Boarding Schools in Long-term Decline?

Prep School Admissions
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<p>(From the WSJ article excerpted above; I don't know how to make gray boxes.)</p>

<p>Adds Alice Jackson, a California consultant who advises families on boarding-school issues: "I think parents have become more dependent on their children."</p>

<p>What an appalling statement. Parents who prefer to have their chldren at home are "dependent?" </p>

<p>I think Brighty has it right. There are many more options now for students who are not being well-served by their local public schools. And the costs, not only of BS themselves, but of colleges, are skyrocketing. I have a good friend whose daughter is looking at colleges now, and it is going to cost up to $50k/year. His older daughter graduated from a top LAC two years ago, and they were paying $32k by her last year.</p>

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<p>"In fact, too much inbreeding in the prep school population leads to a lessening of the competitive aspect of boarding schools."</p>

<p>Hahahahhaha!!</p>

<p>SO.. why does increasing the # of new 11th graders help a school? Do you mean as recruited athletes/PG's?</p>

<p>And another interesting thing is.. not everyone has access to a great private day school or magnet. They're really not that common, no matter what the trends show about the need for these schools. Most people don't live in NYC or by a major metropolis (or even in CT where there a plentyyy of private schools), yet there are high achieving students everywhere.. this would tell me that the BS market is increasing and rather robust???.. why just the opposite?</p>

<p>I agree w/ the "sending your kids offi s bad" phenomenon. In my mother's family, my grandmother threatened my mother and her brothers/sisters w/ boarding school.. that's why my mother never considered it for me until her friends sent a few off and she saw how the kids loved it... but it still wasn't a priority for us. In my father's family, BS was also a threat.. one that was executed on the 2 eldest boys (and my grandfather himself). My grandfather and my father and uncle were "sent off," so they have a different view of BS than I.. and don't exactly understand why I WANT to go. That generation (that grew up w. the threat) has a hard time understanding why you would send a good kid away.. which sucks, because it could really benefit much of my whiny, overprotected generation.</p>

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<p>I went to tour a few boarding schools. The Asian students gets aid from the boarding schools , too. I do not know whether the aid will depend on international status or not. Some boarding school's education are not better than public schools or private day schools. So why bother to pay for tution for boarding schools ?</p>

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<p>"Some boarding school's education are not better than public schools or private day schools. So why bother to pay for tution for boarding schools ?"</p>

<p>isnt that exactly why nowadays people crowd for the top tiers school , which cause the huge surge in the number of application on the high end and a plummet on the low end????? i actually think it's a good process, it makes the best of the best even better and kill off the weaklings which couldnt compete in first place anyway, and thus acheive the best allocation of resource in the society. It happens to many industries in the economics world anyway</p>

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<p>Wow -- that's very revealing bearcats.</p>

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<p>it's a natural process.
The strong ones stay in the business and the weak ones have to adapt and improve or they simply have to go out of business. As my econ teacher always said, non-productive business is a crime; competition forces business (in this case, schools) to be productive.</p>

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<p>bearcats -- You'll do well in business school!</p>

<p>yan -- What the article went on to say is that the boarding schools united via TABS (The Association of Boarding Schools) to commission a study "The Truth About Boarding Schools." This study and subsequent presentation builds a case to demonstrate overall boarding school value add versus day schools and public schools. Here is a link to it: <a href="http://www.schools.com/theTruth/truth2.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.schools.com/theTruth/truth2.html&lt;/a> You will find this presentation on all the TABS members' websites.</p>

<p>In the WSJ article they said that the market has been flat in recent years, but estimated to be down from a high in the 1960s. Just because a decline is predicted does not mean that it is inevitable. Markets in transition change for the better or worse all the time. And I don't think that anyone believes that boarding schools are going the way of the buggy whip.</p>

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<p>edconsultant,</p>

<p>Yes, my daughter is a hockey goalie. </p>

<p>Boys hockey probably has been a savior for some schools, as there seems to be no end of parents with NHL dreams for their boys, and boarding schools are often seen as a way of diversifying options for their sons by making them (perceived by the parents) better candidates for college hockey so when they finish HS, they can choose college or junior major hockey.</p>

<p>And with the cost of junior minor or AAA travel hockey, boarding school tuition starts looking more reasonable, considering the perceived upgrade in eductional opportunities.</p>

<p>And I don't think hockey is alone in that respect. There seems to be quite a few basketball players who use the prep school route (especially the PG year) to help with those college placements.</p>

<p>Where I see the boarding schools failing in their marketing is in a benefit that is one of the major cost drivers - personal attention.</p>

<p>Let's face it, public magnet schools often cut the teacher to pupil ratio down from the 30:1 (or worse) that is found in most public schools (at least where I live), but not nearly to the 11:1 to 13:1 common at most boarding schools. Even most day private schools don't even get that low. </p>

<p>And on top of that, with the schools that have a large percentage of faculty living on campus, you have the extra face time that occurs off-hours.</p>

<p>And education, like all personal services, can vary widely in quality based upon the people delivering the service. If the people delivering the service have too many clients, it doesn't matter how good they are, the quality will suffer.</p>

<p>If the people time wasn't important, all us parents would have to do is plug our kids into the internet and voila! - perfect adults by age 18. Then we send them off to the University of Phoenix for the college, and we can helicopter around the house.</p>

<p>I think boarding schools that strayed from the message that this is all about the service have been the ones who have suffered. Yeah, there are always parents that don't understand what their children need - heck there are teachers who don't. Some schools market to these less than saavy parents (or let the industry market) with the prestige and matricualtion benefits, et al. You can only live off your r-e-p-u-t-a-t-i-o-n (that word gets censored a lot on boards for some strange reason) so long before the school becomes so enamored with itself that it forgets what it is really there to do.</p>

<p>As to the comments that many boarding schools don't offer more than the local high school... Yes, that is probably true in the case of my daughter's school as compared to her local public school (the best one in the county we live in). I don't shop for a school based upon the course catalog. My daughter doesn't need a school that offer 5 foreign languages, 20 AP courses, etc. Heck 90% of the kids at those schools with those offerings probably don't have enough hours in the day to take advantage of most of those classes.</p>

<p>My daughter needs a school where her talents are maximized - where she isn't marginalized because she isn't the most pushy/aggressive kid with the most low flying helicopter parents. I know at our public school she was kept out of some elite classes because she didn't make a fuss and wasn't a full-of-herself primadonna, even though she had solid A's in her classes. </p>

<p>I know at her current school, she was challenged up front to take the honors classes. Her teachers understand that she has to work harder than those who are naturally brilliant. They work with her and she loves it. That in itself is worth the price of admission.</p>

<p>Will her transcripts be much different at her boarding school than at the public school? Perhaps a bit, just because the public schools were rather discouraging in pushing her into more challenging classes. She will probably come close to maxing out her boarding school's course catalog in the next 3 years. That's OK with me. They have a few students who go beyond the course catalog and do independent study in various areas (teacher guided, of course). A good school with good teachers who have the time to work with their students will always find a way to get the most out of their students.</p>

<p>You can't do that without the faculty bodies in the building. And any school that forgets to remind their prospective families of that fact, just doesn't get it.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
it's a natural process.
The strong ones stay in the business and the weak ones have to adapt and improve or they simply have to go out of business.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Not so much go out of business, as usually before things get to completely out of control, an outside force comes in and sacks the managers and bring in fresh capital and takes the operation forward.</p>

<p>In the theoretical economic model, your statement is correct. However players in markets are always looking to acquire a poorly used asset and turn it around. Nothing goes to waste.</p>

<p>In the case of non-profits (like most traditional boarding schools), it is usually the larger contributors who initiate the house cleaning by the power of the purse (no more contributions until WE fix the management).</p>

<p>You've got the overall guiding principle right bearcats, but there are lots other rules that get applied in the recycling of assets in markets. </p>

<p>I'd love to hear biffgnar's take on this...</p>

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<p>Did somebody mention me? Generally I would say that while most of what you guys say is right in the real world I find most markets to be a lot less efficient than one would hope or expect. In fact a lot of what my firm (and every other hedge fund out there) does is try to exploit some of the inefficiencies in the market. I'm actually at work right now and need to keep my eyes on the screens, but can try to post a little more detail later.</p>

<p>By the way, goaliedad referenced the censoring of r-e-p-u-t-a-t-i-o-n. Maybe a Spanish speaker on here could confirm this, but if I recall correctly from my days in CA four of the letters in that word are a bad word (not I don't think one of the biggies but still one that is frowned upon) in Spanish.</p>

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<p>biffgnar,</p>

<p>You are always right on cue! Looking forward to more thougts on the subject later on.</p>

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<p>u mean puta? DAMN I JUST SAID THE WORD...</p>

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<p>reputation - oh hey! it's not censored here!</p>

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<p>Consultant,
MY D is on four wait lists now and we would surely be glad to use your services to get her into any of those top 4 or even another top 25 school...they all seem to be full so I am surprised to hear you say you could get a B student in in MAY-perhaps you did not mean to the Andovers, Middlesexs, Miltons, Deerfields etc.
She has an A is super nice..artist, some athletics, valedictorian...piano, choir, drama..soup kitchen...won an essay competition...yeesh I never thought we would be waiting now..</p>

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<p>I should have said A+- 98 average..</p>

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<p>That is out of 8th grade, I am assuming? (The 98 average).</p>

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<p>@waitlistman: edconsultant22 works for a school, I believe, but I think you're on the right track by looking for some external guidance. And perhaps he (she?) can direct you to someone in your area or help you approach D's school about how to move forward. You seem stuck on some BS scenarios that aren't happening and -- recognizing I can only judge from your posts and that's limited -- you don't seem like you're in a place where you're making the most clearly reasoned choices. You seem strung out -- and not just by the wait list process (times 4), but emotionally, too. I still think that you'd do yourself and D a huge favor by regrouping and going about the search anew next year with the wisdom you've gained this year. Perhaps an educational consultant or other third party expert who really gets to know your D can give advice, help with the wait list scene (whether by guiding you along to an offer of admission or helping you confront the reality of it all), and either encourage you to take whatever you can grab this time around or tell you to wait for the next time the merry-go-round circles so you can grab the brass ring that will fit your D perfectly. Instead of playing catch up this year, you can be way ahead of the curve next year. Considering there's no bird in the hand you have to give up (just 4 wait lists), I would think that it would be very appealing to go into next year as well prepared as you'll surely be (especially with an educational consultant as a co-pilot).</p>

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<p>Waitlist - we were in a somewhat similar situation with our daughter last year. Applied to five schools, no initial acceptances, but waitlisted at three. She did get in off the waitlist at one of these schools, but we knew she was going there by mid-April.</p>

<p>My best advice would be three-fold. Continue to hang in there with the schools you've been waitlisted at, and keep checking back with them. Send in her most recent grades if they continue to be strong. Also, anything else that might enhance her application. There is still a chance that a place may open up and the waitlists are much smaller now, because those on the waitlist who were accepted at another school have probably dropped out. However, you also have to be realistic and realize that the odds are not good, so you also have to start making alternate plans.</p>

<p>Second, I would contact an educational consultant now to get their help. There are still some good schools that may have spots they're looking to fill. For example, my son applied to an excellent day school in our area and got in. After much thought he decided he wanted to go to BS, so we had to decline. Well, we recently learned that this year the day school had a lower yield than they'd anticipated and have one or two slots still open. Again this is a small, but very good school with outstanding academics. An educational consultant who is plugged in to the BS community may know of a similar anomally that you guys could take advantage of.</p>

<p>Third, assuming your kid is going into 9th grade this Fall, I would definitely consider reapplying next year for 10th grade. Many top BS take a large number of 10th graders. Next year you will be another year wiser, and can take the precaution of applying to a couple of more schools. I would also not hesitate to re-apply to the schools that waitlisted your child this year.</p>

<p>In any event, I know how disheartening it can feel for both you and your kid to go through this entire process and feel like you just missed out. I am a tremendous believer in perserverance. If you and your child really want this, don't give up. Although it may seem like an empty platitude now, it is not success that builds character, but adversity and failure.</p>

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<p>I am not in an "emotional state" that is not conducive to this just angry that lack of more sports is the likely reason for this..I place much higher value on the arts...we already have a spot in a "safe" school as I have stated, its just that my d is not satisified with it..the plan is precisely to look next year and hope for some movement and also yes update them with valedictorian info etc. still hard for me to fathom her not getting in frankly-thats not emotional-just fact...consultant would be able to get the real poop I am not getting...
eg. essay-some rec not up to snuff etc.</p>

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<p>Oh- and I am very appreciative for all the support and help here..it is refreshing in a world all too often only focused on competing...regards..:)</p>