<p>Last day to decide: Caltech or UVa with in-state Echols?</p>
<p>I like the atmosphere at Caltech a lot more (very smart students, noncompetitive, friendly professors, etc.) and definitely see myself in some kind of science. But Caltech is on the other side of North America and there is the price factor. My parents can afford it, but it will leave me nothing for after college...</p>
<p>UVa is, well...UVa. I got Echols, CSS and all that. Tuition is in-state, so I will have something left afterward for grad school and beyond. But the atmosphere is less intellectual, more competitive, and I loose Echols if I switch from a pure science to something more applied like chem. engineering, as I very well may. On the other side, I could easily get a very high GPA at UVa, whereas Caltech has no grade inflation.</p>
<p>I will definitely pursue a Ph.D after college, so I want the college which will get me better odds at a top grad school. Im thinking that going to Caltech as an undergrad would help me get into Caltech for grad school, at least. Right ?</p>
<p>Finally, half my high school (yes, TJ) goes to UVa. Im still not too sure how that would affect me, but people say it will.</p>
<p>Any thoughts on the subject are greatly appreciated.</p>
<p>The fact that UVA is considered "TJ 2" by some of the people that go there puts me off. And it's clear that you like CalTech more. See if it's possible to get past the practical concerns and go where you like.</p>
<p>What do you guys think of my grad school prospects at the respective schools? The way I figure it, better undergrad --> better grad school --> better job --> more money. Caltech should pay itself off, right? It's only $100k more than UVa for 4 years...</p>
<p>Then again there's the school of thought that says that standing out at a state school is better than being average in a really good school. Is there any truth in that?</p>
<p>P.S. Yes, I've read lots of threads on this debate; I'm asking for the general consensus, if there is one.</p>
<p>your grad school prospects will be about the same.</p>
<p>I know you went to "tj" and you think you're smarter than everyone/uva is beneath you, but don't think just because you're going to UVa means you're going to stand out. You could very well be middle of the pack here to. </p>
<p>Unless you do some ridiculous research project or internship at caltech (or uva for that matter) you should be about the same.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Im thinking that going to Caltech as an undergrad would help me get into Caltech for grad school, at least. Right ?
[/quote]
This is usually not the case. In science fields it is very much frowned upon going to the same school for undergrad and grad. Nevertheless, Caltech will help you get into different great grad schools with it's 35 percent PhD rate in science/math/engineering.</p>
<p>So long as your parents have money for your undergrad, I'd really say go for Caltech if you feel it fits you - you really can't do any better in terms of science education. The classes are top level - you'll learn an amazing amount. The research opportunities are both significant and abundant. Besides, you get to be around and collaborate with some pretty smart kids.</p>
<p>Remember that Caltech does offer upper class merit scholarships to about 10 percent of its students (1 year, renewable scholarships for 3/4 tuition to full tuition, room/board, fees), and so if you excel, you could still come out with a nice chunk of change, which is even better incentive for you to excel.</p>
<p>Echols is the top ~5% of the incoming UVa class. I dont mean to sound arrogant, but I think that says something about me.</p>
<p>I have no idea where I would fit in the rankings. According to Fiske, many people think they are at the top of the class but aren't even close. I don't think I am (comparing my GPA and SAT I-s with those of other alumni), so I won't count on any kind of merit-based stuff. I do have chemistry well under my belt, though.</p>
<p>I never heard about that, cghen. I always assumed that since grad school is more important that undergrad, it doesnt particularly matter where you go to for undergrad.</p>