<p>hey guys. i'm a new member -parent of an applicant to 9th grade. I asked adcom counselors at several "ten schools" about their posted average ssat's for incoming 9th graders. I was told not to believe the numbers, "they are not true". That's a direct quote from a school that is frequently discussed on this forum. I say this only to lessen the stress that many of you are feeling regarding your scores. They are not that important. Bs's strive to be more and more "diverse", they value diversity in all its forms. Racial, geographic, gender and most importantly intellectual diversity. Bs's would not reflect society if all their students tested in the 90% and above. In fact they would be pretty boring. I want my child in a "diverse" school community that reflects the world as a whole, not a think tank. Food for thought.</p>
<p>I concur with the above poster
We had one top school in the Boston area tell us that they would only be concerned about S#2 SSAT scores if they came back in "single digits"--this school reports an "average SSAT" score of 88. Another with an average reported at 91 percent said basically that SSAT scores are the last thing they look at</p>
<p>Well, let's not get too giddy with this news. Most of this is not news at all to anyone who has read through the threads here. But much of the understatement is a bit too hyperbolic to go unrebutted. Some of these statements are just shy of advising kids not to bother taking the tests.</p>
<p>While the prevailing thinking here among most people has long been that the SSAT is not the alpha and omega of BS admissions, the suggestions here that they border on meaningless go too far. Basically, I'm saying that while trying to alert people to what's well known, there's no need to mislead.</p>
<p>Boarding schools use the SSAT as an important tool as part of the admission package. Schools will not tell you not to apply because your scores are too low. They love having lots of people apply because it makes them more competitive. ESPECIALLY the "top" schools. So, when their admission officers sound encouragement to applicants with extremely low scores, that hardly means that that's the final word.</p>
<p>Remember, they require every applicant to take these tests. In fact, the Ten Schools developed the darned test to create a method of benchmarking applicants.</p>
<p>Saying "SSAT scores are the last thing they look at" actually attaches tremendous importance to the test. If a school has gone over everything in the applicant's package and they still need to consult the SSAT score report...that means there must be something powerful in those numbers because it could still shift the prevailing weight of a fully considered application.</p>
<p>And, yet, even though I take issue with the hyperbole here that's intended diminish the significance of the SSAT, let me be clear that they are not used as a substitute for the actual wisdom and due consideration of a team of bright people who are hired to evaluate and pass judgment on anywhere from 500 - 2,000 applications per year, depending on the school.</p>
<p>Last year, Hotchkiss' "rejects" included over 200 scores with 99% on the SSAT. (Which is not the same as 200 applicants.) Clearly, there are more important factors that come into play because if the SSAT scores were the most telling factor, having the highest possible score should all but guarantee admission, right? And we've had a student here -- without any hooks -- report being accepted with scores at around 70 to one of the most competitive schools of all.</p>
<p>But I'm calling "BS" on the admission officer at a "top school in the Boston area" who implied that a score in the 30s or 40s wouldn't be cause for concern. Now it's possible that they can look at the rest of the application and get beyond those scores. Especially if the applicant has several hooks to get in. But the only hook here is the sales pitch that encourages an underqualified student to apply in order to bolster the school's competitiveness numbers.</p>
<p>And the contention that "SSAT scores are false" is likewise a bit of hyperbole. There are exceptions. And the way they report the numbers may vary, but if you're not hooked...the SSAT numbers you see are a good guide. And even if you are hooked, the test is still an indicator of your ability to cope with the workload at some very academically challenging schools. The SSAT is not a very difficult test. If you're not among the top half of the test takers, you're not well advised to apply to some of the "top schools" because A) you're not likely to get in and you're throwing good money away; and B) worse than that, you might get accepted and then struggle mightily all the way through, if you survive that long. So the SSAT is a barometer for you as much as it's a barometer for the schools. </p>
<p>Even if there are schools that all but ignore them (after requiring you to take them), you would be foolish to ignore them. It's the only opportunity you have to compare yourself academically to the potential applicant pool you'll be competing against.</p>
<p>I think most of the adults here who have been around the block would agree that the SSAT is probably the first critical element that most schools look at. If they see a score in a range that demonstrates the applicant should be able to meet the school's academic challenges, they go on. They don't compare 89s to 94s or rank them. They just need to know if an applicant can cut it. For applicants that offer something to the school -- with some sort of hook -- they'll work a little harder to find promise. But they're not interested in admitting applicants who will be likely to fail or flounder. And the SSAT helps let them know that very important fact.</p>
<p>But once the team is assured of that much, the SSAT becomes an afterthought. The admission decision won't hinge on how much above the average an applicant scores on the SSAT than on other, more subjective factors -- like the diversity cited in the OP. Those factors are more important in the end. But only for those who survive the first hurdle.</p>
<p>I agree with D'yer's point. These schools want to increase number of applicants to their schools and make acceptance low so they can continue to be "super competitive" school.</p>
<p>The test score is a barometer. I have one kid way above anyone's average score but was rejected than my other child who was at a lower range of the SSAT score for top 10 schools and did not get any rejections. Most kids at their respective schools were all within range of the scores they report - exception of developmental and legacy cases.</p>
<p>My experience truly has been that SSAT scores are not deal breakers at most schools (even top ones). They are just one piece of the admissions puzzle and a flawed one at that. Those that worry if an 88% is not good enough in a school with an "average" of 90 are truly obsessing over something that is not an issue. </p>
<p>I am also aware of peers of my son who have indeed been admitted to top schools where SSAT scores average 85%+ with scores in the mid 20%-30%---they had strong resumes otherwise and in fact did quite well at this particular school</p>
<p>Dyer makes a lot of good points however the intent of my original OP was to quell the uproar coming from kids that scored 84 as opposed to the 97 they were shooting for. BSR and the schools themselves are not reliable sources for determining if a certain score will get you in. I disagree with Dyer, test scores are less important and considerd lastly because they are less important plain and simple. Once a student crosses the threshold a school establishes for admission, lets say 60%, an 84 and a 97 hold relatively the same weight.</p>
<p>SSAT scores are important. Many of the top tier boarding schools are much more demanding academically than the first year at many of the nation's most elite colleges. One elite New England boarding school reported a median SSAT of 90 for a recently graduated class. Two students that I know well had scored 88 and 90 on the SSAT when applying. One finished in the middle of the class, and the other slightly below the middle. The students with SSATs in the high 70s, I also know two, one clearly did not graduate in the top half of the class but did well in science and languages, while the other struggled. One of the three "valedictorians" entered with all 99s on the SSAT and worked so hard, under a great deal of self imposed pressure, that he developed stomach issues and took a year off after graduation. SSAT scores are evaluated both in the context of the school academics and needs, and in the context of an individual's particular situation. An experienced educational consultant told me that he was comfortable with SSAT scores above 75 when considering the most elite boarding schools ( his clients tended to be wealthy non-financial aid applicants). There are 5 or 6 boarding schools that reject many applicants with SSATs in the high 90s and admit certain classifications of students who score from the high 60s and up. Approx. 50% of the class was admitted to at least one Ivy, although some matriculated at non-Ivies.</p>
<p>The six boarding schools which probably truly have a very high median SSAT score are St. Paul's School, Groton, Hotchkiss, Andover, Exeter and Deerfield Academy. Of course, there are exceptions at all of these schools, but I would truly be reluctant to recommend a good student with SSAT scores much below 70 matriculate at these schools. And, as soon as names are named, many will note exceptions at each of these schools. Some will be gifted athletes, some talented minorities from underprivileged backgrounds, some from very wealthy alumnus families, etc. Examing the actual college matriculations of the most recent graduating classes indicates that St. Paul's, Andover, Deerfield and Groton are producing the most sought after graduates. Milton Academy and Hotchkiss are two other true academic powerhouse schools.</p>
<p>I know it has been said that you can't trust the info on BSR, but the updated average (not median) for SPS is 81%.</p>
<p>The St. Paul's School Class of 2007 had a median SSAT of 90 which was publicly released as the highest median SSAT in the history of the school at that time. This was also reflected in the college placement success of that class where over 50% could have matriculated at an Ivy. Also, please note that an "average" SSAT score can vary substantially from a "median" SSAT score. Recent medians at this school have been about 88. Regardless of whether the recent medians at a particular school are 88, 91 or, even, 83, the proof of educational value or success is, in the eyes of many, in the college placement success. The Class of 2007 at SPS had students matriculate at Stanford and 7 of the Ivies who did not graduate with a cum laude designation,and about 50% of the class graduated cum laude or above. An additional note, SPS has never, to my knowledge, claimed the highest SAT, or SSAT, scores, but they certainly produce well educated, hard working students in the eyes of the nation's most elite colleges and universities. As does Groton, Hotchkiss, Andover, Milton, & Deerfield. The top 40% from Exeter matriculate at the best colleges and universities as well.</p>
<p>"and about 50% of the class graduated cum laude or above."....That's amazing.</p>
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<p>Exactly. That's been the advice here. But there's no reason to stretch the facts and mislead kids into believing that SSATs are not important. They are important. These schools require these tests for a reason.</p>
<p>Here's the deal. You've got terrific students who play musical instruments and have straight As. They had wonderful interviews. And their teacher recommendations are stellar. That covers any number of applicants. Now you have one group with SSATs in the 40s 50s and 60s. And others with 70s 80s and 90s. Why would the admission office bother with the 40s-60s students when they have their fill of wonderful unhooked students in the other bracket?</p>
<p>If your score for a TSAO school is below 60 and you don't have something really super special to distinguish yourself, you're well-advised to look elsewhere because there are a ton of applicants you're competing against who otherwise look the same to you and it's just not worth the effort for the admission committee, faced with mountains of applications, to dig through your application to find some gem or well-turned essay phrase to make the case to leap frog you over so many similarly situated applicants with higher SSAT scores.</p>
<p>Sorry, but that's the reality that the applicants and parents need to face. The SSAT won't get you in. But it sure can keep you out. Not if there's hairsplitting. But you and Momof2sons weren't talking about that. You're saying that the SSAT scores just don't matter. And that's misleading. Really misleading.</p>
<p>As for the "uproar" -- that sort of underscores the point. The kids here can't really compare themselves and their experiences to each other except for the SSAT. It's the common denominator. It's important to them because it tells them something about how they compare. Now, when they quibble over 88s and 93s as being materially different, they're just being insane. But when they don't take note of a 43 (as one student here refuses to do) compared to all the kids quibbling over 88s and 93s, they're also being insane.</p>
<p>Excellent post d'yer. And again, all schools want as many applications as they can get to increase selectivity.</p>
<p>Denial is not helpful to 13 year olds. It took me some time to understand the responses on this board, where young kids are telling each other they will get in!! And with more aid than they think!! Brother. A fairy tale as Clinton would say.</p>
<p>The more applications the better, they tell everyone to apply because you don't know! You can take an educated guess though. I even think most can forget 85 if they have no hook at school's like Deerfield. By the time they take the athletes, legacies and the faculty kids, they need unhooked 99s with money!!</p>
<p>Someone posted that the schools want to represent society. This is not true. They are elite and want to stay that way. The mission of the top schools is to educate global leaders. If you're SAT score is projected to be 2000, why would they accept you? You will lower their amazing numbers. You will lower their percentage to ivy league colleges. Even the accepted athletes are the highest scoring they can find!</p>
<p>Of course they have some very wealthy legacies with low numbers (but not too low or they wouldn't last).</p>
<p>And why would a child want to go to a school and be the bottom of the class? It could hurst self esteem not to mention college choices.</p>
<p>quote:"Even the accepted athletes are the highest scoring they can find!"</p>
<p>You've got to be kidding me. As an example St Paul's has over 30% students of color, they employ a diversity coordinator in their admissions office, as do many other schools, precisely to insure that their pool of applicants represents a cross section of society. Take a quick look at the travel schedule for many of the top schools admissions officers. They are visiting NYC, Chicago, Newark, NJ and other urban centers. Why do you think they do this? Wouldn't it be much easier to hold fairs in Scarsdale or Bedminster, NJ.</p>
<p>Where are you people getting these averages for SSAT's? Both Petersons and BSR state clearly that they post the info that schools give them. There is no way to verify how accurate they are. I asked admissions officers directly and they told me that the #'s were unreliable. For us to sit here and discuss them in any fashion is definitely misleading. Does the freedom of information act apply to boarding school admissions data. I'm providing you with a first person account, take with a grain of salt. As you should with other longwinded posts on this forum.</p>
<p>Well I think that the above poster is unfairly critical of others' experience and knowledge with boarding schools. If you didn't want our knowledge and experienced opinions, then why did you start this thread? Just so you could insult us? You sound like a person with a lot of parental anxieties regarding your child's applications to boarding schools. You are not well informed and we are doing our best to help you. Sorry if our knowledge and experience isn't what you want to hear. For a new member with very limited knowledge, you sure do like to tear down those of us who are trying to help. My best guess is that you were told these things by admissions folks simply to quell your anxieties regarding your child's applications. BSR is said to be unreliable in the sense that its statistics tend to be outdated and, therefore, not currently accurate. Adiosamigos: Your posts are somewhat difficult to understand. I'm sorry but I have difficulty in grasping whatever point you are trying to make. My impression is that you are writing in an axiety laden emotional state. That's okay as all of us parents have been there and done that.</p>
<p>first my apologies icy9ff8 if my pointed questions appear to be insulting. That is not my intent. While I just recently became a member I've been following the treads since the beginning. That's precisely why I've been compelled to post. I have grown frustrated with the unsubstantiated facts and figures that are thrown around in this forum. I actually follow my one advise and take what I read with a grain of salt and I have very thick skin. </p>
<p>I would think that if someone post's that "200 applicants with 99%" were rejected from a particular school or that "50% of a graduating class were accepted to Ivies" that the information be cited to check its validity. I been researching schools up and down for the last 5 years and I have yet to find the source of such claims. My apologies once again.</p>
<p>Both statistics that you cite are accurate. My data is well documented and verified. Initially I obtain data from publicly available sources and then verify through the schools and families with children in the schools. I am known to all of the major boarding schools who are furnished with my data, findings and methodology. Some schools, like Taft and Peddie, will not cooperate with my studies. They are not top 15 schools anyway. I only research 25 schools. Getting the info. is quite difficult and time consuming. I have received a "cease and desist" letter from a boarding school association located in Groton, Mass. I ignored this request. I have been asked by other boarding schools to please consider ranking them by tiers instead of numerically. I also received a very unfriendly call from another New Jersey boarding school. I will soon furnish an op-ed piece to the WSJ, as they several months ago expressed interest in my study but things interceded. Many in the industry were delighted to receive my study. And most were very co-operative.</p>
<p>i look forward to the op-ed.</p>