<p>the 5 year AB/ScB is a waste. It's a 5 year program where you graduate with a bachelor of arts in one thing and a bachelor of science in another. If you want to major (or as we say, concentrate) in 2 diff things, you're better off just getting one degree with two concentrations.</p>
<p>PLME is an 8 year bachelors/medical degree. When deciding to do PLME or not, not only do you have to think about whether you want to go to medical school, but do you want to go to Brown's medical school.</p>
<p>But you aren't bound to Brown's med school in PLME - you're free to apply to and attend other med schools, and you'll have Brown med school as a safety net of sorts</p>
<p>true, but recommendation letters are everything in the med school admissions game, and I know that if I were a PLME adviser, I would not write you a good letter for another med school. The PLME program is not meant to be a safety net, it's meant for kids in high school who know they want to go to med school and who know they want to go to Brown's med school. It's one thing to discover your passion is in a different field (i.e. you decided you want to be a lawyer instead) but quite frankly, to me, it just seems selfish and rude to back out of a commitment like that simply to go somewhere else.</p>
<p>Also, I'm pretty sure (but not being a PLME I don't know for sure) that if you apply out, you forfeit your guaranteed spot at Brown, meaning that if you apply out, Brown's med school admissions committee would evaluate you like anyone else and possibly not admit you. PLMEs are roughly half of the med school, if everyone was shooting off some apps to see if they could do better while still holding on to their spot, it would make building a med school class very difficult.</p>
<p>i<em>wanna</em>be_Brown--your information is incorrect</p>
<p>having been a PLME, i can vouch for how easy it is to apply out. the assumption when you enter the program is that you will stay, but if you have reason to leave, the PLME office is very supportive of your decision. a handful of people leave each year to go to harvard medical school, a school closer to home, or do something else entirely. as long as you are not enrolled in another medical school they will hold your spot--i have a good friend who held his spot while getting a law degree at harvard</p>
<p>Are you sure the rules haven't changed dcircle?
I had heard the same thing that you said i_wanna (that if you apply out, your space in brown med isn't guaranteed), but I think they might have just recently made this the new policy. I know it's not true for my year ('10/'14), but they changed many of the other rules for the class of 2011. Maybe the reserved space is among these changes?</p>
<p>if you go to another med school, of course they don't keep your spot. if you want to do peace corps for two years first, they will.</p>
<p>if you want to apply out, the plme office will definitely support you--it's not like you won't get good recommendation letters from your plme advisors.</p>
<p>Yes, but the question is whether there's a new rule (as I've heard there is, but I'm not sure) that if you apply out of the program at all, you forfeit your guaranteed spot at Brown med. Therefore, if you decided you wanted to apply to Harvard med (or to any other med school), you would not be able to hold a spot at Brown as a safety. You would have to apply to Brown med as if you were a regular applicant.</p>
<p>ah, i see what you are saying. in that case, you may be correct quaker.
i'm not sure whether you can apply out and then use brown as a back up guarantee--my guess is that the answer is quite reasonably no</p>
<p>hello everyone, I recently heard about this plme program and got few questions/comments:
1) so, if u get into brown plme and maintain 3.3 gpa...u r "COMPLETELY GUARANTEED" a place at Brown Medical School?! As in, you dont eve have to take MCAT? With medical school acceptance rates all over the nation around 5% in every university...isn't it a REALLY GOOD deal?
2) wats the average SAT to get in? it doesn't give any particular mention.
3) The description from the site and this forum suggest that this program is pretty laid back..as in terms of not a lot of competition/difficulty wise..since u can take Pass/Fail for most of ur Premed courses.....am i right?</p>
<p>Acceptance into PLME is among the most competitive in the country (world?) and they only accept a very small handful. Acceptance into Brown in general is among the most competitive in the country, as well. The culture of Brown itself is not competitive. That gets left behind at acceptance, because the folks who get in have already passed through that "most selective" threshold. But I would not use the words "laid back," as many people have said, many times, on this forum. I don't particularly know about PLME from a personal (parental) perspective, but anectodally, PLME is normal Brown for undergrads, which means all the wonderful advantages of all of Brown's Open Curriculum etc.</p>
<p>You don't have to take the MCAT, and are guaranteed a spot as long as you fulfill the requirements they set out and maintain some specific GPA (for my year it was 3.0, but I think they raised it, as you suggested Innovative).<br>
I don't think they list an average SAT anywhere, and I don't know how to begin to guess it. I think it probably varies a lot, since they admit students with very different backgrounds.
It's more "laid back" than being typical pre-med, since people aren't really competing against each other and not everything feels quite so 'do or die'. That said, most PLME kids work just as hard as the regular pre-meds do, and they take most of the same classes, so I wouldn't say it's much easier, really. I think there's also a new rule about not taking PLME requirements pass/fail (or maybe just some of them?).</p>
<p>My son is a PLME and his standardized tests were very high (1560/1600 and 760-800 on SATIIs, mostly 5s on APs (took 9 APs), top 2% of his class. Had medical ECs. </p>
<p>I could be wrong but I don't think a PLME has to maintain a specific GPA since technically Brown doesn't calculate GPA. There are specific PLME courses that the student MUST earn a B or better. PLMEs must maintain satisfactory progress or some such terminology in other PLME required courses but I'm not sure what that means. </p>
<p>As for pass/fail classes - just like non-PLMEs, pre-meds normally take classes for a letter grade. While letter grades are RECOMMENDED, they probably are not REQUIRED (since if taking pass/fail, a student MUST request a written letter detailing how they did in the class so students are still being evaluated). </p>
<p>Brown students aren't told what to do, but they are advised as to the advantages/disadvantages of their choices. Brown students CHOOSE how they handle their education. These are bright, self-motivated students who make smart decisions. The perception that Brown students take all their classes pass/fail and just coast through college is usually based on ignorant heresay. In reality, many students take SOME classes, usually in electives, where they want to explore new areas of interest or subjects they are weak in academically but have an interest - for example, Neuroscience is very popular but not necessarily a strength of all students who are interested. </p>
<p>There are probably some students who never take a class pass/fail and yes, there may be some students who try to coast and take all their difficult classes pass/fail - but this latter group is definitely the minority. Brown admissions seems to do a good job of selecting students who will make the most of its system and not abuse it. Brown seeks students who are passionate about learning and looks for evidence of that during admissions. I doubt hard working, internally driven, academically passionate HS students suddenly turn lazy once in college.</p>
<p>thanks a lot franglish, thequaker, and jerzgrlmom for ur advices!
yeah, i was kind of wondering about this whole pass/fail thing too...haha. regarding GPA..i just checked on their handbook and it has clear instructions on which courses should be taken as letter grade and such.
so they take 100 students out of like 1600ish who applies...and does it mean applying ED gives u a bit better chance..if at all?</p>
<p>About PLME students applying out to other medical schools: Nowhere in the PLME policies handbook (of any year) does it say that you will forfeit your place in their medical school if you apply to other medical schools. Please correct me if I am wrong about this.</p>
<p>From my experience with applying to other combined programs, the school will make it very explicit if they require you to be "bound" to their medical school (ex: Vanderbilt's ENGAGE program requires students to sign a contract).</p>
<p>However, PLME students will lose their spot if they fail to complete an AMCAS application, violate academic codes, etc.</p>
<p>Students offered admission to the PLME for fall 2007 achieved an average score of 723 Critical Reading, 738 Mathematics, and 727 Writing on the SAT Reasoning Test.</p>
<p>bicyclekick,
Following your link, it also says PLMEs are generally in the top 1% of their class. Perhaps coming from underachieving schools isn't a deterrent as long as the student stands out within his/her environment (high GPA, most difficult curriculum).</p>