Hello! I’m an incoming freshman and have signed up for Calculus 2 for my first semester (I’m a math major and got a 5 on the BC test). Calc 2 should be like review for me with a little bit of new things and my advisor told me that if I want to I can also take Discrete math. Without discrete math I will have 3 classes and with it I will have 4. I was wondering if Calculus 2 AND Discrete math together is a difficult combination (I don’t want to start my college career way over my head and stressed out, and I also don’t want to go insane). So, for anyone who has experience with discrete math and Calculus 2, do you think that doing the two together would be manageable? Thank you so much!
Not knowing how strong you are in math, I’d err on the side of starting without the discrete math(assuming this is a proof based course) for your first freshman semester. What are the other 2 classes you are taking? Are they pset heavy/science? If so, I would definitely not recommend the discrete math. However, taking linear algebra/multivariable calc, is doable as a 4th class if Calc 2 is merely review for you. Discrete math is another level of math that I would not recommend a freshman to take as they transition to college.
Yes. It is more than manageable.
I was a math major first semester taking honors classes with part time job and volunteer tutoring
I took 5 classes and maintained a 4.0
And I can warrant yoù the classes I took would make Calc 2 a laughable joke.
First semester…
Honors physics
Calc 3
Discrete Math
Diff Èq
English Composition
If i can do it with 2 part time jobs, why couldnt you? And I studied in a very respected university…
College is really easy. Dont worry. Judging by ur username, for students bent heavily in mathematics, college classes really are a cruise …
Most people have difficulty in college cause they never studied more than five minutes a day in high school so the sudden change is too big to adjust.
However, if you are willing to spend two to three hours everyday (and a lot on weekends) then really, 4.0 in even engineering is more than do able. I mean I attend a from this university a respected university (Columbia) and I can tell you…
for hard working students, 4.0 in any college is do able. And oh ya, i forgot to add, even with all that, i made more friends than most freshmen first year. But then im a workaholic addict so ya, i guess it depends.
If you enjoy sleeping late and dont join 10000 clubs with frats, any degree is mangeable to get 4.0 even with over 18 credits a semester (which has like four to five math/science class a semester)
So ya… dont sweat it. College is a time of fun. Classes arent impossible. Colleges usually accept students that are qualified enough to get a 4.0
heck, i seen some freshmen take analysis 3 first semester and claimed to be chem major. If he can do it, whyccant u?
btw… he is in a frat and has a 3.89. So, not bad right? 
Most people have difficulty in college cause they never studied more than five minutes a day in high school so the sudden change is too big to adjust.
However, if you are willing to spend two to three hours everyday (and a lot on weekends) then really, 4.0 in even engineering is more than do able. I mean i attend from a well respected university (Columbia) and I can tell you…
for hard working students, 4.0 in any college is do able. And oh ya, i forgot to add, even with all that, i made more friends than most freshmen first year. But then im a workaholic addict so ya, i guess it depends.
If you enjoy sleeping late and dont join 10000 clubs with frats, any degree is mangeable to get 4.0 even with over 18 credits a semester (which has like four to five math/science class a semester)
So ya… dont sweat it. College is a time of fun. Classes arent impossible. Colleges usually accept students that are qualified enough to get a 4.0
heck, i seen some freshmen take analysis 3 first semester and claimed to be chem major. If he can do it, whyccant u?
btw… he is in a frat and has a 3.89. So, not bad right?
The other two classes I’m taking are an environmental science course and a First Year Seminar about technology and society. I’m pretty good at math (I took Calc BC my junior year and AP Stats my senior year). I’m mostly concerned about how much of a time commitment each class is. In high school I spent all the time I needed to finish things and maintain my 4.0 and I’d like to get a 4.0 in college too. I’m going to join a club or two (one about environmental science because I love it and another random thing). How much time am I looking at giving up to take discrete math? Oh, and yes, it is proof based.
Could you post the course description along with the prereqs for the discrete math course? Discrete math can vary so much that it really depends on how its being taught.
Last semester as a second semester freshman, I took Foundations of Abstract Math (Math 300) and Discrete Structures for Computing (CS222) at my university at the same time (I had taken calc 1-3 in HS and Linear algebra first semester). Both are proof-based Discrete Math courses, but Math 300 is for math majors and CS 222 is for CS majors (idk why we had to take both if we were double majors, but that’s life).
I was the only freshman in Math 300 (most were juniors) and it was difficult! It had a prereq of linear algebra (so also Calc 2) and we covered logic, proof techniques, induction, set theory, group theory, basic ring and field theory, and basic real analysis. CS 222 was mainly sophomores, but had quite a few freshman and it had no math prereq. We covered logic, proof techniques, induction, basic set theory, and basic probability and combinatorics. For me, CS 222 was a joke because by the time we covered something in it, we had covered it much more in depth already in Math 300.
If your Discrete Math is more like CS 222 (obviously wouldn’t include the CS aspects we did), I’d say go ahead and take it, but if its more like Math 300, I’d say wait a bit to take it.
EDIT: If you are going to the same school you said in your previous responses, your Discrete Math course is pretty basic and only has precalc as a prereq. Therefore, you should be fine.
Discrete math is one of those you get it or not. I seen students spend countless hours at it and struggle. For others like me, it came naturally.
Now the class isnt really hard. Those who struggle are those very annoyingly simple question like prove n is an even integer. Those basic proofs are so basic some people are like duhhh and they often get stuck since they cant write a single step.
Anyways, in average, if u took cakc bc, u know more than most calc 2 curriculum. College calc 2 just has more integral technicques and less chapters (? Idk why)
and discrete math… 2 to 3 hours a week should give you 4.0
if u are the type to struggle… 5 hours a week. Kinda suprising right? Looks very little but honestly, when college students first go off to study alone… apparently even this is too much and they fail their classes 
Dont party 24/7. Remeember, freshmen is ur easiest year. Its lik freshmen year in high school except this time, no parents so student tend to game 20 hours a day and skip lectures then cry over how hard engineering is.
Ya… thats the real typical engineering/cs major. Play games, watch youtube videos till midnight THEN study and cry and complain over how hard their degree is. Oh wait, i do that too xD
And in college, gpa means nothing. Unless u plan working in academia… cost benefit wise, uhmm. Not worth it.
Each credit point is supposed to be 2.5 hours a week of dedication but reality is more of 2.5 hours a week per typical 3 credit class. (the credit system applies more to advaneced honors classes like real analysis 3 where even 6 hrs a day wont guarantee you an A but thats not undergrad level xD)
and first year seminars are free A classes with like 1 hour workload a week
Calc 2 u already pretty much mastered and u really shuld be at calc 3 so u will dedicate like hr and half a week?
discrete math closer to 3 hrs a week
environmental science course shuld be hour and half a week?
i mean cmon… u got a whole weekend too. Technically just saturday is more than enouhh for u to get u a 4.0 while partying. Now there is 1 flaw to my metric…
No one is ever efficient. My typical ten minute assignment takes 3 hrs. Why? Facebook and youtube bro xD welcome to college where workload is exaggerated cause of unproductiveness ~~
Your other 2 courses sound very manageable. @guineagirl96 gave good advice, and given what she has stated regarding your discrete math course, then you should be fine. It is true that not all Discrete Math courses are the same across different majors and universities. Good luck to you.
Thank everyone! I’m also a little worried about adjusting to college life. Do you guys think that will be difficult? Are “college level math courses” a lot harder/more demanding than those of high school? I think I can handle both math classes, but I have never really experienced a math class in college so I’m not sure what to expect. I know the idea behind AP is college level work, but I don’t buy that that is the real experience. Thanks again!
In my experience, my high school math courses were harder (but I got all the very hard teachers), but it really depends on your background. Our algebra 2 covered two years of math, I got a teacher that teaches multivar and up for precalc, and multivar, I got the teacher who has written textbooks and has a PhD in string theory. In college, linear algebra was very straightforward and then Math 300 was difficult (especially the second half after set theory), but I’d say multivar was more difficult for me.
College courses aren’t really more demanding but the grading is different. Typically, there are 2-4 tests plus the final that make up your grade. HW may not be graded at all; usually, if it is, it’s no more than 10%. Do your research on the professors because that can make a big difference.
Are “college level math courses” a lot harder/demanding than those of high school?
In my experience, yes.
For me, Linear Algebra was unarguably the hardest class for me. It was an honors class and the first time I seriously did proofs (ironically, I did more proofs than when I self studied Real Analysis (Rudin’s + Understanding Analysis book) this summer). I spent around four hours everyday (many times even up to 10-12 hours) and as a whole, it was an extremely rewarding experience.
I understand this was not the typical experience students in college had for this class as apparently students from the other class couldn’t solve a single question in our homework.
But hey, I paid so much for OOS at the time so I was delighted to get my money’s worth My professor was always available so I was also able to regularly get help from him outside class.
At the beginning, I remember I was one of the worst students (if not the worst) in class. Trust me, proofs to me didn’t make much sense (hey, I was only 17 at the time, gimme some slack :P). The textbook was all LOTS of text and my eyes would just hurt just opening the book. But it was through this that I matured on my mathematical reasoning a lot which have helped me self study Analysis I and Modern Algebra I this summer (and currently, I am learning some programming)
I recognize that “college level math courses” changes radically in most schools starting from Real Analysis I.
Real Analysis, Modern Algebra are often seen as the two hardest undergrad courses and are VERY time consuming.
That said, this really depends.
If you attend places like CalTech in which students use Apostol’s book for Calculus I, then even Calc 1 itself would be horror. But fortunately, more than 99% of US colleges don’t use this book so ^^
Rest of the math courses though I feel in general:
Regular Calc 1, 2, 3, ODE (introductory), Linear Algebra
are actually very easy. In fact, at least for me, I personally thought I studied less than I did in high school (I included Linear Algebra because the regular class is a joke frankly. It’s literally Pre-Calc revisited. You won’t be learning Galois theory and all that random mumbo jumbo in this class)
Anyways, like the above guy said, in college, ur grade depends solely on your professor.
Some professors give 7% As. (the very rare type and apparently I got those 2 semesters in a row :l )
Others give 37% As.
Make sure to check ratemyprofessor as at least for me, that was the most trustworthy site!
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And oh ya, in college, 3 exams in a class can screw your GPA. Bomb one and you pretty much have no hope to get an A. <i had="" professors="" that="" hadn’t="" been="" rated="" who="" was="" teaching="" undergrad="" for="" the="" first="" time="" after="" graduating="" from="" uchicago="" princeton="" ut="" austin="" math="" so…ya,="" they="" high="" expectations="" :l="">
And like I said, AP Calc BC is probably the only AP I know of that actually has more contents than an average Calc 1 and 2 college course.
So hey, if you breezed through AP Calc BC, you are more than ready for college!
The average college workload is legit an hour and a half a week for an A. And for those “weeder classes” (science/math/eng), it’s seriously two to three hours a week for an A.
I don’t know about you but I never understood how two hours a week was too much for undergrads to handle.
I understand in middle/high school most students never had homework above two minutes a day but seriously…this is college. I was actually a bit disappointed by the workload.
All that complaints of how engineering/math/science was impossible are usually people who are unproductive.
Anyways, don’t fret too much. College isn’t too much difficult from high school. Just make sure your priority is straight and you don’t party all semester until the night before an exam.
That’s what screws everyone up first year. And oh ya, if you are smart enough to do Calc BC in high school, I can warrant you, you are probably one of the top students in your Calc 2 classes already…
Students who finished Calc BC usually don’t bother with Calc 2 as they would rather get the credits so you will be competing mostly with students who struggled in AP Calc AB.
Just make sure you don’t study only 5 minutes a day in college. Even an hour a day can give you an A (as long as your schedule isn’t overworked like mine in which case, ya…you would be studying around 10-14 hours a day outside class for that 4.0 :l)
AccCreate, thank you for such a detailed explanation! I really appreciate it! Do you remember how Discrete math is? Will it make the same parts of my brain hurt as Calc 2 will, or are they pretty different? I’ve literally never heard of discrete math before this so I’m not quite sure what to expect. The course description is: Includes sets and sequences, elementary logic, relations, induction, counting principles, discrete probability, Boolean algebra, logic networks, matrices, graph theory, and trees. Applies these topics to real life and branches of science, particularly computer science. The prereq is Pre-Calc so yeah
Regarding three versus four classes, you mentioned some California public schools in other posts, so the normal course load should be 15 credit units. This is more likely to be closer to four classes than three classes, unless you are taking three 5-unit classes. People can give you more specific suggestions if you name your school (CSUMB?).
Regarding what calculus course to take, try your school’s old final exams for calculus 1 and 2 to check your knowledge to see what you can safely skip with your 5 on calculus BC. For example, if your school actually is CSUMB, then you can look at:
http://math.otterlabs.org/math150/files/math150_final_rev.pdf (calculus 1)
http://math.otterlabs.org/math151/files/math151_final_rev.pdf (calculus 2)
Discrete math is rather different from calculus. In some schools, it also includes introduction to logic and proof techniques that you will find necessary in more advanced math courses like abstract algebra and real analysis.
Discrete Math difficulty… depends but…
if your school (CSUMB?) follows this curriculum:
https://csumb.edu/sites/default/files/images/st-block-11-1423765811785-raw-math170syllabusf14common.pdf
Week 1: 15 minutes
Week 2: 20 minutes
Week 3: 35 minutes
Week 4: 1 hour and a half
Week 5: Well…exam weeks are one of those weeks where you should study endlessly as that’s your grade … (but I don’t really see what you should be studying as you didn’t learn much…)
Week 6: 2 hour and half (induction can rather be confusing when you first learn)
Week 7: 2 hour and a quarter
Week 8: 2 hour and a quarter (pidgeonhole principle! The most cool sounding principle in Intro Discrete Math class that practically doesn’t mean anything special -though it has good applications-) <= makes you feel smart hahahha ^^
Week 9: 2 hour
Week 10: Exam weeks … you should be studying endlessly but … you should already know all the contents since you weren’t procastinating… <those people=“” who=“” study=“” a=“” lot=“” during=“” exam=“” weeks=“” are=“” crammers.=“” you=“” can=“” see=“” this=“” is=“” perfectly=“” do-able=“” as=“” it’s=“” only=“” like=“” 10=“” hours=“” on=“” the=“” spot=“” from=“” week=“” 6…=“”>
Week 11: 1 hour
Week 12: 30 minutes
Week 13: 1 hour
Week 14: Hey, NOTHING. But if you are lazy guy, you can shift Week 11, 12, 13 to 0 minutes and all here in this break 
Week 15: 45 minutes
Week 16 and 17 : Ehh…study your finals…Probably a good 6 hours
Well…this is my guesstimate. I don’t know how good you are at math but in average…I expect this should be enough to get an A.
If you look closely, you can see that technically …
Right before Exam 1… you can cram Week 1 to Week 4’s worth
Right before Exam 2… you can cram Week 6 to Week 9’s worth
Right before Final… you can cram from Week 1 to Week 15.
Mainly this is why college students in the start struggle to adapt. Procastination is a scary thing…
But hey, if your consistent with 2 hours a week… I can warrant you with this schedule, you won’t face much difficulties.
And oh ya…most of your time doesn’t go to studying these chapters. For chapters… it’s pretty damn short. Now, a big signficiant chunk of your time will go to your projects. I expect each projects in this curriculum to take A HUGE CHUNK of time. A huge… I mean like a 4-6 day continuous no life adventure per project (debugging is rather annoying… and looking for small errors -.-)
** but it’s only 3 times in the whole semester so don’t fret much. It’s a nice experience~
**
Note:
I made these guesses thinking you attend CSUMB. If you are attending places like CMU or places known for unnecessary rigor… hahahhaa, good bye social life.
Expect solid 3 hours a day PER class you had that day. (meaning => no social life if you want a 4.0 all 4 years which is unhealthy and completely unnecessary if you are taking challenging courses and expecting to top out)
The nominal amount of time commitment for your classes is 3 hours per week per credit unit. So a 15 unit course load that will get you 120 units in 8 semesters (the number needed to graduate at CSUMB) nominally takes 45 hours per week, including both class time and out-of-class time (reading, doing assignments and projects, etc.). Note that this approximates what someone with a full time job will spend on work and related (e.g. commuting) activities. So there is still room for social life around that.
Actual workloads are likely lower these days, especially if your major does not have many (or any) courses with labs, computer programming, term projects, art studio, or music performance.
I always thought 3 hours per week per credit unit was complete nonsense.
I can’t imagine how in especially the intro chapters of intro to Discrete Math, you would need to spend 9 hours per week.
Conjunctions, negations, disjunctions, etc. etc. are pretty straightforward and making truth tables isn’t a ground shaking event.
Maybe I am wrong but for me, it took me less than 15 minutes to learn truth tables (and colleges usually teach this for two weeks). All you do is write Ts and Fs.
Now proofs I could somewhat understand but in Intro to Discrete Math classes, the proofs really aren’t that difficult. You would be proving even numbers, etc. etc. and its at the very last chapters you tap a bit about combinatorical proofs (which are confusing)… and then you end
I feel the 3 hours per week per credit holds more true for third and fourth year classes (though I might argue some are much less and some are much more).
Freshman classes aren’t that rigorous. It truly isn’t in most colleges in US (note: some schools are extremely challenging but that’s the minority of colleges for freshmen).
I feel it’s better to expect at most 1.25 hours per week per credit unit for most freshmen (and I feel even that is more than necessary). Maybe it’s cause of the recent inflation issue in the academia, but I surely know 3 hours per week per credit is more than much in most colleges for freshmen.
And oh ya, it’s not the studying that is troubling in this class. It is most likely going to be your projects. Group projects end up being mostly all 1 person’s work at the end of the day and you should expect it to be you…
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3 hours per week per credit unit was probably realistic back in the 1960s. But changes since then have made it easier to get the same work done in less time.
For example, a 1960s student have had to go to a library to thumb through the card catalog to find out what books may have the needed information, then look through the stacks to see if the books were available, then wait for checked out books to come back, then read much of the books to see if the books actually had the needed information. Today, a student may do a quick web search that indicates what books may have the needed information (often with digitized previews or otherwise more information than just the author and title to indicate how likely it has the needed information), then find out whether it is in the library before going there. Of course, the book can always be ordered on-line if it is not available in the library or local book stores.
Math is probably a lower workload major than most others, although it can be intellectually demanding for many when taking courses with proof writing.
I actually disagree with ucbalumnus with math being a lower workload major than most others.
Math after linear algebra and diff eq takes a radical turn and many math majors will agree or at least make a solid claim that Honors Algebra or Honors Analysis sequence is some of the hardest classes both intellectually and workload wise in undergrad.
I personally think math is far from a lower workload major. In fact, I believe pure math is one of the hardest majors in undergrad (both in workload and intellectually demanding). Of course difficulty is relative but…
trust me, math is far from lower workload. Being in a curve against students who chew math for breakfast is… daunting (and rewarding).
Pure math majors planning to work in the academia from what I experienced studies from 7:45 am (class) to many time 5 am during the weekdays because unlike engineering, pure math jobs are ONLY academia route and pure math grad is extremely competitive… you are versin against freaks who finished college work in like age 15…
If there are 10 phd, only 1 will get the chance to be professor but… if there are 10 engineering grads, 9 will get jobs… pure math encompasses different type of students. Students desperate for that small job in academia… and your grades are curved from students with those mentality,
Anyways, sorry for going off topic. Just thought it was worth mentioning.