Well said @Snowball City
Well I’ll be moving from CA to New England or WA for college so I’ll definitely be getting to know people with different viewpoints!
I agree also @“Snowball City” , but it goes both ways. We are not necessarily the land of fruits and nuts the rest of the country perceives us to be. We are an enourmous and very diverse state. We are not being spoon fed some conservative phobic ideology like some on this thread have suggested. Our kids are reacting to what is going on in the world right now, and we as a country still have a long way to go.
I live in purple Colorado (but very blue Denver) and have also heard the “no red states” line from college-bound high schoolers looking at out of state colleges. It’s very much a concern among the more politically oriented students. Ironically enough, among the most vocal critics were people who grew up/spent a lot of time in the South. They’re among the most vehement that if you’re a liberal, you will hate such-and-such place.
Plenty of fear mongering stuff (including things that fall into a “textbook definition of a racist comment”) comes out of the mouths of prominent conservatives that members of the targeted groups do not need any left-leaning editorializing to be concerned about such attitudes among supporters of such.
@socalmom007 Is right. And if you are the type of person to say the CA education system spoon feeds hatred of conservatives then what about areas in the deep south? I’m sure they’re equally as likely to be spoon feeding hatred of “liberal” ideologies. I follow a few atheist facebook pages and I see a lot of articles about how schools try to punish students who they perceive as being “un-American” because they won’t stand up for the pledge for example. That happens everywhere of course, but less so in New England and the West Coast. It goes both ways.
"@Jliu32472 Red herring much? I didn’t see anybody recently discussing what you’re arguing about. But I’ll bite and respond to one of your points. Any conservative, who is a conservative because of things in the bible is just a sexist. That point simply cannot be argued. I may be atheist but I’ve read the bible cover to cover and oh boy there is some messed up sexist and racist stuff in there.
In a country where transgender people are still attacked, where POC/middle eastern immigrants are discriminated against, it helps to be in a larger city where there are more people like yourself. Saying people are going “overboard” is not really relevant unless somebody is saying “Everybody besides CA residents is backwards” which nobody is saying, btw."
Actually since you are new to this thread, I would advise either going through all the posts or rereading them.
Saying that any conservative that believes in some values from the Bible is a sexist, is bigoted. Sorry I’m just calling it as I see it. Btw, I’m also an atheist so don’t throw me into the evangelical pool.
This thread has devolved into a political thread so I’m going to bow out (I’m guilty of helping this thread get derailed as well). Anyone have something to say to me can take it to PM.
Hopefully this thread can get back on track.
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I think it rather obtuse to make generalizations about California and where the kids go to school. I would venture a guess there is as much prejudice toward California as the reverse.
I come from a rather large family, born and raised in NY. We now live in the four corners of the country, all in states connected to an ocean. We can’t picture ourselves living in a part of the country that is landlocked. People want to be in places they find the most comfortable. Sometimes this means a liberal or conservative atmosphere and sometimes it is really only means they like the weather, the terrain and the activities available. How silly to point fingers indiscriminately.
Here’s Chicago. Just because you’re not on an ocean, it doesn’t mean you are landlocked. https://www.google.com/search?q=northwestern+university&client=ms-android-sprint-mvno-us&prmd=mniv&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiQ-Zi9p-_SAhUHeCYKHaVPCkIQ_AUICigD&biw=320&bih=440#tbm=isch&q=northwestern+university+campus&*&imgrc=9MBIpEsEI9rVuM:
I mean you can’t beat in state tuition at some of the top universities in the country. Also as far as name recognition goes it is hard to beat UCs especially but also CSUs. I am a transfer student which made it even more affordable and transferring to a UC or CSU in California is way more simple than finding specific private school requirements. I spend exactly two years at a JC and now am finishing up my last quarter at UCSC and will graduate next year!
I can certainly understand people like to stay in their comfort zone for college, but it is worth point out that there are many places in their comfort zone, and their home zone may not be as comforting as they think. Houston had a gay mayor for 12 years, and is probably considerably more liberal than, say, Orange County. And lots and lots of Californians support the current President. It simply isn’t the case that California votes 90% liberal and Texas 90% conservative-at all. In both states, about 40% of the population prefer the “other” candidate, whichever that is. But stereotypes are deeply ingrained, I’ve learned, and it can be easier to hide in one’s bubble.
With a very large % of Calif students qualifying for Cal Grants (free tuition) why go elsewhere? That said, many do go OOS. There’s over 1000 Calif students at Alabama alone.
However, it is certainly possible that California students who go to Alabama or other out-of-state schools may differ demographically from the overall demographics of California students. For example, those going to Alabama may have either high income/wealth parents willing to pay, or stats high enough to earn the large merit scholarships there. The distribution of race/ethnicity may also be different, for reasons noted previously.
@UCSColive In my part of the country, the UCs and CSs are just state schools. People may have heard of Berkeley and UCLA but the first is for “hippies” and the second is for sports.
edited to add: congrats on your upcoming graduation
Middle class with high stat child. From the U.K. but Cal resident for 12 years. We found that even at our college prep high school, the only advice was aimed at how to apply to Cal colleges. If you couldn’t afford a UC then go to a local CC and transfer for the last 2 years. Our advisor never mentioned OOS except to say it would be cost prohibitive.
From our own research and feedback from friends, the UC’s are all ridiculously impacted. Cost a fortune, Their accommodation is poor ( several are forcing freshman into triples for the first year) and have high ratings mainly due to their research and post grad work. Our son was also put off by their liberal leanings but that was his personal choice
We searched OOS out of desperation more than anything as we have too many kids to have saved large college funds. We also couldn’t quite fathom how any college was worth a hundred grand of debt.
Yes we are lucky that we have a high stat kid but with all our other children we will be looking OOS as well. There are great colleges and great deals to be had as long as you have an open mind regarding distance from home.
One last thing to mention is that in our experience, Californians tend to have a bit of a superiority complex regarding the schools and Cal education system. I think that is evident from the advice given to students ( in our case anyway) and hence would put off some parents and kids from looking OOS, even if it would be financially beneficial to them if they did.
For full disclosure our eldest is currently a freshman at Bama getting what is more or less a full ride scholarship to study engineering. I would challenge anyone to suggest how he would be better off going to UCLA and graduating $100K in debt
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For example, those going to Alabama may have either high income/wealth parents willing to pay, or stats high enough to earn the large merit scholarships there.
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True. And also true for why some Calif kids go OOS to other schools. Many Calif kids don’t have the stats to get into the full need schools OOS. Those going OOS are elite in some manner. Someone with a 3.2 GPA and a 25 ACT can get free tuition and more at UCR or UCM, but likely won’t get anything like that going OOS to a similarly ranked school.
(It may be somewhat hard to get into UCR with a 3.2 HS GPA.)
Seems like we agree that it should not be surprising that most college-bound CA students look first to UCs and CSUs, with only small segments finding out-of-state public schools attractive relative to UCs and CSUs.
Basically, we can see the following groups of CA students:
A. Low-and-middle-income-parents students will get good FA from UCs and local CSUs. These students, who are probably the great majority of college bound students in CA, will have UCs and local CSUs as their baseline. The small number of them with the highest stats can find merit at out-of-state public schools.
B. High-income-parents-who-will-pay-UC-or-CSU-costs students will likewise have UCs and CSUs as their baseline. The small number of them with the highest stats can find merit at out-of-state public schools. The small number of them with the highest income parents can attend out-of-state public schools at list price.
C. High-income-parents-who-will-not-pay-UC-or-CSU-costs students will look to cost-reduced ways, such as commuting to a local CSU, or starting at a community college and then transferring to a local CSU. The small number of them with the highest stats can find merit at out-of-state public schools. The latter may be particularly motivated to seek out attend such schools, because even a less selective flagship like Alabama may seem more attractive than the local commuter-based CSU or community college.
Of course, these forums are populated heavily by high stats students and high income parents (including both those who will pay a lot and those who will not). So a sample using forum posters may be very unrepresentative of the overall situation of college-bound CA high school seniors.
The race/ethnicity situation may be another deterrent for the large number of Latino and Asian students from CA, even if they are in the parental income and stats categories that otherwise make looking out-of-state attractive. Even without considering what some people interpret as a greater likelihood of encountering hostility against their race/ethnicity, it is likely that at least some Latino and Asian students find a school with 4% Latino and 1% Asian students (e.g. Alabama) to be about as (un)attractive as some white students find a school with 6% white students (e.g. Florida A&M).
@ucbalumnus I agree. Although I would say that middle income in Cal is in no way sufficient to pay the cost of a UC education. We got zero financial aid other that federal loans and like most other families in our area, have no way of covering the remaining cost. I would suggest you have to be wealthy or poor to consider the UC’s which is a shame. Not necessarily wrong as I have no expectations about the state paying for my son’s education. It’s just a shame as we live here, but have to consider OOS as our only viable alternative to CC.
^^ This. We are middle class enough to be full pay at the UCs and can’t afford them.