<p>A few smart people does not make up for millions of stupid ones. America has some of the greatest minds in the world (not all home grown, but they come here) and some of the stupidest people too.</p>
<p>This is like Jay-Walking.</p>
<p>qwilde,</p>
<p>
[quote]
This is the cavalier “holier than thou” American attitude I detest. Evidently, you believe all Americans are superior, intellectually and otherwise, to every other person in the world. If an American is dumb, than a European or a member of any nation other than America has to be even dumber.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I don't think that the post you responded to really demonstrates that sort of attitude. I think, if anything, it was merely a reaction to the adamant claim that Americans are, on average, stupider than group X. The point was to demonstrate how silly the claim is to begin with, and how easily it can be applied to other groups.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Why I call Americans dumb-this is probably leading to the misunderstanding as I do not mean intellectually inferior simply uninformed- however, is because they often know little of the world beyond them. If it doesn’t pertain to them, they probably know little about it. If Americans want to interfere with worldly affairs then they should learn a little about the world before they do so.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Uninformed is such a subjective term. </p>
<p>One of the measures that I commonly see supposedly demonstrating American ignorance is the lack of bilingualism in the US contrasted to bilingualism in Europe.</p>
<p>What's often ignored, however, is what the second language spoken in Europe commonly is: English. Britons, interestingly enough, aren't exactly known for rampant bilingualism either. This, many suggest, is because native English speakers are less likely to see the utility of a second language when English is the lingua franca of the world.</p>
<p>Some would deem that ignorance or closed-mindedness. I call it a rational decision based on the fact that time is scarce and there may be better things to devote 150+ hours of one's life to learning.</p>
<p>Another commonly touted measure of American ignorance is how little Americans know about geography. I'll grant that one. However, I do believe that a caveat is necessary: America is a country the size of pretty much all of Western Europe. On the other side of an ocean. With two large countries on its borders.</p>
<p>It's no wonder that Americans are less savvy about where Belgrade is: it's very far removed. </p>
<p>And your second claim is just kind of silly. American voters aren't making policy-- politicians and career bureaucrats are. Delegation of authority, in theory, removes the issues of lack of knowledge by giving decision making power to someone who specializes in that area. Why should you know as much about Japanese security policy as I do unless you actually work in the field?</p>
<p>
[quote]
Half of my sister’s class didn’t know where Italy was and a few even thought it was a state. Practically, no one had heard of the U.K. even though every student had heard of London. People routinely ask me if we having electricity and running water in England…and they are not jesting.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>What age? What education level? Location?</p>
<p>I honestly find this very hard to believe. Very.</p>
<p>“And your second claim is just kind of silly. American voters aren't making policy-- politicians and career bureaucrats are. Delegation of authority, in theory, removes the issues of lack of knowledge by giving decision making power to someone who specializes in that area. Why should you know as much about Japanese security policy as I do unless you actually work in the field?”</p>
<p>Yes, but Americans vote for politicians. Only idiots elect idiots.</p>
<p>American legislators know little of the region they have sent their troops to die in and yet they are permitted to make such egregious decisions. I find that troubling, especially since many don’t know what they are actually dying for…I would have experience with this too, as my step dad is American military.</p>
<p>“One of the measures that I commonly see supposedly demonstrating American ignorance is the lack of bilingualism in the US contrasted to bilingualism in Europe.</p>
<p>What's often ignored, however, is what the second language spoken in Europe commonly is: English. Britons, interestingly enough, aren't exactly known for rampant bilingualism either.”</p>
<p>You are right; we are more known for trilingualism. No, actually, you are entirely wrong. Maybe you shouldn’t make sweeping statements regarding matters you know nothing of (unless of course you have been exposed to British people for eleven years as I have Americans). English schools require a fluency in a foreign language to graduate. My mum speaks German, my dad and aunts speak French, and my great uncle speaks a multitude of languages. </p>
<p>“This, many suggest, is because native English speakers are less likely to see the utility of a second language when English is the lingua franca of the world.”</p>
<p>Yes, the English language; not the American language. And there is more to learning a language than just practicality; I thought living in a liberal arts focused country you would at least understand that. </p>
<p>“Some would deem that ignorance or closed-mindedness. I call it a rational decision based on the fact that time is scarce and there may be better things to devote 150+ hours of one's life to learning.”</p>
<p>I call it xenophobia.</p>
<p>“Another commonly touted measure of American ignorance is how little Americans know about geography. I'll grant that one. However, I do believe that a caveat is necessary: America is a country the size of pretty much all of Western Europe. On the other side of an ocean. With two large countries on its borders.”</p>
<p>I suppose the Russians shouldn’t bother to learn of any other countries and cultures then? It is our civic duty, as citizens of the world to know our world, and especially if you are an American because you enjoy invading so much of it. </p>
<p>Also I, a European, know all the American states and countries, all the European countries, all Asian countries, and most African countries. It’s a matter of interest; most are merely apathetic.</p>
<p>“It's no wonder that Americans are less savvy about where Belgrade is: it's very far removed.”</p>
<p>So, we should only learn of conterminous countries?</p>
<p>Even if America invaded Serbia, few would know little about it, including American legislators.</p>
<p>“may be better things to devote 150+ hours of one's life to learning.”</p>
<p>It may seem a waste to you, but some actually enjoy learning.</p>
<p>“What age? What education level? Location?”</p>
<p>They were sophomores and juniors and we are of course in the South.</p>
<p>"I honestly find this very hard to believe. Very."</p>
<p>So, do I.</p>
<p>I suggest you shed yourself of your patriotic blind sightedness and asses America in an objective fashion.</p>
<p>I’m not really defending the Brits or the Europeans, as I swear allegiance to no country; I am merely vexed with the American opinion that Americans are superior to everyone, which is if you want to know why you are so despised globally.</p>
<p>Within the next forty years, I doubt America will even be the greatest superpower, which is what you pride yourself on so much.</p>
<p>qwilde,</p>
<p>Since bush took the Old Old SAT (the pre 2400, pre-1974 revised 1600 SAT) 1206 is equivalent to about 129.</p>
<p>as you can see, a 1201 on the old old SAT would give you a 129 IQ and a 1221 would give you a 130 IQ.</p>
<p>Pedantic are we? </p>
<p>“If Bush could score in the top 16 percent of college applicants on the SAT, he would almost certainly rank higher on tests of general intelligence, which are normed with reference to the general population. But even if his rank remained constant at the 84th-percentile level of his SAT score, it would translate to an IQ score of 115.”</p>
<p>this video is obviously fake. anyone who went to the <a href="http://www.cnnnn.com%5B/url%5D">www.cnnnn.com</a> website would've known this.</p>
<p>No, cnnn is a company that mocks and satirizes american broadcasting companies.</p>
<p>Who cares if that it was a fake news report? They just showed several people who think that Australia was Iran, France, and North Korea. And since when is the Berlin Wall in Israel? If I asked you what religion BUDDHIST monks are, I sure hope your intelligent enough to realize that I just gave you the answer.</p>
<p>That whole video was completely fake it's a wonder that whatever country they picked to invade that was actually Australia? Did they have a map prepared for every country the could've picked then shown them the map? Or was the whole thing including the people they were asking staged?</p>
<p>This survey is biased because of undercoverage.</p>
<p>
[quote]
You are right; we are more known for trilingualism. No, actually, you are entirely wrong. Maybe you shouldn’t make sweeping statements regarding matters you know nothing of (unless of course you have been exposed to British people for eleven years as I have Americans). English schools require a fluency in a foreign language to graduate. My mum speaks German, my dad and aunts speak French, and my great uncle speaks a multitude of languages.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Do tell, then, why the European Commission found that only 30% of Britons can converse in a language other than English? Furthermore, did you not know that in 2004 English schools made a foreign language optional for someone older than 14?</p>
<p>Your mum and uncle and best friend are NOT a representative sample of the UK.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Yes, the English language; not the American language. And there is more to learning a language than just practicality; I thought living in a liberal arts focused country you would at least understand that.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>English vs. "the American language?" Wow, now you're just playing silly silly semantics that don't even exist.</p>
<p>I suppose that Australians speak Australian now?</p>
<p>
[quote]
I call it xenophobia.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Why is choosing to spend time on something else xenophobic? If you find that you can maximize your time with another venture, it's xenophobic? </p>
<p>Sheesh.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I suppose the Russians shouldn’t bother to learn of any other countries and cultures then? It is our civic duty, as citizens of the world to know our world, and especially if you are an American because you enjoy invading so much of it.</p>
<p>Also I, a European, know all the American states and countries, all the European countries, all Asian countries, and most African countries. It’s a matter of interest; most are merely apathetic.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>And you, "a European" are a representative sample of all of the EU? </p>
<p>It's interesting that you bring up the "invasion" part. Many IR scholars argued that Europe would be less sympathetic to American aims after the Soviet threat was gone. I suppose you're an example of such.</p>
<p>
[quote]
So, we should only learn of conterminous countries?</p>
<p>Even if America invaded Serbia, few would know little about it, including American legislators.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I bet that those in the State Dept. who work on that part of Europe know more about it than you're willing to give credit. You think that the average Labour or Tory backbencher knows much about Serbia? How about the average Australian legislator?</p>
<p>
[quote]
It may seem a waste to you, but some actually enjoy learning.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Don't even start with me. I love learning, but tell me something: where do I get the time to learn another language when I have to devote 5 hours a day to my current studies? I'm to be damned for being busy?</p>
<p>I wonder how many Europeans would be tri or multilingual if they learned Japanese and Chinese instead of closely related languages.</p>
<p>
[quote]
suggest you shed yourself of your patriotic blind sightedness and asses America in an objective fashion.</p>
<p>I’m not really defending the Brits or the Europeans, as I swear allegiance to no country; I am merely vexed with the American opinion that Americans are superior to everyone, which is if you want to know why you are so despised globally.</p>
<p>Within the next forty years, I doubt America will even be the greatest superpower, which is what you pride yourself on so much.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>My blind patriotism? This is why I spend so much time abroad? Why I regularly write on faults with our foreign policy? Why I thought this current war was a mistake to begin with?</p>
<p>I have criticisms. But I also think that many Europeans can't see the trees for the forest.</p>
<p>I don't think that Americans are superior to everyone, and I don't think anyone even argued that. You came out of the gates with your fists flying, and then got mad at us for asking you to stop.</p>
<p>This is a real network:
<a href="http://www.cnnnn.com/%5B/url%5D">http://www.cnnnn.com/</a>
It seems to be a an Australian joke network.</p>
<p>America recently defeated the UK in the first Geography Cup (<a href="http://www.geographycup.com%5B/url%5D">www.geographycup.com</a>) so it seems Americans aren't as dumb as portrayed in the video, at least in terms of geography. Of course, that isn't a scientific measurement...</p>
<p>(The following is just one Brazilian's opinion...)</p>
<p>Last summer when I was studying in France I had a conversation with a Brazilian college student. Throughout our conversation he kept asking me in disbelief, "You're really an American?" He stressed that I "don't seem like an American at all" and that I'm "nothing like a typical American" because I "know so much about the rest of the world" and I "enjoy talking about world events." (He spoke from his experience as an exchange student in the US.)</p>
<p>I'm hardly saying these were unbiased conclusions that he arrived at through the application of scientific method--he later asked me to go out to a bar with him, so maybe he was just trying to butter me up--but it might prove to be a fun morsel to toss to you ravening beasts of international tension. :D</p>
<p>
[quote]
"nothing like a typical American" because I "know so much about the rest of the world" and I "enjoy talking about world events."
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I think many Americans (myself included to an extent) shy from international affairs discussions with non-Americans because the conversation usually turns to how awful the US is. It gets tiring.</p>
<p>qwilde,</p>
<p>1) i guess you don't know what pedantic means</p>
<p>2) if you read the article - or even the quote you cited,</p>
<p>"he would almost certainly rank higher on tests of general intelligence, which are normed with reference to the general population. But even if his rank remained constant at the 84th-percentile level of his SAT score, it would translate to an IQ score of 115."</p>
<p>you would deduce that the 84th percentile is a "worse case scenario" as the vast majority of the general populace wasn't taking the SATs, only people who were preparing for college. The author even acknowledges that Bush is better than the 84th percentile of the general populace when she says </p>
<p>"If Bush could score in the top 16 percent of college applicants on the SAT, he would almost certainly rank higher on tests of general intelligence."</p>
<p>Also, the author points out,</p>
<p>"With his MBA from Harvard Business School, it's not unreasonable to assume that Bush's IQ surpasses the 115 of the average bachelor's-degree-only college graduate."</p>
<p>...</p>
<p>the 2nd article you post doesn't say anything I consider scientific as he says he gets his data from "personality descriptions from biographical sources."</p>
<p>I doubt that person could accurately get John Quincy Adams' IQ any better than he could get Bush's. Regardless, he admits that Bush's IQ could be in his best estimate as high as 138.5, and he admits "Bush may be 'much smarter' than the findings imply."</p>
<p>regardless, I think going off a test he actually took that can be converted to a IQ score is a much better estimater than "personality descriptions from biographical sources."</p>
<p>For God's sake, there are only two things that need to be known about this video:
1) People are stupid.
2) Only a small sample of the population was shown in the video.</p>
<p>Not everybody's that stupid, only the few they decided to put in the video (in other words, whoever got questions wrong).</p>
<p>No need to take a video so seriously.</p>
<p>Okay, this may seem sad, but I did a micro-test of the population myself. Here are my results from the past few days (asking 10 questions):</p>
<p>At my school, GaTech, I asked 50 people the same or similar questions as the video
Caliber of population surveyed: Engineers, Scientists, Mathematicians, Scientists, Policy Honchos</p>
<p>Results:
100% of them answered at least half my questions correct.</p>
<p>92% got 6+ correct</p>
<p>80% got 7+ correct</p>
<p>72% got 8+ correct</p>
<p>64% got 9+ correct</p>
<p>And, 32% got all 10 correct.</p>
<p>Then, I went off campus into the streets of Atlanta to ask 100 people:
Caliber of population: Some white-collar professionals(college grads and masters holders), blue-collar workers(secondary diploma), teenagers (still being educated), 2 homeless people (both dropped out of school), 5 hispanic immigrants--some fluent in English, some not.</p>
<p>100% got 1+ questions correct.</p>
<p>95% got 2+ right</p>
<p>80% got 3+ right</p>
<p>67% got 4+ correct</p>
<p>53% got 5+ correct</p>
<p>47% got 6+ correct</p>
<p>40% got 7+ correct</p>
<p>34% got 8+ correct</p>
<p>20% got 9+ correct</p>
<p>8% got all 10 correct</p>
<p>The most missed question:
State with the highest per-household income; various answers such as California and Connecticut. Answer was New Jersey.</p>
<p>First population sample was slightly higher than expected at the high end, but result for 5+ category was expected.</p>
<p>Second population sample surprised me at the high end as well, being higher than expect at the 10-correct range. Low end was slightly higher than expected until 4th and 5th result.</p>
<p>Running, what were the other questions? Just curious.</p>