<p>Hi, I'm going to be a freshman for the fall 2007 term in the Honors program in LSA. I took AP AB Calc in High School, and I'm pretty sure I got a 4 or a 5 on the test. I'm assuming that Calc II is the right class for me and since I'm in the honors program I was going to take Honors Calc II(Math 186), which is only offered in the winter. Now I was informed that Applied Honors Calc II, which is offered in the fall is basically the same class, however I had already worked out my fall schedule to not include a math class and I don't want to rearrange it. </p>
<p>I was content with my choice but my advisor said some people who didn't take Honors Calc I had trouble with HCII because of the more theoretical aspects that are in the honors classes. Also both here and elsewhere everyone seems to freak out about Calculus at the U of M. Combined those things make want to seek out some advice about what to do. I'm undecided for a major but the most math-heavy thing I'm considering is Economics. However regardless of my major I would like to continue to take math until I consider it too difficult to be worthwhile. So do you think I'll have trouble with HCII, should I switch to normal Calc II(is that even easier?), try to work in Applied HCII(again is that easier?), or depending on my AP score should I even consider just taking some form of Calc I again? </p>
<p>Ignore what your advisor said, they tend to give the worst possible advice for math classes. I honestly think people need to start going back to their advisors and telling them how wrong they were so maybe things will improve.</p>
<p>Congrats on the honors program. AB Calc is nothing really compared to Calc 1 at Umich in my opinion. Calc 2 is known as one of the toughest courses at the university. People freak out about calc for a reason. You need some solid calc for econ major, but it's nothing too hard really. I would just take calc 1 again, you don't want your first term at Umich to be hell, enjoy it. The calc one program here was a terrible experience for just about everyone I know, if you want more info, pm me.</p>
<p>And I agree with dilksy, don't listen to your advisors, listen to your upperclassmen friends and some people on cc.</p>
<p>Take honors applied calc 2 (156). I havent heard much about 186, but applied honors calculus courses have WAY inflated grades. I think almost everyone in the class gets and A or B. I remember on the final, they give you like a 120 point test, and only grade it out of 100, so theres like extra credit. Also, they give review sheets for the tests with nearly identical problems. </p>
<p>Also, regular calc 2 is impossible from what i hear.</p>
<p>Technically yes, but you'll probably fail Econ 401 at least once and struggle greatly. They only required Calc I because Econ majors complain about how they can't do math, without realizing that's basically what economics is.</p>
<p>Anyone tried taking the CSP CalcI or Honors Calc I? I really don't want completely bad experience with Calc I...ugh. Wish I'd taken more math in high school.</p>
<p>Take applied Applied Honors Calc II. I took it and got an A. Grades are way inflated, class is pretty easy. The final had 220 points, I got like 216 or something. (20 of those were bonus? My instructor did write in a recommendation letter that I had a perfect score on the exam). For the exams, they give you a huge review sheet with a bunch of problems, and the problems found on the final are all identical to ones on the review sheet with changed numbers. You get a study sheet, so the ones you don't know, write out the work for the problem on the sheet. When you are doing the exam and see something questionable, just look at your review sheet and you have the problem right there.</p>
<p>If you can, get Daihai He for this class. He is a really nice guy, and he really tries to help students out. He wrote up like 50 pages of solutions for the exam review problems. Since I wrote his work down on my study sheet, it was almost impossible for me to mess things up.</p>
<p>CSP is a really great class. The teachers are very demanding, but know exactly how to study for the exam. You have an extra class a week and about 5 times the amount of work, but it's worth it. Be prepared to work hard.</p>
<p>Wait. CSP is more work? I thought it was supposed to help students from humble educational backgrounds transition into the University well. Five times the amount of work in the school's most notorious class doesn't seem like a smooth transition...at all.</p>
<p>Is CSP harder or just more work? Are the teachers at least, better? Are the median grades higher?</p>
<p>I came from a very humbled background. It is more work to force you to study. Through doing required homework, whereas regular sections don't even have homework. And much longer and frequent quizzes, you master the material. Median grades are much higher. It is more work and thus, harder. The teachers are actual professors rather than GSI's, which is a great benefit. Good Luck trying to get into the class if you aren't in the CSP program, spots fill up very quickly and they will kick you out if you don't do work. It is well worth it if you didn't come from a stellar high school.</p>
<p>I'm not in the program, but I was told I can join. I'm not sure why I wasn't in Summer Bridge, my background is really humble, and I need that course.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the advice so far, I have a few follow up questions. Does anyone know if AHCII is actually significantly different from HCII? At the honors peer advising session during orientation they had a math guy come in and explain the different math tracks. According to him AHCII was completely different from HCII, however afterwords the peer advisors told me that they are planning to make AHCII more applied but as of right now its almost the exact same as regular HCII. </p>
<p>I would just follow everyone here's advice and take AHCII, but it's not offered in the Winter and I'm happy with my fall schedule as it currently is and would rather not change it. Also Meteorain007 do you know the reason that regular Calc II is supposed to be impossible?</p>
<p>Its not necessarily impossible per say, but I have heard many terrible things about it. First off, there are a lot of people taking regular calc 2, which means that the class is curved, usually with the median being a C+/B- (i think). This makes the class harder in a way since you are pretty much competing with other students. Also, from what I heard, the tests last year were so hard that they had to fire the test writer. The class can go either way, but i recommend you take honors applied because its taught be professors and not by GSIs with terrible accents. If you are inherently good at math, then calc 2 might not be too difficult, but if you usually rely on good instruction, you are out of luck. I know a couple people who got A's in regular calc 2. I also know someone who got a C, and that person got a 5 on AP Calc AB, so it can go either way.</p>
<p>I'm pretty good at math, I really think that as long as I do all the problem sets and keep up that I can succeed in any math class. It seems like Applied Honors is the way to go...but I really don't want to change my schedule.</p>
<p>after reading this, I'm considering switching into AHCII. It will screw up my schedule to where I don't have Fridays off anymore, but if it'll help my GPA in the long run, I think it's well worth it.</p>
<p>keep in mind that AHCII will not be necessarily easy, just easier. If you have a good understanding in calculus and you can learn it pretty quickly and thoroughly, you should be fine. AHCII is quite a bit of work. The problems sets can be quite long, and its mandatory (As opposed to regular calc II where there pretty much isn't ANY homework thats graded). I think its good to have graded homework, so the tests aren't the only deciding factors of your grade. </p>
<p>If you take AHCII, be prepared to work. You still have to earn your A, but hard work will get you there.</p>
<p>I'm kind of relieved to hear that the homework is mandatory. Otherwise I foresee myself putting it off again and again, until it's the day before the exam and I need to learn half the book.</p>
<p>I know plenty of people who got 5's on BC calc and went on to take calc 3. When you come to Michigan, you realize that AP calc was a joke. It doesnt prepared you much for college math. I got a 5 in AB and calc 2 was tough. My friends who started with calc 3 said it was difficult either. Its not impossible, but its not going to be like your high school calc class.</p>