what was weighed, etc. How is that information let alone helpful and meaningful information? A lot is missing before one can determine value and apply any usefulness to it.

Still waiting for substance.

All I know is my kidsā€™ school ā€œwinsā€ with some random number of 287. I guess I should be happy but given ZERO context it might as well be SPS is chocolate mint, purple, or a rhombus.