Brown, Cornell, Northwestern, or Penn?

College Majors Engineering Majors
1

Hey everyone,

I apologize in advance for how long this post will probably be, but to be fair there’s a lot of details with 4 schools involved. I’m incredibly excited to have been accepted to all, truthfully I didn’t expect all 4. I’m interested in environmental topics, which of course is related to civil, but I’m also still interested in electrical and how that could relate. While I’m pretty confident that I want to be an engineer, I’m not definitely set on any one branch, and truthfully I wouldn’t be extremely surprised should I end up in a pure science like physics, engineering physics, or even math. I do have a lot of other interests, such as linguistics and foreign language, that would be great to continue in college as well.

I guess what I’m looking for is some insight from some people on the pros and cons of each school regarding my ambitions. I’m notoriously indecisive, so it’s been quite a time trying to wrap my head around this. I’ll try to explain currently why I applied to each school and what I liked about it.

Brown- Brown appeals to my indecisiveness and interests outside of engineering through the open curriculum. I love the attitude on campus and the flexibility and cohesiveness of all the students on campus, regardless of major. It’s in a city, which I also appreciate. My reservations about Brown include the small size of the engineering school and its reputation as a whole. While Brown itself clearly has a great reputation, I’m not sure if the engineering department really lives up to the others. Although I’m confident I would have a great time at Brown, I’m still pondering whether or not ultimately it would be the best use of my options in engineering, since larger departments do have lots of resources to throw around.

Cornell- Cornell appeals to me because of the size, strength, and reputation of its program, as well as having pretty much every major I could see myself ending up in. The location is a major drawback (not being in a city) and I’ve heard some rumors of depression and general lack of things to do, which is a bit concerning, but considering how large it is I’m sure I can find groups. Additionally, the program seems a little more rigid than the others, which is a bit scary to me as an indecisive person who has a lot of other interests. I’m worried it might end up being too stressful and rigid, although obviously this is more of a me-problem than any systematic flaw with the school.

Northwestern- I still haven’t visited Northwestern, I’m going in a few days, but I applied largely for the same reason that I applied to Cornell- the strength of the program and its inclusion of all my possible majors. The added perk here is that it is in a city, and the trimester system gives a little more flexibility. Coming from eastern Pennsylvania, I’m not entirely sure of its nationwide reputation, and there is a part of me that says “go Ivy” because it’s the Ivy League, so I’m still not sure about Northwestern.

Penn- Coming from Pennsylvania, this school’s been on my mind for a while. I love Philly and the atmosphere of the school, and the opportunity to have other great programs like Wharton right there. My main reservation is the lack of either a civil or environmental program. I’d have to major in electrical or chem/bio molecular, which isn’t bad, but I’m not sure if it’s worth it to make that commitment. If they had a civil or environmental department, I’d almost definitely go to Penn, but because they don’t it’s a harder decision.

Thanks for reading all of this, I know it’s a lot and obviously a lot of this comes down to me and what I want, but I’d really appreciate if anyone from any of these schools or anyone with knowledge in general about these schools, or EnvE, had any input

Thank You!

2

I do not know much about the difference to other schools, but I myself chose Brown for environmental engineering precisely because of its undergraduate focus and because of a campus visit. At first, rankings were the only thing my college counsellor sought after and disregarded Brown, but once I got there I entered the Engineering design workshop and talked with students in the same field who had chosen Brown over other top schools because of the open curriculum and unique way of academics. Do not overlook Brown just because of rankings (most are only even based on the lack of GRAD opportunities). :wink:

3

If you really want to be an engineer in a sub-field that values ABET accreditation, you will need to follow a partially specified, sequential set of courses, with specific groups of sanctioned electives, for a decent part of your schedule no matter where you go.

The difference is, Cornell mandates such sequence. Which is really a pretty typical sequence for engineers, it’s not like it’s more onerous than is typical or anything, it’s just that that is what you need. Brown almost certainly doesn’t mandate it. But then if you want to really be an engineer in one of those areas you may be more likely to need an extra year at the end. Depending on what flavor engineer you wind up wanting to be. If you do follow an ABET-accredited degree program there (other than for “general engineering”, which is not how many employers hire), then so much for the big “open curriculum”, a lot of your course choices will be specified or narrowed… But for some other subfields it doesn’t matter. I don’t know what the other two schools do. I think maybe Penn does it for some majors, but others like bioengineering it doesn’t?? I don’t know you’ll have to look into it.

I think you’ll find that a smaller percentage of engineering students at Brown, and at Penn, actually wind up becoming practicing engineers. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, it just reflects what those people personally wanted, both at the end and at the beginning before they committed to go there.

Anyway all of the above are my guesses, I may be wrong, please investigate for yourself.

At the end of the day, if they all pass the engineering test to sufficient extent, suggest choose the university you like the best in all other respects.

I had engineering classmates at Cornell who had turned down both Brown and Penn. But that was ages ago.

I never met a Northwestern engineer, and I actually practiced in a big firm in Chicago. Don’t know what that means, probably just me.

4

A suggestion, before you are done:
For each school, for each area that you think you might become interested in, look at the registrar’s list of courses actually given each of the last two semesters, and count them.
don’t use the catalog, use the registrar’s list of what was actually offered.
If you can,look at the frequency with which various courses are offered: every semester? every year? Every other year? One section, or several sections?
Less frequency, fewer sections= harder to schedule.

5

Do not underestimate Northwestern because it is not an Ivy! That would be a classic mistake.

See if Northwestern is less rigid than Cornell on approaches to your linguistics interest as a minor within their application of the ABET program requirements. ABET does allow flexibility within their framework, but many Universities do not take advantage of that option. The old system just told you to take a pretty specific selection of courses. See what NW can do for you.

Both Cornell and Northwestern are very highly regarded in the engineering world.

Brown has the flexibility, but not the range of engineering depth. They do not have Civil Engineering.

With the exception of Cornell, the Ivies are not broadly developed in the fields of engineering.

6

What is the COA for each school ? If close, then Northwestern or Cornell.

7

Currently Northwestern is the cheapest, being about half the price of Cornell (although I am appealing Cornell’s aid based on my family making less in 2018). Penn and Brown are both in the middle, with Brown being a few thousand less than Penn

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Northwestern. Moreover, in my opinion, Northwestern also has the best location, setting & most beautiful campus of the four schools.

OP: You wrote that you are not sure of Northwestern’s reputation. That statement seems a bit hard to believe as NU is ranked #10 in the nation by US News. Northwestern University is ranked above Brown & Cornell.

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As OP is interested in engineering, the relevant US News places Cornell (#14) higher than Northwestern (#20).

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For engineering, Northwestern or Cornell. But if Northwestern is the cheapest, it’s a no brainer. Congrats on fantastic choices!

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Based on its strength in environmental engineering and engineering overall, Cornell would seem to be your school to beat based on your current academic interests. However, you didn’t say specifically whether you have been accepted to COE at Cornell. To be clear, have you?

12

Northeastern looks interesting… https://www.mccormick.northwestern.edu/civil-environmental/ - Check out the Career link. Enjoy your visit!

13

Yes, I have been accepted to the College of Engineering at every institution where you apply within your college.

14

As a parent, I can tell you that my daughter was accepted to the same engineering schools as well as Columbia, and chose Brown. She loved Brown, and the flexibility that Brown provided allowed her to change her major to Applied Math without a problem. She is now learning on the job Computer Science and loving it as well as being paid very well for it. Her friends from Brown who were Engineering Majors are also thriving. Don’t underestimate the flexibility that Brown offers as well as its stellar reputation and happy students.

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If you have not already done so, look over this section on the Northwestern site. I thought your interest is Brown focused on flexibility in course selection and the opportunity to pursue, possibly, linguistics. Cornell may not be as flexible here as Northwestern with their “whole Brain” approach.

You need to get more details to find out. As I said before, not all ABET programs are the same. See what Northwestern can do here for you .

Start at https://www.mccormick.northwestern.edu/academics/undergraduate/

Don’t worry, the engineering part of the program is just as solid as Cornell’s. Ivy does not carry extra credit in the engineering world. You want a quality program which best matches your interests.

16

In Engineering circle, we all know most Ivies are NOT great, except Cornell and Pricentom, and to less extent, Penn. Don’t worry about it. I guarantee you Northwestern has better ranked programs than Brown since ages ago. If anyone thinks otherwise, he/she’s probably not in engineering anyway.

In addition, Northwestern has the leading transportation (subfield of civil engineering) center in the country and one of the most oldest and established co-op programs where you can be away for employers not just during summer but also during the school year.

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Northwestern is a perfectly respectable engineering program. It’s also fairly small and is more limited in its scope than, say, Purdue, so it isn’t as widely known or encountered outside of its particular areas of expertise.

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Took a brief glance , at Cornell looks like non-engineering electives consist of two seminars first year, then at least six additional courses . They’ve changed it since my day, now they have a “bucket list” approach for electives. Maybe because too many engineers were spending all their free electives taking economics courses, or maybe because ABET instituted a similar bucket list, I really don’t know. Anyway linguistics is sanctioned under the “KCM” category, foreign languages are sanctioned in the “FL” category.

The good news is that electives can be taken in any of the university’s undergraduate colleges, not just Arts & Sciences.
You’ll want to look at all this, probably.

BTW Cornell also offers a Coop program.

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@monydad, at NU, near 30% do co-op and NU sends a lot of grads to Abbott. So a good number do end up being practicing engineers. That said, many top performing students do often end up either in PhD or consulting.

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I can’t understand why people think the location of Cornell is a drawback. I went to Cornell, and I love the location. It is most certainly not in the middle of nowhere. It is more like an oasis in the midst of rural surroundings. Besides the surroundings being absolutely spectacular, Ithaca is an active little city with a great downtown and the cute Collegetown section (although, admittedly Collegetown is not as quaint as it used to be). And the campus itself is like a small town. There’s always so much going on.